Missing Atlantic sailors

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RichH

RichH

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Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
Better possible explanation .....

There were ferocious easterly winds blowing the boat closer to the outter banks, wind pushing the counter current thats on the outer margin of the shoals/banks and the gulfstream closer to the banks .... and the boat simply wound up on the Diamond Shoals ... simply pushed and sucked there by the current and countercurrent and the wind/waves. If you've ever seen what the Diamond Shoals off of Hatteras looks like in a NE blow ... just a foaming cauldron, then thats probably the answer of why the EPIRB shut down so fast and the boat was never seen again. Those shoals off Hatteras are the Graveyard of the Atlantic because so many ships got 'sucked' onto them.
 
RichH

RichH

.
Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
Better possible explanation .....

There were ferocious easterly winds blowing the boat closer to the outter banks, wind pushing the counter current thats on the outer margin of the shoals/banks and the gulfstream closer to the banks .... and the boat simply wound up on the Diamond Shoals ... simply pushed and sucked there by the current and countercurrent and the wind/waves. If you've ever seen what the Diamond Shoals off of Hatteras looks like in a NE blow ... just a foaming cauldron, then thats probably the answer of why the EPIRB shut down so fast and the boat was never seen again. Those shoals off Hatteras are the Graveyard of the Atlantic because so many ships got 'sucked' onto them.
 
Ross in Tampa

Ross in Tampa

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Jan 11, 2007
294
Columbia 28 Sarasota
my spin on things...

I have never been in seas like that. (knock on wood). But I find it hard to believe that if they were sunk, or struck or any other type of mishap, there would have been some kind of sign. Debris, oil slick or what have you. I could see how they could have gotten dis-masted, and lost radio communications and are drifting. But I have to imagine that this scenario is something the Coast Guard has already put into action. I had even considered foul play, piracy or similar. But, with the weather conditions, pirates are crazy, but not stupid. So I had quickly dismissed that theory. I don't have an EPIRB for my little boat, but aren't they supposed to stay on longer than a couple of hours? Was it shut off, did the batteries die, did it sink? Who knows. This was an experience delivery captain, I have to think that his EPIRB would be in operational order. I pray that they are ok, but with every day, that light becomes a bit dimmer.
 
Ross in Tampa

Ross in Tampa

.
Jan 11, 2007
294
Columbia 28 Sarasota
my spin on things...

I have never been in seas like that. (knock on wood). But I find it hard to believe that if they were sunk, or struck or any other type of mishap, there would have been some kind of sign. Debris, oil slick or what have you. I could see how they could have gotten dis-masted, and lost radio communications and are drifting. But I have to imagine that this scenario is something the Coast Guard has already put into action. I had even considered foul play, piracy or similar. But, with the weather conditions, pirates are crazy, but not stupid. So I had quickly dismissed that theory. I don't have an EPIRB for my little boat, but aren't they supposed to stay on longer than a couple of hours? Was it shut off, did the batteries die, did it sink? Who knows. This was an experience delivery captain, I have to think that his EPIRB would be in operational order. I pray that they are ok, but with every day, that light becomes a bit dimmer.
 
RichH

RichH

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Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
You make a good point about the epirb ... but

if the Epirb was sent overboard, if they got in to shoal area with monsterously high seas, the amount of air mixed with the water as characteristically happens on the Diamond Shoals in storm conditions, ... such water/air mixture conditions would have probably not had the bouyancy to float ***anything***. Thats why I hypothesize that they probably got into the area of those shoals. You have to see them in storm conditions to believe this .... its simply a 'foam cauldron'. Nothing can float much in 'foam'.
 
RichH

RichH

.
Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
You make a good point about the epirb ... but

if the Epirb was sent overboard, if they got in to shoal area with monsterously high seas, the amount of air mixed with the water as characteristically happens on the Diamond Shoals in storm conditions, ... such water/air mixture conditions would have probably not had the bouyancy to float ***anything***. Thats why I hypothesize that they probably got into the area of those shoals. You have to see them in storm conditions to believe this .... its simply a 'foam cauldron'. Nothing can float much in 'foam'.
 
