Mast maintenance done

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Jun 12, 2010
936
Oday 22 Orleans Marina, NOLA
Thanks Joe.

So long as I'm killing this topic to death :) here is an interesting concept for the mast babystays.

In the picture which I got from here: http://slowflight.net/upgrades/tips-GinPole.html

The author uses the main halyard with a loose lash of line around the mast for the babystay attachment point. This is interesting because you could raise this as high as you like (well, up to the spreaders at least), and requires no additional harware.

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Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
Thanks Joe.

So long as I'm killing this topic to death :) here is an interesting concept for the mast babystays.

In the picture which I got from here: http://slowflight.net/upgrades/tips-GinPole.html

The author uses the main halyard with a loose lash of line around the mast for the babystay attachment point. This is interesting because you could raise this as high as you like (well, up to the spreaders at least), and requires no additional harware.

View attachment 46092
I tried that one for one season Ken. That mast attachment idea is the same one that I got from an article written by Stu Whitcome in Small Craft Advisor magazine. It works but it's a pain in the neck to set up and put away. It really is.
I think it would be great for a smaller sloop or 17' daysailer, but it's not that great for boats in the 22' range with a 60 lbs mast.
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
Thanks Joe.

So long as I'm killing this topic to death :) here is an interesting concept for the mast babystays.

In the picture which I got from here: http://slowflight.net/upgrades/tips-GinPole.html

The author uses the main halyard with a loose lash of line around the mast for the babystay attachment point. This is interesting because you could raise this as high as you like (well, up to the spreaders at least), and requires no additional harware.

View attachment 46092
That link by Dale Mack is a pretty good example of a real nice and simple Gin Pole rig. Wayne's rig is very similar to it with the exception that he used Aluminum pipe instead of wood to build his Gin Pole, but he uses the small boat winch like Dale has pictured. With the winch, you can mount the Gin Pole lower on the mast because you only need enough space over the deck for the eye strap, single sheave, and the hook. My set up is limited to just enough room to fit my boom vang plus a little extra to tighten my blocks to throw a little slack into my forestay after I have loosened the Handy-Lock on my back stay.
I talked to a couple of guys through the years who had built Gin Poles like Dale's and they worked perfect. Some guys had concerns about the 2x4 breaking but they could have used oak or metal to build it. I built my first one out of red oak and I designed it to be taken apart with the aid of two bolts, washers, and wing nuts.
 

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Jun 12, 2010
936
Oday 22 Orleans Marina, NOLA
Well, it's done. It was one of those experiences where I felt like I learned something. Having never done any of the things I was attempting I suppose it went well enough, but not smooth by any means. The whole process started with a badly frayed backstay in 20kt winds, I got into that predicament by ignoring a broken wire on the back stay - here's some advice...don't do that.

New rigging

I purchased Quick Attach fittings to make up the new backstay and the starboard upper shroud. The jury is still out on the suitability of the fittings for standing rigging, but only time will tell on that.

The rigging was pretty easy to make, the original stays were intact, lengthwise anyway, so I attached the new turnbuckle to the new wire, stretched both wires out, marked and cut the wire, then attached the new eye/fork. I was happy that my calculations were correct and the new wires came out exactly the same length as the old. I put a mark where the wire enters the fitting so I can tell if there is any slippage.

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It turns out that both the eye and the fork fitting had different dimensions than the original swagged fittings, so to make the fork fit I had to grind down the mast tang a bit. To allow the eye to fit I choose to grid down the eye to narrow the neck a bit - I don't think that part was structural.

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Mast Gate

I made a mast gate out of carpet moulding. Pretty easy. I used gold anodized aluminum and it matched the mast well. The upper mounting screw is offset a bit because the first screw twisted off, and my attempt to drill it out failed...so the holes don't line up.

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For the mast raising I installed two eyestraps on either side of the mast for the babystays about 7.5 feet up.

