Meanwhile, While We Are No Discharge....
- Thread starter Rick D
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Yes the EPA has been routinely granting
those waivers without having the authority to do so. That is why a federal judge came down so hard on them. But don't worry them legislators are jumping hard in to be coosponsors of the bill granting legal exemption to pleasure boats. At last count there were 45 representatives already signed in as bill co-sponsors. They can feel the free votes for next election. What leaves a foul taste in my mouth about the EPA is that they merely used us for leaverage to try and justify their actions when caught acting illegally. Whenever things like this happen an no legal consequnces are brought to bear on those responsible it stinks to high heaven of government collusion to circumvent approved legislation.
those waivers without having the authority to do so. That is why a federal judge came down so hard on them. But don't worry them legislators are jumping hard in to be coosponsors of the bill granting legal exemption to pleasure boats. At last count there were 45 representatives already signed in as bill co-sponsors. They can feel the free votes for next election. What leaves a foul taste in my mouth about the EPA is that they merely used us for leaverage to try and justify their actions when caught acting illegally. Whenever things like this happen an no legal consequnces are brought to bear on those responsible it stinks to high heaven of government collusion to circumvent approved legislation.
The Actions of Our Federal Government
So, what else is new ? Why should us, in the pleasure boating community, be any different than the rest of the country ? Those people in Washington D.C. don't even know we exist (outside of the "Beltway" !). They live in their own little world there, where they just pay each other off right and left. The fact that its all done on our tax money doesn't even cross their minds in the slightest. I have completely lost faith in our Federal Government, and their Agencies .......... "A Government By The People And For The People " ? Ya, right ! It was a nice Theory ! OK, I vented now ...... I feel better ! Yoo Hoo Hoo ! May You Have Smooth Sailing On Warm Breezes ! Bob Burns=Rascal
So, what else is new ? Why should us, in the pleasure boating community, be any different than the rest of the country ? Those people in Washington D.C. don't even know we exist (outside of the "Beltway" !). They live in their own little world there, where they just pay each other off right and left. The fact that its all done on our tax money doesn't even cross their minds in the slightest. I have completely lost faith in our Federal Government, and their Agencies .......... "A Government By The People And For The People " ? Ya, right ! It was a nice Theory ! OK, I vented now ...... I feel better ! Yoo Hoo Hoo ! May You Have Smooth Sailing On Warm Breezes ! Bob Burns=Rascal
Benny's misplaced blame
Benny I think you might want to re-look at the facts - you said "waivers without having the authority to do so. That is why a Federal judge came down so hard on them." There were no waivers but EPA did choose to intentionally ignore that provision in the CWA requiring permits for rec boaters as it was and is impractical and frivilous. Unfortunatley, some enviro zealot group sued and the court simply applied the overly broad secion of the CWA which was written in 1986. Further, you said "EPA is that they merely used us for leaverage to try and justify their actions... it stinks to high heaven of government collusion to circumvent approved legislation." EPA was doing us a favor my choosing to not apply that provision of the CWA, something none of us wanted and now Congress is trying to codify that exemption in the Rec Boating Act bill. The "approved legislation" to which you refer does nothing to improve the environment or have any other redeeming measure. What you describe as "collusion" is actually commons sense.
Benny I think you might want to re-look at the facts - you said "waivers without having the authority to do so. That is why a Federal judge came down so hard on them." There were no waivers but EPA did choose to intentionally ignore that provision in the CWA requiring permits for rec boaters as it was and is impractical and frivilous. Unfortunatley, some enviro zealot group sued and the court simply applied the overly broad secion of the CWA which was written in 1986. Further, you said "EPA is that they merely used us for leaverage to try and justify their actions... it stinks to high heaven of government collusion to circumvent approved legislation." EPA was doing us a favor my choosing to not apply that provision of the CWA, something none of us wanted and now Congress is trying to codify that exemption in the Rec Boating Act bill. The "approved legislation" to which you refer does nothing to improve the environment or have any other redeeming measure. What you describe as "collusion" is actually commons sense.
