Thanks for everyones input on pushing me over the edge to go for a new main. Question: I have not sailed a boat with a loose foot. I would think one will need one hell-of-a-outhaul. A few comments as to pros and cons to the loose foot. Is it far superior?? Thanks, Chaos
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Great!!
You made the right choice. A loose footed main requires the same of an outhaul as does the shelf footed. In my estimation, most boats have an under powered outhaul. Because it is difficult to use an under powered adjustment, you tend not to want to use it. Therefore, upgrade it to a more appropriate control. I upgraded mine from a 2:1 to a 6:1. Makes a hell-of-difference. The loose foot will also make it easier to see the draft amount and location in the lower part of the sail. Lets hear from you after your first sail with it. Too many sailors hesitate at getting good sails and they don't realize how much their sailing will change with it.
You made the right choice. A loose footed main requires the same of an outhaul as does the shelf footed. In my estimation, most boats have an under powered outhaul. Because it is difficult to use an under powered adjustment, you tend not to want to use it. Therefore, upgrade it to a more appropriate control. I upgraded mine from a 2:1 to a 6:1. Makes a hell-of-difference. The loose foot will also make it easier to see the draft amount and location in the lower part of the sail. Lets hear from you after your first sail with it. Too many sailors hesitate at getting good sails and they don't realize how much their sailing will change with it.
We've always done it that way!
Alan, Is it a matter that we have always had shelf footed mains and just cannot get away from them? I can certainly see advantages, after thinking about it. There is several feet of the lower main that never sees the draft in the fore/aft direction in a shelf foot. That is more sail area not working. With the loose foot, the draft will go all the way to the foot edge. Great! Interesting, I will be taking a closer look this weekend, but I do not believe that there is one loose footed main at my marina. Thanks for the response. Chaos
Alan, Is it a matter that we have always had shelf footed mains and just cannot get away from them? I can certainly see advantages, after thinking about it. There is several feet of the lower main that never sees the draft in the fore/aft direction in a shelf foot. That is more sail area not working. With the loose foot, the draft will go all the way to the foot edge. Great! Interesting, I will be taking a closer look this weekend, but I do not believe that there is one loose footed main at my marina. Thanks for the response. Chaos
Loose Footed Main Adjustments
If you are interested in racing, sometimes the ease and speed of an adjustment makes a big difference; I feel that is a significant factor in using a loose footed main - it adjusts easier and faster because the friction of the bolt rope and shelf foot are eliminated and the shape in the lower portion is immediately obvious when trimming. I'd try to improve the purchase of any outhaul so that you can adjust it to full outhaul with wind in the sail. Earlier I mentioned geting two reefs insted of one. The loose footed configuration has nothing at all to do with that suggestion. I'm suggesting that a sailmaker giving you ONE reef would typically make it a significant reduction; while providing a first and second reef would allow you more flexibility -- maybe a shallower 1st reef and an even deeper 2nd reef. I have my boom set up for both reefs but the line is only run for the 1st reef. The line for the second reef is deadended on the side of the boom and would need to be run up to the second reef cringle and back down to the boom after the first reef was in use.
If you are interested in racing, sometimes the ease and speed of an adjustment makes a big difference; I feel that is a significant factor in using a loose footed main - it adjusts easier and faster because the friction of the bolt rope and shelf foot are eliminated and the shape in the lower portion is immediately obvious when trimming. I'd try to improve the purchase of any outhaul so that you can adjust it to full outhaul with wind in the sail. Earlier I mentioned geting two reefs insted of one. The loose footed configuration has nothing at all to do with that suggestion. I'm suggesting that a sailmaker giving you ONE reef would typically make it a significant reduction; while providing a first and second reef would allow you more flexibility -- maybe a shallower 1st reef and an even deeper 2nd reef. I have my boom set up for both reefs but the line is only run for the 1st reef. The line for the second reef is deadended on the side of the boom and would need to be run up to the second reef cringle and back down to the boom after the first reef was in use.
One mor equestion
Thanks to Alan and Sauer for your comments. Roger on the outhaul and the reef points. Next question: standard dacron or radial? Pros and cons? Chaos
Thanks to Alan and Sauer for your comments. Roger on the outhaul and the reef points. Next question: standard dacron or radial? Pros and cons? Chaos
Chaos
"standard dacron or radial" Standard dacron is a fabric, radial refers to the construction layout of whatever fabric the sail is made from. Dacron is a polyester based cloth. Kevlar is another type of cloth. Each can be made with a Mylar layer. Personally I prefer Kevlar because it is lighter, stronger, and stretches less. As the wind strength builds, Kevlar will hold its shape far better and through much wider a wind range than Dacron. Radial refers to the cloth panel layout. Cross-cut or slab layout uses large panels to induce a camber into the sail. Radial uses many smaller panels arranged like the spokes of a wheel to spread the load better and allow for better shaping of the sail. Tri-radial refers to this arrangement at all three corners of the sail for optimal shape and strength. Kevlar cloth and radial construction cost more but the shape and performance of the sail is far superior...my choice.