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Topping lift

More trials and tribulations. I had the mast on the sawhorses and I was looking at the masthead, trying to figure the best way to attach a topping lift. I have a spinnaker bail on the front of the masthead, and I thought, hey, I can add one to the back and that would be perfect. So I ordered one from Rigrite, price unseen. Then I realized, duh, that the topping lift needs to be inside of the backstay...I knew that. So I've got this very nice, high quality spinnaker bail that set me back $64...and with a 20% restocking fee, well I'll use it.

101_1005.jpg

For the actual topping lift I got some 1/4" line, spliced an eye into each end (I don't know if I like doing that or not). I wanted the line to fall short of the boom by a few feet so I could attach a second line to allow adjustment at the boom end. It worked just like my original concept but I'm not 100% sure I like it, seems overly complicated, but I'll see how it works in practice.

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Mast Raising

OK, here's the fun part. First off, it was a petty windy day, so I knew my bridle was actually going to need to stabilize the mast. No problem, that's what it's for. I picked up some rope from Home Depot for the bridle...I looked at all their offerings and settled on what looked like a reasonably non-stretchy line. the plan is to construct the bridle at the boat using the 3 point harness - chainplate - mast - ginpole. I tie a hook to the rope, sight in the height of the pivot ring, attach the ring...pull it tight with just my bare hands, and doggone it, that rope might as well been a rubber band. I've never seen rope that was that stretchy. After playing with it I conclude that while it stretched quite a bit, there was a limit (of course), so with diminishing prospect of success I forged ahead. For the mast and ginpole babystays I used a truckers hitch, figuring I could just keep tightening the line as needed to get all that stretch out.

After much adjusting, and seriously contemplating calling the whole thing off, I tested the set up by raising the mast a few inches off the dock box (which doubled as the mast crutch).

101_1004.jpg

It pulled to one side, so I adjusted and tried again. It stayed centered. Now I can lift the mast myself, walking it up from the cockpit (I'm 6'4") and normally I just need someone on the forestay to provide a little balance and pull. So standing in my normal position under that mast, with one hand on the mast and one pulling the hoist, I just walked it up, and viola, up she went.

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Lessons learned.

The 3 point bridle worked in practice, even with my bad setup. The three attachment points are on opposite sides of the ring, there's no where for the ring to go - it remains stationary and provides the pivot point. With the mast up I'm going to fabricate one out of wire rope (no stretching, I hate stretching) for future use.
 
Jun 12, 2010
936
Oday 22 Orleans Marina, NOLA
Some guys had concerns about the 2x4 breaking
I don't think that's a concern. All the force is compression, the is no significat lateral forces on the gin pole as far as I can see.
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
I don't think that's a concern. All the force is compression, the is no significat lateral forces on the gin pole as far as I can see.
It's a real learning experience isn't it Ken? I went through a lot of trial and error when I developed my mast raising system. There are a lot of variables that come into play in making the Gin Pole to be placed in a certain area on the mast. For example: I wanted the Gin pole to be placed near the goose neck fitting on the mast and have the end of the Pole about 1"or 2" from the fore stay after the mast was up. The question arises, with the mast laying down and ready to go up, will I be able to reach the eye bolts to clip on the snaps to my bridles at the end of the Pole? The answer to that question is yes, but just barely if I step on a piece of paper. :D I could lower the Gin Pole on the mast, but the end of the pole will be short of the fore stay due to the angle of the stay which isn't all that crucial. The angle of the Boom Vang wants to pull the Gin Pole off the mast only when the mast is all the way up, but you're going to have an angle anyway regardless.
For my baby stays and pivot bridles, I used a cheap braid line which didn't have much stretch in it. I bought enough snaps for all the ends of my bridles. Then I attached the lines to the snap rings by tying a round turn and a couple of half hitches to each of the rings on the snaps. I like using round turns because they are easy to adjust and the half hitches won't bind on them in the event that you need to remove them and make more adjustments to your ropes.

I had a frayed stay that I ignored years ago and I paid the price for it. So I can only say, "been there, done that and I'll never do that again."

