Need help: Mold in Toilet

[anupghosh]

Hi,

Since I launched the boat this spring, I hadn't gone into the head. Unfortunately a guest of ours had to use the head yesterday while out on the water and nearly vomited. The toilet had filled up with a pile of mold. I suppose I should have paid more attention. I tried flushing the mold down, and most of the dissolved mold did flush into the waste water tank, but the pile of mold stayed on top.

Need help! How do I get rid of this mold? Is there something I can flush down the toilet to treat the mold in the tank? Perhaps unrelated, I noticed the waste water pump out cap does not screw all the way in now since it came back from the winter. Perhaps rusted? Not sure.

Your advice is appreciated.

thanks!

Anup

 

[dlochner]

The toilet bowl should be always be dry except when being used. The question is how is liquid entering the bowl when it is not needed.

When was the last time the joker valve was changed? This valve keeps stuff that is pumped out of the bowl out of the bowl, it prevents back filling. Depending on use, they should be changed frequently at least every year or two.

Did you use antifreeze in the head when winterizing? Antifreeze is propylene glycol which is chemically related to sugar and is great mold and microorganism food. If the head was not cleared completely there was likely some AF in the lines which feed the mold. A weak or worn joker valve will allow the liquid to flow back into the bowl creating a nice primordial soup.

Is there a vented loop between the bowl and the water intake pump? The purpose of this loop is to prevent water from entering the bowl through the sea water pump when the boat is heeled and the sea cock left open.

My guess is you need to clean the toilet and replace he joker valve to solve the problem. It may also be time change the hoses.

 

[kloudie1]

Sometimes, the mess comes from stuff that has fermented in the raw water line to the toilet .. The bowl might have been clear until the water from the hose (that had critters dead and fermenting in it from last time it was flushed) got pumped into the toilet carrying with it the stinky nastiness.. You should be able to clear the mess out by flushing more if that is the case. My boat was in a marina for a while that had a lot of organic material in the water (ducks and geese) and after the toilet sat unflushed for a week or so, the first flush rought in water from the hose that smelled bad enough to curl your eyebrows.. Continued flushing cleared it out.

 

[jssailem]

I must be a real outlier.

If I saw a mass of mold sitting in the head, rather then try and flush it away, so it can further grow in the Black water tank or foul my sewer system, I would put on a pair of gloves, grab a plastic bag, reach in and excise the offending mass. Pop it in the plastic bag, and discard the offender in the nearest rubbish bin.

Then I would make sure the sewer system on the boat was fully functional. As needed, clean or replace hoses, joker valve etc.

But that is just me.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

I thought I'd seen it all in 35 years of solving boat owners sanitation problems, but this a new one for me.
And for the first--and likely ONLY--time I'm gonna recommend bleach in the sanitation system using a version of the same method I describe in my "Recommission the Freshwater System" in the Plumbing and Sanitation forum.

Just flushing something down the toilet won't solve this problem. Instead, first drain the bowl and clean it using John's advice. Then put at least a quart--even two quarts- of bleach in a bucket of clean FRESH water. Close the intake seacock, remove the intake line from the thru-hull and stick it in the bucket. Pump the entire bucketful all the way through the system into the tank. Give it at least an hour, but no longer than 4 hours, to kill all the mold, then follow with at least TWO bucketfuls of clean FRESH water. Pump out and thoroughly rinse out the tank. Repeat if that hasn't done it...but only ONCE!

I suspect the mold spores may be in the water the boat has spent some time in, then allowed to sit for a while. To prevent this problem from occurring again when the boat sits for even a week, re-route your head intake line to tee into you head SINK drain line below the waterline as close to the thru-hull as possible. This will allow you to flush normally using sea water, but it also provides a safe way to use your fresh water to rinse it out of the entire system. Last thing before leaving the boat to sit, after you've closed all the seacocks, fill the sink with clean water...flush the toilet. Because the seacock is closed the toilet will pull the water out of the sink, rinsing the sea water out of the entire system--intake line, pump, channel in the rim of the bowl AND the toilet discharge line.

Do NOT decide to add even a little bleach to the sink water. A single shock treatment won't remain in the system long enough to do any damage, but used over time, even a little bleach will damage all the rubber parts in the toilet and damage the hoses.

--Peggie

 

[capta]

My wife has found white vinegar to work better on surface mold than bleach. Perhaps that might be a better bet than the bleach, but Peggy really is the head mistress, so she's probably right.
What I'd be concerned about is that stuff in other damp dark places like the bilge.
When we hauled Skipping Stone we usually left a porthole open in the head. If it rained the floor had a drain to the sump. Good luck with the clean up.

 

[dlochner]

My wife has found white vinegar to work better on surface mold than bleach.

The problem with using vinegar to clean mold and mildew is that it is mold and mildew food. Think about it, unfiltered vinegar has "mother" in the bottom of the bottle. What is "mother"? It's a mold that grows in organic liquids like wine and vinegar.

 

[JamesG161]

The problem with using vinegar to clean mold and mildew is that it is mold and mildew food.