"standard dacron or radial" Standard dacron is a fabric, radial refers to the construction layout of whatever fabric the sail is made from. Dacron is a polyester based cloth. Kevlar is another type of cloth. Each can be made with a Mylar layer. Personally I prefer Kevlar because it is lighter, stronger, and stretches less. As the wind strength builds, Kevlar will hold its shape far better and through much wider a wind range than Dacron. Radial refers to the cloth panel layout. Cross-cut or slab layout uses large panels to induce a camber into the sail. Radial uses many smaller panels arranged like the spokes of a wheel to spread the load better and allow for better shaping of the sail. Tri-radial refers to this arrangement at all three corners of the sail for optimal shape and strength. Kevlar cloth and radial construction cost more but the shape and performance of the sail is far superior...my choice.
durability
Alan, I certainly appreciate the input. How does the Kevlar, radial cut hold up with time? Many years of service? (Sorry, I worded my last question a bit off. Do understand the radial cut, etc.) Is tri-radial the best? Thanks again. Chaos
Alan, I certainly appreciate the input. How does the Kevlar, radial cut hold up with time? Many years of service? (Sorry, I worded my last question a bit off. Do understand the radial cut, etc.) Is tri-radial the best? Thanks again. Chaos
Chaos
My Kevlar main has lasted 10 years now. It is admittedly not in the same shape as is was when new. It still has a better shape than a dacron sail of say 2 years. The down side of Kevlar is that it doesn't take well to crumpling. The Kevlar strands will break down over time with repeated folding back and forth. The ideal treatment for all these fabrics is to roll them so they never bend. However, I have been flaking my main its entire life and we race it hard twice a week all season long. The Kevlar strands show no signs of breakdown to this point. When the sail is tied to the boom the sail ties are applied with minimal force so as not to crumple the fabric. As for radial design, yes I think the tri-radial design is by far the best approach. It spreads the load more appropriately and shapes the sail for max efficiency.
My Kevlar main has lasted 10 years now. It is admittedly not in the same shape as is was when new. It still has a better shape than a dacron sail of say 2 years. The down side of Kevlar is that it doesn't take well to crumpling. The Kevlar strands will break down over time with repeated folding back and forth. The ideal treatment for all these fabrics is to roll them so they never bend. However, I have been flaking my main its entire life and we race it hard twice a week all season long. The Kevlar strands show no signs of breakdown to this point. When the sail is tied to the boom the sail ties are applied with minimal force so as not to crumple the fabric. As for radial design, yes I think the tri-radial design is by far the best approach. It spreads the load more appropriately and shapes the sail for max efficiency.
mains
Alan, Thanks again. Appreciate all the input from you and Sauer. Alan, you sure got them stirred up in the sail trim site!!Go for it!!! Chaos
Alan, Thanks again. Appreciate all the input from you and Sauer. Alan, you sure got them stirred up in the sail trim site!!Go for it!!! Chaos
Chaos
No problem, if you don't ask, how are you supposed to learn? Well as far a Sail Trim goes everyone is entitled to their opinion. I have a good deal of racing experience and I don't mind sharing. Some don't like what I have to say and thats OK too.
No problem, if you don't ask, how are you supposed to learn? Well as far a Sail Trim goes everyone is entitled to their opinion. I have a good deal of racing experience and I don't mind sharing. Some don't like what I have to say and thats OK too.
where and how much for a racing main?
Where and how much for a racing main? I have been racing Merit 25, Santana 525, Buccaneer 18's for a while, now getting the family involved required more creature comforts. Thanks Mike H26 "Hunter.."
Where and how much for a racing main? I have been racing Merit 25, Santana 525, Buccaneer 18's for a while, now getting the family involved required more creature comforts. Thanks Mike H26 "Hunter.."
Sails
Mike, Porpoise Sails quoted me about 750.00 for a radial dacron main. His new sails are made off shore, some Aussy with a plant in Thialand. The Aussy checks out OK from what I can find out, and Porpoise treated me fair on a used genoa last spring. Good luck; hope you enjoy your 26. Chaos.
Mike, Porpoise Sails quoted me about 750.00 for a radial dacron main. His new sails are made off shore, some Aussy with a plant in Thialand. The Aussy checks out OK from what I can find out, and Porpoise treated me fair on a used genoa last spring. Good luck; hope you enjoy your 26. Chaos.
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