So in spite of the bridles stretching, the baby stays remained tight and kept the mast nice and straight all the way up? That's great! I was wondering if the pivot bridle rings were going to stay put as the mast was being raised. I too am learning something new all the time. Those small pad eyes that you installed on your mast for the baby stays should be plenty strong enough work out great. Hey thanks for posting these great pics Ken.
 
Jun 12, 2010
936
Oday 22 Orleans Marina, NOLA
Hey thanks for posting these great pics Ken.
No problem. I don't mind sharing my humbling, um, learning experiences in public.

The mast eye straps are very strong, I even thought they could be used as an emergency attach point for a lower shroud if a wire or tang broke.

The three point harness is perfect, but I'm sure the chainplate has to be in line with the mast for it to work properly (which mine is).

My gin pole is 6' long. In looking at the raised mast picture, I'm thinking 8' would be better, allowing a more straight down pull to the deck when the mast is near vertical. This would add more leverage also.

I like the pictures you posted (of your friends system I believe) with the wooden mounting base for a metal gin pole. With a metal pole I could make it in two 4' sections that slide apart which would allow me to store the ginpole on the boat.

I'm just glad the mast is back on the boat. Now if the weather would cooperate.
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
No problem. I don't mind sharing my humbling, um, learning experiences in public.

The mast eye straps are very strong, I even thought they could be used as an emergency attach point for a lower shroud if a wire or tang broke.

The three point harness is perfect, but I'm sure the chainplate has to be in line with the mast for it to work properly (which mine is).

My gin pole is 6' long. In looking at the raised mast picture, I'm thinking 8' would be better, allowing a more straight down pull to the deck when the mast is near vertical. This would add more leverage also.

I like the pictures you posted (of your friends system I believe) with the wooden mounting base for a metal gin pole. With a metal pole I could make it in two 4' sections that slide apart which would allow me to store the ginpole on the boat.

I'm just glad the mast is back on the boat. Now if the weather would cooperate.
My stays don't line up with my mast and this is why I had to mount pad eyes on my deck and make up pivot bridles. So we now know that if the stays line up with the pivot point of the mast, all you need is a single rope with a ring on the end to attach the baby stays and the Gin Pole bridle.
It might be easier to make the final adjustments in the bridles while the mast is up. If you use a non stretch braid line, you should be able to tie them to the snaps permanent. Then you could stretch out the lines to see if the snaps come even like you did with the stays. Once you get them adjusted, you shouldn't have to mess with them again.
As for the Gin Pole; I would keep experimenting with the wood until you are satisfied with it. Then you can make up a Gin Pole out of pipe with a collar on it so that it can come apart in two equal lengths. I'm using 1" stainless steel with a 6"X 1-1/8" pipe for a collar.
You may want to think about installing a stern rail on your boat. This would solve the problem of being able to construct a mast crutch that can hold the mast for both trailering and mast raising. I suppose that there are other ways of getting around the mast crutch problem without having to install the stern rail though. It's a call that you're going to have to make. These boats can be expensive once you start changing things on them.
If I'm still alive and kicking next year, I'm looking forward to doing some new mods to my boat, like the homemade boom break that I plan to install using the Super 8 ascending device that I bought from a mountain climbing store on the web a few months ago. I'm always ready to tackle something new on my boat every year. It gives me something to look forward to over the winter.
Joe
 

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Jun 12, 2010
936
Oday 22 Orleans Marina, NOLA
If I'm still alive and kicking next year, I'm looking forward to doing some new mods to my boat, like the homemade boom break that I plan to install using the Super 8 ascending device that I bought from a mountain climbing store on the web a few months ago. I'm always ready to tackle something new on my boat every year. It gives me something to look forward to over the winter.
Joe
Joe, you have got to be King of the 222's. I appreciate your depth of knowledge and plan on getting even more information out of you in the future, so your better stick around at least till I reach my expiration date (which I've already cheated out several times). :D
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
Joe, you have got to be King of the 222's. I appreciate your depth of knowledge and plan on getting even more information out of you in the future, so your better stick around at least till I reach my expiration date (which I've already cheated out several times). :D
Thanks Ken. I'm going to try to hang in there for as long as I can. I only have one health issue so far and I hope to get treated for it after the first of the year.
A lot the knowledge that I've manage to acquire I got by picking Rudy's brains and also my friend and fellow YC member Wayne Barlow who likes to think of himself as a "tinkerer." There's no end to the ideas that pour out of Barlow's head and once in a great while I'm able to improve on one of them. The rest of the mods that I've done on my boat was all trial and error. At any rate I'm going to try to continue to share these ideas as I get them and hopefully everyone will do the same.
Right now I'm having a blast watching Youtubes and learning other things that interest me.

