Looking for commentary on buying a new small frame alternator. My perkins 4.154 is limited to 100 amps capability.
Also need a new multi stage regulator
Also need a new multi stage regulator
new alternator
- Thread starter gettinthere
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Forget the new alternator and look at installing a three stage external regulator. I installed a Balmar ARS-5 last year and my electrical shortfalls are a thing of the past.
Or in other words, the alternator wasn't doing squat until the new regulator put it to work.
Or in other words, the alternator wasn't doing squat until the new regulator put it to work.
Already have a faulty ars 5
I did ask for advice on regulators as well as alternators
I take it you think a smoking alternator is OK to keep using?
I did ask for advice on regulators as well as alternators
I take it you think a smoking alternator is OK to keep using?
I have an Arco 105 amp unit on my old Westerbeke with an internal regulator that could be disconnected and external regulator hooked up
here's a link to Arco marine....go to page 56
http://www.arcomarine.com/xhtml/Pages 52-59 Alternators.pdf
here's a link to Arco marine....go to page 56
http://www.arcomarine.com/xhtml/Pages 52-59 Alternators.pdf
If the regulator is bad that may be making the alternator smoke.
We really need more info to diagnose this and make good recommendations.
Was it the belt smoking or the alternator wiring?
What kinds of voltage is it putting out when running after you discharge the batteries?
how do you know the regulator is shot?
What does the smoke smell like? diodes, wires insulation, and belts all smell different.
We really need more info to diagnose this and make good recommendations.
Was it the belt smoking or the alternator wiring?
What kinds of voltage is it putting out when running after you discharge the batteries?
how do you know the regulator is shot?
What does the smoke smell like? diodes, wires insulation, and belts all smell different.
Go with the small frame Balmar and smart regulator. Remember you might have to upgrade the wiring. I have had one Balmar regulator fail over the years. It failed in the second year. No problems with the alternators. Also had a AmplePower setup with a Powerline alternator. Both failed over the years. rebuilt the Powerline many times. The Balmar set-up is easy and available anywhere.
Thanks for the answer Rick, failures with amplepower eh?
The ars5 likely has an internal crack according to balmar
The balmar alt works fine but is only a 70 amp
I had a 100 amp custom made. The bearings are squealing now. I may have this one rebuilt but am considering fresh new
Anyone have a good specific recommendation for a rebuild shop in Annapolis?
The ars5 likely has an internal crack according to balmar
The balmar alt works fine but is only a 70 amp
I had a 100 amp custom made. The bearings are squealing now. I may have this one rebuilt but am considering fresh new
Anyone have a good specific recommendation for a rebuild shop in Annapolis?
We really need to know more..
What size bank
What type of bank - wet, agm, gel?
How is it currently wired
How is the air temp in the engine bay
Are you using alternator or battery temp compensation
What size is your current belt
What is the pulley ratio
How much belt wrap do you have over the pulley
Going bigger with the alt and programming a regulator for less field will result in longer life as it will run cooler into a smaller load.
The "load" limiting for the belt & alt can be programmed with a Balmar MC-614 regulator. I will regularly install alts over 100A such as a 120A, 140A, 160A etc., even on small engines with 3/8" or 1/2" belts, then limit them in belt manager to the 80A or 100A that the belt can handle.. They run cooler, last longer and work less hard than an alt rated at 100A and trying to deliver 100A.... When you get ready to pony up for a serpentine kit upgrade you'll already have an alt big enough to handle the loads that a serpentine kit can handle.
The Perkins can handle a lot more than 100A but you will need either a dual pulley kit or preferably a serpentine pulley kit. A serpentine pulley kit is worth it weight in gold. They drive more HP at a lower overall belt tension thus applying less side loading to the bearings. Westerbeke/Universal suggest that their engines can handle alts up to 190A! The old Perkins is a beefy industrial engine and is more heavily built IMHO than the current Japanese engines are.
I find that the newer dual internal fan 130D case style alts from Balmar and Electromaax run cooler than the older Delco 10DN style alts from companies like Ample, Ham Ferris or older Balmar's. I actually offer the same alt, from the same builder to my own customers, that "A Power" does. It is a great alt at a reasonable price but I feel the newer Electromaax and Balmar alts, based on the Delco 130D case, run cooler and are often easier to fit on tight engines...
There is no secret sauce in any alternator it is all about the components used. Cheap bearings are cheap bearings. Electromaax for example oversizes these bearings by about 15% compared to stock and Balmar does as well. Electromaax also sources top quality high temp/high load bearings made by Nachi. Nachi is a main supplier to companies such as Toyota and Honda Motor Co. and are a true premium bearing costing 3-4 times what a cheap bearing found in a Pep Boy's quality alternator would be.. Machine windings don't cool as well as hand wound windings do etc. etc.. Also what temp is the alt "hot rated" at that you are buying? Many rate them at 200F or less as the "hot" rating. Electromaax rates hot at 250F and Balmar rates them at 225F as the hot rating.... Balmar & Electromaax cast their own cases and use premium components same as my builder. The next step down in small case gets you into less beefy units & lower quality components that won't handle the loads as well but that can work if managed appropriately.
The reality is that the regulator makes little difference in the "charge faster performance" if all else is equal. Where the perceived or actual differences often come from is the accuracy from voltage sensing the battery and not the back of the alternator.
Bulk is bulk with dumb or smart regulators. All this means is that the alt is pumping out is max capability or the max the batteries will accept. Absorption is simply voltage limiting and 14.4V is 14.4V is 14.4V smart or dumb. The benefit of float on a VR is debatable on trawlers but pretty darn useless on sailboats unless you treat your boat like a trawler with a stick..
Where external regulators shine is with AGM or GEL batteries and the ability to "tune them" and to have accurate voltage sensing and temp sensing.
As to which regulator I still prefer the Balmar MC-612 or MC-614. I have worked on and installed just about every brand and hands down I prefer the MC-6XX over all of them. Even when I install an Electromaax alt and pulley kit I still choose Balmar regs.
External regs can and do fail. They should be kept out of the engine space or areas that can exceed 130-140F. I just did one three weeks ago that cooked in an engine bay. Moved it to under the galley sink where it is 50F cooler with the engine running.
I would strongly urge you to consider a serpentine pulley kit. The Electromaax serpentine kits are beautiful, easy to install and can drive an alt to 200A.
Electromaax Serpentine Kit For Perkins 4-108
The 140A and 160A alts are also excellent and easy to install. I like the 140 particularly for it's abilities at low RPM..
Both Balmar and Electromaax make excellent alternators as does Ample or Ham Ferris or the ones that I offer to my customers on a custom order basis. I still think the Electromaax kit makes the most sense for a Perkins at this point in time, if they have a kit for the 4-154 which they may..... Call John or Rob and see if they have a kit yet for the 4-154. Even if they don't have a kit they will make them custom for you but you do need to be patient.
For more on these kits feel free to read this:
Installing An Electromaax Alternator and Serpentine Pulley Kit
I'm interested in a good multi stage regulator too.. any help would be appreciated.
I have a Yanmar 4JH4E diesel with 3 group 4D AGM house batteries for a total bank of 600 amp. I am considering upgrading to a Balmar 6 series kit such as the 60-VP-MC-150-SR KIT since after a few hours of motoring it takes a few hours of shorepower to recharge my bank (load is only fridge, freezer, chartplotter, depth, knot, VHF and auto pilot). Is this a good idea and how do I deal with the two pulleys on the Balmar?
Thanks!
Thanks!
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