New to sailing - question about mast step plate base

[myerssl]

It looks like I"m going to be getting my hands on a 1984 Helms 24 in the next couple of weeks. Overall the boat looks like it is in pretty good conditioin but I've notices some cracking of the gelcoat around the mast step. Should this be a major concern and/or is it something that is relatively easy to fix? A picture of the mast step base is below.

 

[Roger (Ninette Manitoba)]

surface stress cracks

Those APPEAR to be just surface stress cracks. Check for any structural cracks under the mast step in the cabin. Likely all you would need to do here is expand each spider crack into a shallow V using a rotary tool, clean with acetone, let dry, then fill with a product called cptn tolly creeping crack repair. Sand to a smooth finish and replace the mast step.

If on the other hand the cracks are structural you will have to rebuild the area, but that is doubtful from the look of these cracks. They all emanate from the screw or bolt holes which tells me they are gelcoat stress cracks only.

 

[Rich (P303)]

It looks like I"m going to be getting my hands on a 1984 Helms 24 in the next couple of weeks. Overall the boat looks like it is in pretty good conditioin but I've notices some cracking of the gelcoat around the mast step. Should this be a major concern and/or is it something that is relatively easy to fix? A picture of the mast step base is below.

What does it look like below the step... from the other side. Not familiar with your boat... anything supporting the mast step from underneath?

 

[myerssl]

Re: surface stress cracks

Thanks for the info, I forgot to mention that I checked the cabin and there were no cracks below the mast step, (or other areas that I could see).

 

[sailingdog]

It looks like the gelcoat is cracking from stress due to the fastener holes. If the cabin top is not cored in that area and the compression post/bulkhead are in good shape, it is probably just cosmetic.

You do need to find out whether the deck is cored in that area, because if it is cored, the core material could be rotting and that could have caused the cracks. I'd also recommend inspecting the compression post or bulkhead, to see that it is in good shape.

Thick gelcoat will often crack, and the cracks will often start at holes drilled through it. If the cracks are just in the gelcoat and do not extend into the laminate, grind them out a bit and fill with thickened epoxy or MarineTex Epoxy Putty. If they do extend into the laminate, then you'll probably want to grind out the area and re-glass it a bit. If you have to do that, a couple extra layers of glass couldn't hurt IMHO.

I'd highly recommend you read the sticky thread I wrote about Boat Inspection Trip Tips.

 

[myerssl]

Not sure how to determine if the base is cored or not, but I do know that the area is built up quite a bit.

Also, in the cabin the everything looks fine, (bulkhead, compression post).

 

[Maine Sail]

The stress cracks radiate

The spider cracks appear to radiate from fastener holes. This is a prime example of why any hole drilled through gelcoat should be chamfered or eased slightly after the hole is drilled. Un-chamfered holes lead to crazing and cracking of the gelcoat. While it is possible the core is moist and the mast step is flexing it looks from the picture to be radiating spider cracks from improper drilling of the fastener holes not wet core. You should check for moisture though..

 

[Ross]

All drilled holes should be chamfered to get rid of the stress risers on the sharp edges. Steel and copper alloys and aluminum will all crack sooner at holes that are not chamfered than at chamfered holes.

 

[Fairwind]

Looks like water has gotten in the bolt holes and rotted the core in that area. That allowed the fiberglass to crush down, cracking the gelcoat. More holes can be drilled in the area, epoxy filler injected to restore the core material, and the gelcoat cracks repaired leaving the area better than new.

 

[myerssl]

Thanks guys for all of the input. Next weekend I'm going to start on this project, I'll let you know what I find.

 

[Roger Long]

Don't miss out on a good boat because of some cracks. Gel coat is a relatively thick layer of un-reinforced plastic on top of the structural glass. It cracks long, long, before the fiberglass structure is flexed enough to damage it. You should look carefully around cracking areas for other problems but you usually won't find any damage.

My deck, cabin, and cockpit are full of gel coat cracks but the glass underneath is sound. I was corresponding with someone who just passed up a fresh water boat of the same year and model as mine because he was concerned about cracks. That was a shame.

 

[BobM]

I'd break out a plastic handled screwdrive and tape the deck with the handle. If you get a thud there and sharp sounds elsewhere you may wish to drill a test hole to see if the core is wet. I should think you could also get an idea if it is cored by examining the existing holes. Bend a nail and dig around a little.

 

[Roger Long]

Looks like water has gotten in the bolt holes and rotted the core in that area. That allowed the fiberglass to crush down, cracking the gelcoat.

I would be very surprised to find that a builder had put core under a mast deck step unless it is a piece of plywood replacing the balsa or foam. Plywood could rot but that doesn't look a bit like core crushing to me. Plywood would likely swell long before it rotted and create even more damage.

Compression forces in this area are comparable to the weight of the boat so you can expect to see some signs of strain.

 

[CalebD]

MyersSL,
I agree with the previous posts - this is not a deal breaker or difficult to repair.
I do have a question regarding the tabernacle (mast foot plate that was attached to the deck) though. It was not in the photo but its outline is visible in your pic. Was it mounted a little out of true from the center line of the boat? If so, you may want to completely fill in the existing holes with epoxy (as described above) and re-drill and the holes for mounting the tabernacle on deck. The new holes could be countersunk (chamfered) and filled with epoxy to protect any core.

 

[myerssl]

Man I appreciate all of the input!!

CalebD, the tabernacle had a crack in it so I am going to have it re-welded, unless I can find a replacement, (don't even have a clue where to look).

As far as the boat is concerned, I should be signing the papers this week, (got it for $1250). The cabin, motor, sails, standing and running rigging are in good shape and the boat has never been in saltwater. So if I can fix this problem and put some bottom paint on it, I should be ready to go, (I say that now, let's see what happens when I get into the project.

I will check out the holes and if needed refilll with epoxy, then put a cover of gelcoat on. Once that is done, I'll make sure the holes are countersunk,

Thanks again for helping out the new kid!

 

[Scott T-Bird]

Look up Rig Rite on the internet.

You should try to identify the manufacturer of your mast. There may be a plate or sticker mounted right to it. The Rig Rite web page should help you identify the specific dimensions of the mast and there is a good chance that they will be able to match the tabernacle for your mast.

They have the most comprehensive selection of spars and spar parts that I am aware of.

 

[CalebD]

Hey MyersSL,
That sounds like a pretty good price if the engine is working. Good find.
Here is a link by member MaineSail that goes into minute detail on patching holes w/fiberglass: http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/sealing_the_deck
Check out all his projects - great pictures and explanations.
I asked about the tabernacle because it was not in the picture. Don't ask me how I know that these can be damaged if the mast comes down a little too quickly - so I am not surprised it needed repairing/welding.
The advice here is free but most of it is good so stick around.
Good luck and enjoy!