Mast Work

[Catalina Big Hook]

My first thread so bear with me. I will soon be hauling my boat out and intend to do some work on the mast this winter; electrical, etc.
My '81 Cat 30 has just 2 external halyards. It also has a spinnaker halyard.

I would like to (somehow) add 2 more halyards; one for backup for the mainsail and one forward, since I have a furler using the jib halyard all year long.

The boat is equipped with what seems to be an added -on bowsprit, so I have 2 forestays. I would like to be able to hank on a storm jib on that 2nd forestay without having to drop the furling jib in order to get a halyard. I also like the idea of a spare.

What would be the best way to accomplish this? Going to internal halyards and using the existing 4 sheaves? Getting a welder in and modifying the mast head?

I am replacing the standing and running rigging, so now is the time. Any help is appreciated.

 

[rbmcintire]

You have the four sheaves already? You could put the the spin halyard on an extended bale projecting out beyond the two forward sheaves. Hang a swivel block off that bale for the spin halyard. The two forward sheaves become the two jib halyards and the two sheaves in back are the main and backup main halyards? Just an easy mod to bolt on a bale and you're done?

I'd like to see photos of that sprit and 2nd forestay. I've got an '84 with an internal halyard setup, so my halyard winch is on the cabintop with the lines brought back from deck organizers. So, if you go with internals, do you need to add those components? I think if I were converting, I would use the Catalina Direct masthead, already built.
http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&product_ID=961&ParentCat=131
They also have the outlet sheaves, spin bale and everything else, ready to fit. Your mast winch would still be handy in many situations, I would think.

Rob

 

[Catalina Big Hook]

Those pics are best I can do for now; away for a few weeks.

From my memory of mast head before Stepped the mast this year, and that picture, my masthead looks to be that product so I guess I don't need to add that.

Also, spin halyard is already as you say, I just have it wrapped around behind the STBD spreaders as it kept tangling in my furler. Slim chance of using it anytime soon as I have no spinnaker, and with wind averaging 20 mph where I live (Newfoundland), I'm fairly sure I never will. But since I have no proper spare halyard, it's "all I got" for backup.

Halyard winches are one either side on the mast; nothing led to cockpit and no equipment for doing so.

Must admit I'm not super keen on running halyards to the cockpit as I need to be at the mast for reefing (regularly, see wind above) anyway and also to flake. But if that's what I have to do to get more halyards, then so be it. Plus, I guess I won't need a winch for each halyard.

Halyards are both wire transitioning to rope and I don't like them. Will be going to all rope. Halyards just basically go up the back side of the mast, over two sheaves, and back down the front for the jib and up the front of the mast, over two sheaves, and down the back for the main.

Not sure if you can tell, but my bowsprit is not straight in line with the boat ! It is turned a little to STBD so that the anchor roller, NOT the forestay is in the middle of a fore/aft line projected forward of the boat. F'ing weird to me.

There is a stay under the bowsprit going back to the bow of the boat just above the waterline.

The bowsprit is wood and about an inch and a quarter, inch and a half thick, and being "out of line" with the boat leads me to think it was added just for a place for the anchor and a stay was put up to hold it up.

But I'm thinking since the stays (up and down) are there anyway, I'll beef up or replace the wood and be able to use that stay for a hank-one storm jib or spare jib or even, God forbid, a spinnaker.

The water is (deadly) cold and the winds can come up suddenly to pretty stupid speeds here, so I want to be prepared.

Just bought the boat "as is" and previous owner didn't ask the previous owner about the additional forestay/bowsprit. It's a mystery. For all I know, that's the factory forestay and the 2nd stay back (with my furler on it) is the added one. Doubt it though.

I would appreciate any pictures you have of your setup, or anything else on your boat.

Thanks for your input on this stuff.

 

[Catalina Big Hook]

One more question for you, RB.

Where do I find the hull number? I am trying to educate myself on these boats, but there is so much out there to soak up.
That number tattooed on the side of my bow can't be it; doesn't fit in with www.catalina30.com owner's listing.
From what I've seen there, my hull number should be in the 2000 to 2500 range.

Thanks again.

Randy.

 

[rbmcintire]

Now I understand how the external halyards masts are set up. I couldn't picture it before...OK, going internal to utilize all four sheaves: how about instead of using the Catalina double sheaves for the mast exits near the deck, you go with how the modern boats are doing it with single hole exits that leave the mast above your mast winch(es)? You still function the same and you gain the use of two more sheaves that are already there. As you're probably already aware, you'll need to replace the sheaves designed for wire.

The hull number should be an imprint in the gelcoat on the stern, I believe.

The sprit setup is unusual, if off-center. If the budget is there, I'd strongly consider redoing it. It would be proper if the furler were "outside" of a hanked storm jib. Tacking that sail in heavier winds, (in present configuration outside of the furler) would be more prone to fouling, I would think. The sheets would run outside of the headstay, for instance.