I am confused..The artical says they are releasing
treated sewage. Do they mean untreated sewage? All sewage treatment plants release treated sewage. Here in Pittsburgh it is released into the Monongahala river for others downstream to enjoy. r.w.landau
treated sewage. Do they mean untreated sewage? All sewage treatment plants release treated sewage. Here in Pittsburgh it is released into the Monongahala river for others downstream to enjoy. r.w.landau
That is BAU and small potatoes.
I live by the Hudson River in NYC and sometimes enjoy a walk along the shoreline such as it is. A few years back there was a tremendous black out across the whole northeast on a really hot day. Because there was no electrical power anywhere (the whole power grid went down - remember that?) there was raw sewerage being dumped into the river by NYC and many other municipalities. I took a walk along the river that afternoon and was entirely dismayed by the smell of the effluent. This was ALL untreated sewage and no EPA permit was issued OR perhaps even required. Incidents like this make one wonder how much we boaters accomplish trying to keep our little corners of the world clean (our boats, our heads and holding tanks) while the powers that be can just say: "Oops! We let millions of gallons of raw sewage into the environment."
I live by the Hudson River in NYC and sometimes enjoy a walk along the shoreline such as it is. A few years back there was a tremendous black out across the whole northeast on a really hot day. Because there was no electrical power anywhere (the whole power grid went down - remember that?) there was raw sewerage being dumped into the river by NYC and many other municipalities. I took a walk along the river that afternoon and was entirely dismayed by the smell of the effluent. This was ALL untreated sewage and no EPA permit was issued OR perhaps even required. Incidents like this make one wonder how much we boaters accomplish trying to keep our little corners of the world clean (our boats, our heads and holding tanks) while the powers that be can just say: "Oops! We let millions of gallons of raw sewage into the environment."
Don, the lawsuit from the enviro zealots
was about commercial shipping discharge; we just were dragged into it by the EPA. The EPA was doing you or me no favor they just did not have the resources to deal with us. Unfortunately common sense is not a legal principle. If the law is wrong it has to be corrected by the legislators not by any agency administrator. If you do not agree with or like the system organize a movement to change the constitution. I accept difering opinions from mine as long as they are well informed.
was about commercial shipping discharge; we just were dragged into it by the EPA. The EPA was doing you or me no favor they just did not have the resources to deal with us. Unfortunately common sense is not a legal principle. If the law is wrong it has to be corrected by the legislators not by any agency administrator. If you do not agree with or like the system organize a movement to change the constitution. I accept difering opinions from mine as long as they are well informed.
huh?
Benny I worked for EPA for 32+ years and consequently have a pretty firm grip of the process, system and legislation. Once you sift through the jargon, it comes down to a simple mistake the 1986 Congress made whereby they broadly included all marine vessel discharges in the 86 Amendments to the CWA as an act of omission. Some would say negligence but that is too unkind. The Agency has around 20,000 employess, all of whom would have to devote their full time to vessel permitting under the current court ruling and I think all of us agree there are more important and valuable activities to which their time should be devoted. Having said the above, your comments make no sense to me - the Agency doesn't create legislation, they mearly promulgate implementing regulation and in this case choose not to for very good reason(s). It has nothing to do with the Constitution, wrong law, legal principal or how well or ill-informed I am.
Benny I worked for EPA for 32+ years and consequently have a pretty firm grip of the process, system and legislation. Once you sift through the jargon, it comes down to a simple mistake the 1986 Congress made whereby they broadly included all marine vessel discharges in the 86 Amendments to the CWA as an act of omission. Some would say negligence but that is too unkind. The Agency has around 20,000 employess, all of whom would have to devote their full time to vessel permitting under the current court ruling and I think all of us agree there are more important and valuable activities to which their time should be devoted. Having said the above, your comments make no sense to me - the Agency doesn't create legislation, they mearly promulgate implementing regulation and in this case choose not to for very good reason(s). It has nothing to do with the Constitution, wrong law, legal principal or how well or ill-informed I am.
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