Sorry not true.

We use Vinegar to make Pickles, not this medicinal Vinegar with the dead yeast [ the mother] in bottom.

Thus @capta is correct.

Jim...

 

[Tally Ho]

I clean a lot of stuff with white vinegar…I hope there isn’t mold in it

Greg

 

[dlochner]

Sorry not true.

We use Vinegar to make Pickles, not this medicinal Vinegar with the dead yeast [ the mother] in bottom.

Thus @capta is correct.

Jim...

I clean a lot of stuff with white vinegar…I hope there isn’t mold in it

Greg

The Acetic acid in vinegar will kill off mold, mildew, and other fungi. No argument there. The problem with using vinegar on a boat, on uneven surfaces, and wood is the residue from the vinegar. The molds, yeasts, and mildew spores that are ever present will eventually land on the surface and feast on the residue. If vinegar is used on a hard smooth surface and thoroughly rinsed with freshwater to remove all the residue, then vinegar will work fine. However, it is much more difficult to remove the residue from uneven surfaces, like textured fiberglass or wood than a smooth hard countertop. How many who use vinegar go to the trouble to thoroughly rinse the surface to remove the residue?

As for pickles, there are generally 2 types, hot pack and cold pack. In hot pack heat and acetic acid (vinegar) kill the offending fungi. In cold pack cold and acetic vinegar retard the growth of those little devils.

 

[jssailem]

The problem with using vinegar on a boat, on uneven surfaces, and wood is the residue from the vinegar. The molds, yeasts, and mildew spores that are ever present will eventually land on the surface and feast on the residue.

I am confused... Distilled White Vinegar is a clear solution generally containing 4–7% acetic acid and 93–96% water (1Trusted Source). It is made from the fermentation of grain alcohol (ethanol). It's cleaning (mold killing) properties result from changing the PH of the surface. Mold is affected by this PH change. Now it is true not all species of mold are so affected. .

Residue... not from the vinegar, it is from unkillled mold spores or the affect the acetic acid has on the wood cells.

Advice regarding the use of vinegar is to limit use to no porous surfaces. Rinse with fresh water. Wood is a porous surface so not a good use of vinegar.

These same folk caution NEVER USE vinegar with BLEACH or Hydrogen Peroxide

Limit use to Distilled White Vinegar for cleaning. Rinse with fresh water. Reduce moisture in the area. Save the Wine, Apple Cider, and Balsamic Vinegars for cooking.

 

[JamesG161]

You can make Wine from anything containing Sugars, including Dandelions.

If Oxygen is allowed into the Fermenting Wine, you make Vinegar.

Apple Cider Vinegar has been shown to help medicinally, when not distilled or filtered.
The Mother contains many things, but mainly the dead yeast from fermentation.

One caution is Apple seeds contain Arsenic, so make sure your bottle maker did not crush the seeds when crushing the Apples.
_______

This is what Vinegar 5%, we use to make our garden grown pickles, that are very crispy too.



Best home made pickles for miles around.


_____
So in closing, 5% Vinegar is a good mold cleaner, like Capta's wife does.

Jim...

 

[anupghosh]

I must be a real outlier.

If I saw a mass of mold sitting in the head, rather then try and flush it away, so it can further grow in the Black water tank or foul my sewer system, I would put on a pair of gloves, grab a plastic bag, reach in and excise the offending mass. Pop it in the plastic bag, and discard the offender in the nearest rubbish bin.

Then I would make sure the sewer system on the boat was fully functional. As needed, clean or replace hoses, joker valve etc.

But that is just me.

Yes I pulled the mold out by hand and cleaned it. Added a diluted bleach solution then flushed it down with fresh water. But the joker valve seems shot and some other hoses need replacing it seems.

Thanks for all the advice on this forum!

Anup

 

[jssailem]

Not sure how old your boat is, but most boat systems are a consumable that needs to be replaced... occasionally.

The hoses and joker valve have a limited life. I believe @Peggie Hall HeadMistress recommends annual replcement for the joker valve. Hoses live a bit longer.

The better hoses last the longest and cost the most. The duty they must carry is worth the extra expense.

Sani/Flex Odor Shield Marine Hose | Raritan Engineering

Raritans Sani/Flex Odor Shield sanitation marine hoses are designed especially for marine toilet and holding tank plumbing and comes with a 10 year warranty.

www.raritaneng.com

 

[anupghosh]

Not sure how old your boat is, but most boat systems are a consumable that needs to be replaced... occasionally.

The hoses and joker valve have a limited life. I believe @Peggie Hall HeadMistress recommends annual replcement for the joker valve. Hoses live a bit longer.

The better hoses last the longest and cost the most. The duty they must carry is worth the extra expense.

Sani/Flex Odor Shield Marine Hose | Raritan Engineering

Raritans Sani/Flex Odor Shield sanitation marine hoses are designed especially for marine toilet and holding tank plumbing and comes with a 10 year warranty.

www.raritaneng.com

Good to know- thanks!