 

[rbmcintire]

Randy, now I see that if you switch headstays, it makes tacking the furled sail more difficult. It would probably be necessary to run the jibsheets outside the headstay. Without moving the inner stay back, it's the same problem as before. Can the 30 year old deck handle it? You may need to get some professional boat builder input or guidance from Catalina about this.

Rob

 

[Mike1956]

Randy, I think the forward stay is just an add on that is intended to provide an extra forestay to support the mast and not for attaching a headsail. Both stays terminate at the mast head, and I wonder if your genoa ever got fouled on the forward stay. It also looks to me from the photos that your turnbuckle screw is rusting and not stainless steel or bronze. I'd replace that ASAP. Could you shorten the inner stay and attach it lower down the mast to make your boat more like a cutter? Or... you could eliminate the inner stay altogether.

 

[Catalina Big Hook]

RB & Mike:

I'm thinking that if I were to use that bowsprit stay for my furler, assuming I beef up (more likely replaced) the bowsprit itself, I'd actually have a better "hold" on the boat because of the short stay under the bowsprit being attached to the hull, not the deck. I'd have to have a look at that attach point and see if it has a good backing plate too.

I could then make the 2nd forestay removable somehow, so the deck would be clear for easy tacking with the furled jib. If I wanted to hank something on, then I'd roll up the furler and pin on that 2nd stay. How's that sound?

Mike, that's a bad picture. That turnbuckle is half stainless, half bronze. My eyes got big when I first saw it too; I thought it was rusted till I looked at it up close. I'll be replacing it anyway. Good eye.

 

[Rob19574]

Ive done this job before and it's as you said. I had external halyards and moved everything internal the mast. It's a big though and I would recommend redoing your entire mast if you have the resources and time. I rewired and painted my mast white on our '78 c-30. You will need to remove the masthead and I would recommend replacing all mast head sheaves with ball bearing sheaves. Then, you will need to drill holes into the mast head unit to allow the halyard to travel thru, enter the mast and travel downward. My masthead unit was sealed completely. Drill out the holes then file them smooth as to not chaff and damage your halyards. You will have room for 4 down thru the mast if you need that many. I assume the spinnaker will run external. Good luck with the project and it's worth doing.

Rob

 

[rbmcintire]

Have you seen the hardware and sprit at Catalina Direct? http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_ID=52
I see they're now making fiberglass a sprit option! Anyway, I guess you would have to have the new sprit in place for a rigger to measure for the new headstay and bobstay. I really wonder if you have a tall rig mast. It would be somewhere around 42' 6" - 43' in length.

I did my standing rigging last winter and ordered through CD. Everything fit perfectly, because what they do is make you send your existing rig to California. I was sorry I didn't order through my local guy, but I saved almost 50% buying direct from Catalina. The wire they use is Andes so I didn't have any concerns about inferior Chinese stainless. Depending on the time of year, it's about a month turnaround to get it back.

 

[Catalina Big Hook]

Thanks everyone.

 

[rbmcintire]

Here is a photo of MADLEE's bow rigging. It has since been completely replaced. Bowsprit now has a turnbuckle instead of the fixed-length section here:

 

[rbmcintire]

Another from a wider perspective:

 

[rbmcintire]

Try again with photo upload:

 

[Catalina Big Hook]

RB

I don't have tall rig; mast is 40'. Just confirmed that. Suits me with the wind we have where I sail; usually on the border of too much.

That last picture of MADLEE just confirmed my suspicion that my bowsprit is an add on; my bowsprit is sitting ON the deck and extends out. The cleats and bow pulpit are on top of the bowsprit, plus I have a third cleat in the centre.

Trying to use my bowsprit forestay to carry a sail would tear it off I think. The only thing keeping it on is bolts through the deck on a sheer, whereas MADLEE's bowsprit is actually in front of the boat and the tension in the rigging is actually trying to shorten her bowsprit (compression loading, as opposed to shear loading like mine).

I think the solution is to buy and install the proper bowsprit, and then I can use it to carry a sail.

 

[rbmcintire]

You've really got a lot of issues to consider. With high wind conditions common, stiffening the hull and rig components are paramount. Good Luck!

Rob

 

[mortyd]

my boat - 5961 - was one of the first catalina built with a 'non-wood' comprssion post, a definite improvement. it might be worth your while to ask catalina if they have any parts in stock or what they used instead of wood. once your mast is out i guess this is not a big job.

 

[BillyK]

my boat - 5961 - was one of the first catalina built with a 'non-wood' comprssion post, a definite improvement. it might be worth your while to ask catalina if they have any parts in stock or what they used instead of wood. once your mast is out i guess this is not a big job.

Compression post or compression block in the bilge?

 

[mortyd]

according to the catalina 30 association list of factory modifications, the compression post.

 

[Catalina Big Hook]

Mortyd.

I'll check it out. Thanks. My list grows longer. ?