My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help.

Status
Not open for further replies.
MrBill_FLL

MrBill_FLL

.
May 4, 2005
4,062
Macgregor 26d Ft Lauderdale, Fl
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

on the trailer is a whole 'nother thing... if you still have the old steel trailer, most move the axle back 12" to get enough tongue weight on the ball of the truck hitch.

(when you get on the boat from the stern the trailer wants to lift up)

otherwise, you should pull the ob engine to tow... you don't want to jackknife a trailer!!

---
Thanks Scott, So a little better than half the weight dry. (70/120 dry = .58)

I'm thinking when I made cement in a 5 gal bucket, its 4/5 full, and figured that's around a cubic foot... but you say its about half... I'll take your word for it!
 
Scott T-Bird

Scott T-Bird

.
Oct 26, 2008
6,238
Catalina 320 Barnegat, NJ
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

Back in the old days, we had to remember conversions so that you didn't have to carry around books that had them printed. Now with google, it's just too easy ...

Ok, another figure that is ingrained ... 1 cubic foot equals 7.48 US gallons.

So your 4 gallons (4/5 of a 5 gallon bucket) of concrete (not cement ... sheesh) is 0.53 cubic feet (4 divided by 7.48 = 0.53). That's about 1/2, right?

According to the manufacturers of 60 pound bags of sacrete, the concrete that is produced is just 0.45 cf. I always used to estimate that it takes 3 bags for a cf so I guess I was usually overproducing concrete and having left-overs.

I'm guessing that when you mixed the sacrete in a bucket and add water, you are plumping it up so it looks like 4 gallons in the bucket, but by the time it is set in place and cured, it really only is a little more than 3 gallons in place.
 
r.oril

r.oril

.
Oct 29, 2008
586
MacGregor 26D and Catalina 30 26 - 30 Lancaster, CA
Very Interesting

Interesting reading.....Never would have though of adding weight inside the ballast tank and then doing the math...... Thinking more weight, slower boat speed??

Interesting reading. Thanks!
 
finding41

finding41

.
Nov 23, 2011
2,023
MacGregor 26D London Ontario Canada
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

I bet who ever put the cement there didn't do the math first. Thats allot of work for little result. I dont know how it will sail or if there will be any noticable difference. Maybe it will dampen the water noise??? (I haven't even got it wet. The closest to water I have had it has been power washing it and vacuuming it out after the rain, each rain..) Butyl soon. Sailing soon!
Here is a question. Why not put the cement in to the dagger board? It would get the weight down lower. Is lower better? Like the boats with led bulb keels. I'm just thinking of the Volvo race photos I saw earlier this year.
 
MrBill_FLL

MrBill_FLL

.
May 4, 2005
4,062
Macgregor 26d Ft Lauderdale, Fl
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

daggerboard is not strong enough to hold the weight.

but if you build a new frame, you could do that.

on the new M model the factory build a 'one off' custom boat with a bulb. think it was 40#.

over all its a very small advantage.
but if you are racing, 5 seconds a mile can be huge.
 
higgs

higgs

.
Aug 24, 2005
3,704
Nassau 34 Olcott, NY
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

Go for a few sails and then decide.
 
finding41

finding41

.
Nov 23, 2011
2,023
MacGregor 26D London Ontario Canada
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

Higgs is right. I have to get this thing in the water. I'm patching the ballast tomorrow aft. then re-bed hardware with butyl.
 
D

doehunter

.
Sep 26, 2010
808
Macgregor 1993 26S Houston
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

When I bought my 26S, I found 2 big bags of pea gravelly looking stuff under the V berth.
I guess the PO was looking for a similar effect. On the other hand, he didn't have any batteries installed in the boat. Well, I took the bags out and put one of my batteries up there and the other under the galley. Soon I will probably put both under the V berth.
If I gotta have extra weight in the boat, it might as well be useful!
 