If you decide to make another Gin Pole out of metal and wood, you'll need to design it to fit your boat, but I think you already know that.
The only problem you may encounter now is the construction of a mast crutch and where to mount it. Without a stern pulpit to mount it on, this can be a problem. Some guys make up a crutch with pintlals mounted on it so they can attach it to the gudgions. If they decide to raise or lower the mast with the boat in the water this becomes a problem because they'll need to mess with taking the rudder off to mount the crutch or vise versa. In the final analysis, a stern rail, boom gallows, or some kind of an attachment to the inner transom might be the way to go because the mast needs to be supported with something in the raising/lowering process.
I was very fortunate when I ordered my boat from a large O'Day dealer in getting them to ask the factory to mount a full stern rail and leave the winches, tracks w/ cars off my boat for me to relocate. From what I understand, the O'Day factory only built twenty O'Day 222s with full stern rails. I guess I lucked out.
Joe
 
Aug 20, 2010
1,399
Oday 27 Oak Orchard
Hey Ken, what was your take on the Hi Mod fittings? With YOT looking like it will make it to the water early summer of 2012 mast rigging is becoming a higher priority. I will be using 7/32 wire as I am going with 302/304 stainless and not the more common nowadays 316. Just to much pain to rerig with 1/4 inch stuff with pin sizes all over the place.
 
Jun 12, 2010
936
Oday 22 Orleans Marina, NOLA
Hey Ken, what was your take on the Hi Mod fittings? With YOT looking like it will make it to the water early summer of 2012 mast rigging is becoming a higher priority. I will be using 7/32 wire as I am going with 302/304 stainless and not the more common nowadays 316. Just to much pain to rerig with 1/4 inch stuff with pin sizes all over the place.
Keep in mind I'm no expert, but I've never heard of 7/32. I only know of 1x19 and 7x19. 1x19 is stiff and what is typically used for standing rigging, 7x19 is flexible and is typically used for wire halyards. Both come in 304 and 316, but the 316 is more expensive. For non-Florida and non-tropical environments 304 is fine and comes in 1x19 of any diameter you may need.

As far as fittings, in my research I like Hi-mod the best, but I have never used them. This will be what I use next time, however. The fittings themselves are 316 stainless and can accept either 1x19 or 7x19 wire, but the part numbers are different for each wire type, so you need to know in advance.

For standing rigging I would go with 304 1x19 and Hi-mod fittings at whatever diameter was originally on your boat.
 
Aug 20, 2010
1,399
Oday 27 Oak Orchard
Sorry about the confusion Ken. The wire is indeed 1 X 19 at 7/32 diameter. The big problem I had was finding fittings for 7/32 wire with the coresponding pin diameters.
 
Jun 12, 2010
936
Oday 22 Orleans Marina, NOLA
Sorry about the confusion Ken. The wire is indeed 1 X 19 at 7/32 diameter. The big problem I had was finding fittings for 7/32 wire with the corresponding pin diameters.
Oh, right. ;) Yeah, I've read a lot of good things about the hi-mod fittings and I like their design. The ones for 7/32" wire has a 3/8" pin, where as the norseman for the same wire has a 1/2" pin. A lot of people swear by norseman but I was put off by one test result that showed they failed under near breaking load earlier than the other fittings (Hi-mod, Sta-loc, Quick Attach).

Sta-loc seems to be the most popular, you might want to check what they offer also. I would stay away from Quick Attach, the fittings test well but the method they use to grab the wire (barbs) intuitively seems more likely to fail, especially over time.
 
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