C

CharlieCobra

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May 5, 2006
1,140
Knutson K-35 Yawl Bellingham
Hitting or being hit by one of those loose

containers as it was thrown by a breaking wave would completely destroy the yacht as well.
 
C

CharlieCobra

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May 5, 2006
1,140
Knutson K-35 Yawl Bellingham
Hitting or being hit by one of those loose

containers as it was thrown by a breaking wave would completely destroy the yacht as well.
 
D

Dave Deakyne

Just my 2 cents

The Crew - 2 experienced crewmembers are plenty. The Boat - Plenty strong to survive. Roller furl Main and Jib - No reason to not have been hove to with full reefs sail or laying a hull w/ bare poles. The Weather - Bad - 60 +/- kts NE against the flow of the Gulf Stream would have made the waves look like like crumbling mountains. We came around Hatteras 2 days prior at the beginning of the Noreaster that turned into T.S. Andrea. We had only 35 kt gusts and seas built to steep faced 10 feet but had 70' periods and were from the NE mostly but lots of disorganization. Plenty were from the SE also slamming us broadside. We beat around Hatteras for 5 hours until out of the Gulf Stream where the water temp dropped from 85 in the stream to 55. That is where the waves became less steep and more organized. My take is that the crew of "Flying Colors" were trying to get to Beaufort to go up the ICW. They had heaved to and were rolling pretty good during the night. At 3:30, they got slammed good, possibly rolled, and then ended up holed by a broken hatch, loose object (stove off gimbles, etc). They don't have an SSB so they set off the EPIRB and tried to save the vessel, bail and repair until 7AM when they couldn't keep up with the water coming in and went down with the EPIRB secured to the boat. My only question is why didn't they make it into the liferaft.
 
sailortonyb Allied Mis

sailortonyb Allied Mis

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Jun 12, 2004
1,181
Allied Mistress 39 Ketch Kemah,Tx.
Out of Control

Two bad assumptions: The Crew - 2 experienced crewmembers are plenty. A very large boat has very large rigging and everything is super heavy compared to what most of us deal with. Also we dont know if one or both didnt get injured or washed overboard....or seasick to the point of being debilitating. As for the boat being plenty strong to survive, just because it was that way when new, doesnt mean that it remained that way and as for 50 ft waves, far better vessels have been sunk in these conditions. Survival of a vessel in these conditions is sometimes a matter of dumb luck more than anything else. When weather gets that bad, its a combination of events that usually cause a ship to sink. I have never sailed in anything like that, but I was caught in 25 to 30 foot waves in a winter storm on a 120 foot steel hulled small supply boat in the Gulf of Mexico, and was not convinced that we would make it through. These are commercial vessels heavily built and strong. You become a rag doll in the mouth of a wild dog. I think that the only fair assumption to make is that everything gets out of control IMHO Tony B
 
B

BJ Brewer

Piracy and stormy seas.....

An Atlantic storm, several Coast Guard recues and searches, vessels in the area coming and going....For Flying Colors or Colours, they were stalked from departure and the storm made an easy and believable cover up; crew was approached and offered "help" from another vessel (foreign)and a towline; vessel was towed to location unknown (hidden cove/operations); one of the females appears to have passed (blue eyes); other female is very ill and is lying in prone position; the two men, Patrick Topping and Jason Franks are not registering at all on the radar (not a good sign). Water route is a frequent route of fishing trawlers and international water traffic. The crew did not pull Flying Colours into port; the thieves towed it there. The Coast Guard plane cannot see the vessel since it is covered up with a dark green faded tarp. This reminds me of the movie "Dead Calm" with Nicole Kidman and Billy Zane; Rhiannon Borisoff (22yr.old female) is plucky and a fighter; she may still have a chance of survival (although she is currently very sick). BJ Bbenergy54@aol.com
 
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