RobertLangdirect

RobertLangdirect

.
Apr 22, 2009
342
Pearson P-31 Quantico
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

Mod the boat and tell the PRHF people you did the mod -- not a problem. Don't tell and no one sees it or ask, well, that's between you and your maker. Let others know (or find out) that finish kust behind you and prepare for the protest.
 
kenn

kenn

.
Apr 18, 2009
1,271
CL Sandpiper 565 Toronto
r.oril said:
.... Thinking more weight, slower boat speed??
Click to expand
In alot of small boats, weight forward adds waterline length (speed increase) and maybe less banging when fighting into waves, which might also translate to speed.
 
finding41

finding41

.
Nov 23, 2011
2,023
MacGregor 26D London Ontario Canada
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

I patched the hole today. 3 layers of thick roving today and I might put one more fine cloth on next to clean it up. I'm going to be painting in there so if its strong and smooth enough I'll get painting.
If I ever race I have decided to let who ever know about the extra weight but don't actually know how much is there myself. (I'm going to say about 75#.)
How does more water line length translate into more speed? It would mean more drag, right? I get the idea of more weight below keeping the boat from heeling more. But not the idea of pushing more of anything through the water (more water line=more hull) and it being faster than less of anything.
 
M

mitiempo

.
Sep 28, 2008
922
Canadian Sailcraft CS27 Victoria B.C.
Displacement hull speed is relative to the waterline length. The formula is 1.34 x the square root of the waterline length.
The longer the waterline the faster the boat.
 
C

Crazy Dave Condon

.
Jun 8, 2004
10,373
-na -NA Anywhere USA
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

Over the years working on many different sailboats, once in a while wieght is added to the front. What was mentioned about the water line being longer is very true but in most cases, it was due to manufacturing of that boat.

In a controled environment at the manufacturer, it has been determined what the amount of fiberglass should be and where it is to be applied. It could also be in the design vs. supposed waterline.

Without naming manufacturers, let me explain. I saw tires on a trailer whiched looked very low; yet the tires were fully inflated. I took the boat to a truck wiegh scale and weighed the truck and trailer seperately and then weighed all with the boat on the trailer. It was determined that double fiberglass was used in the construciton. That manufacturer resolved that case quickly by giving the owner a new boat weighing correctly.

I have drilled holes in hulls to determine thickness and then was told it should not have been thick in certain areas. On a 31 footer, I added lead weights to correct the water line due to mfg placing the glass in the wrong place. I have seen the water line markings in the wrong place. There are many other situiations seen over the years. It really depends on the boat.

Yet I have seen some add so much weight to the boat that it actually adversely affected the performance but when removing that wieght, performance improved.

But the same can be said for adding wieght to improve performance.

crazy dave condon
 
finding41

finding41

.
Nov 23, 2011
2,023
MacGregor 26D London Ontario Canada
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

The Hole is closed! I did it yesterday and checked things today. Nice finish to the matting so I vacuumed and wiped it down ready for primer then paint.
I took off the mast and popped the top to remove the lifeline posts that are right there. Re-bedded with butyl tape. I was kind of surprised at the state of the old calking. Still flexible but kind of flaky/ chalky. I in my contracting haven't come across a product like it in terms of how it ends its useable life. At least in any home applications of calk or sealant.
 
higgs

higgs

.
Aug 24, 2005
3,704
Nassau 34 Olcott, NY
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

Time to go sailing.
 
willardj

willardj

.
Nov 30, 2011
31
MacGregor 25 Savannah
Re: My MacGregor 26D has a ferro-cement ballast. Please Help

So would a M25 be faster than the M26? Or would the extra foot on the M26 make up for the weight of the M25?
 
Sumner

Sumner

.
Jan 31, 2009
5,254
Macgregor & Endeavour 26S and 37 Utah's Canyon Country
willardj said:
So would a M25 be faster than the M26? Or would the extra foot on the M26 make up for the weight of the M25?
Click to expand
Here are som PHRF ratings I found (lower number being faster)...

Boat......................... fastest...........slowest.......average
MACGREGOR 25 .............225............. 246............ 231
MACGREGOR 25 MH .......218.............. 237............ 228
MACGREGOR 26S ...........210.............. 258 ............222
MACGREGOR 26 DB ........210.............. 219 ............213
MACGREGOR 26 X ..........216 ..............273............ 228

They are all fairly close and not slow boats compared with other boats the same length. The ones with the better sails and captain are probably going to win and Ruth and I would just watch them all go by :cry:,

Sum

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]============================[/FONT]

Our Endeavour 37

Our MacGregor 26-S Pages

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Mac-Venture Links
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top Bottom