Purchased sailboat after and because of certain claims made about previous work completed. Subsequent findings show work not done or done below industry standards. Cost of correctional undertaking in the thousands of dollars.
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contractual problem
It someone has made a material misrepresentation regarding either the actual work done or the quality it leads to a fundemental breach of the contract of purchase. While the law is different in many respects between Canada and the US, the law of contract is the same. There may well be local statutes which would be of assistance. I don't think that you need a "maritime" attorney, just one who is good in dealing with breaches of contract. Good luck.
It someone has made a material misrepresentation regarding either the actual work done or the quality it leads to a fundemental breach of the contract of purchase. While the law is different in many respects between Canada and the US, the law of contract is the same. There may well be local statutes which would be of assistance. I don't think that you need a "maritime" attorney, just one who is good in dealing with breaches of contract. Good luck.
You need a litigation attorney
Let me know what state you live in and also the state where the seller of the boat is located. I can then give you additional information on what to do next. It sounds like you need a litigation attorney, not a maritime lawyer. I am a lawyer with primary practice in NJ (26 years experience) and I am also admitted in Florida.
Let me know what state you live in and also the state where the seller of the boat is located. I can then give you additional information on what to do next. It sounds like you need a litigation attorney, not a maritime lawyer. I am a lawyer with primary practice in NJ (26 years experience) and I am also admitted in Florida.
Briann Smith
Thanks for the reply. Your perception seems correct. Will look closer into the matter .
Thanks for the reply. Your perception seems correct. Will look closer into the matter .
Bob's right///get a ltigator
Lawyerin pays my slip rent too...Bob is right, there's no maritime issue. Need a lawyer in your state and/or seller's. If he happens to be in Texas he is in trouble. We have a consumer protection statute that specifically names false claims of work performed as a deceptive trade practice, entitling the consumer to possible triple damages and attorney fees. It helps get people's attention. I'm curious though what is the 'bad guys's' response to your complaint. Surely ya'll have talked about it..... IslandJack
Lawyerin pays my slip rent too...Bob is right, there's no maritime issue. Need a lawyer in your state and/or seller's. If he happens to be in Texas he is in trouble. We have a consumer protection statute that specifically names false claims of work performed as a deceptive trade practice, entitling the consumer to possible triple damages and attorney fees. It helps get people's attention. I'm curious though what is the 'bad guys's' response to your complaint. Surely ya'll have talked about it..... IslandJack
NC referral
If the boat was sold in NC, try the following: Richard L. Stanley Bryant & Stanley PO Box 150 207 Turner Street Beaufort, NC 28516 Phone: (252) 728-7200 FAX: (252) 728-3681 He is well versed in the issues and can deal with Maritime law as well, should it prove applicable.
If the boat was sold in NC, try the following: Richard L. Stanley Bryant & Stanley PO Box 150 207 Turner Street Beaufort, NC 28516 Phone: (252) 728-7200 FAX: (252) 728-3681 He is well versed in the issues and can deal with Maritime law as well, should it prove applicable.
IslandJack
As, over the years, boat bottoms accrue layers of protection, so this situation appears, with its multi-layered protectors. Boat presented in one light, but with declamation declaration lurking in the shadows. Bill of sale and receipt outlines the work undertaken and paid. After 6 months, examination suggests gross neglect in procedure for completion of repairs made. Response continues and remains hidden behind receipt. However, physical evidence shouts louder than any issuer of receipts.
As, over the years, boat bottoms accrue layers of protection, so this situation appears, with its multi-layered protectors. Boat presented in one light, but with declamation declaration lurking in the shadows. Bill of sale and receipt outlines the work undertaken and paid. After 6 months, examination suggests gross neglect in procedure for completion of repairs made. Response continues and remains hidden behind receipt. However, physical evidence shouts louder than any issuer of receipts.
Chris Burti
Thanks for your steerage. Many are the facets of fraud and the craftmanship of shipwrights.
Thanks for your steerage. Many are the facets of fraud and the craftmanship of shipwrights.
NC choice of forum.
Hmmmm. NC may not be your best choice of forum after reading this. Recent decision held against purchaser where repair was disclosed, survey was commissioned by purchaser and contract read "as is".
Hmmmm. NC may not be your best choice of forum after reading this. Recent decision held against purchaser where repair was disclosed, survey was commissioned by purchaser and contract read "as is".
Chris Burti
Your input is valuable and appreciated.... Initial survey was commissioned by seller, which lead to corrective actions by seller (repair was disclosed, but executed below industry standards.) and the purchasers acceptance of the boat and bill of sale, (no purchase contract issued), which does not include any reference to, "as is", except under title paragraph. However the discrepancy lies with the purchasers survey, (post purchase) affirming the point in question as not being properly completed and implying industry standards met, which were the grounds for subsequent purchase.
Your input is valuable and appreciated.... Initial survey was commissioned by seller, which lead to corrective actions by seller (repair was disclosed, but executed below industry standards.) and the purchasers acceptance of the boat and bill of sale, (no purchase contract issued), which does not include any reference to, "as is", except under title paragraph. However the discrepancy lies with the purchasers survey, (post purchase) affirming the point in question as not being properly completed and implying industry standards met, which were the grounds for subsequent purchase.
Just a note
When buying a boat the survey should always be commissioned by the buyer, for reasons that are now clear.
When buying a boat the survey should always be commissioned by the buyer, for reasons that are now clear.
Phil Herring
Thanks for your reply. To the casual observer, this is not only obvious, but any experienced sailor knows it is mandatory. However, this medium of exchange being limited, plausible explanation of past events cannot be discussed.
Thanks for your reply. To the casual observer, this is not only obvious, but any experienced sailor knows it is mandatory. However, this medium of exchange being limited, plausible explanation of past events cannot be discussed.
Phil
Hi agn. A survey was made by the buyer prior to purchase. Placement of boat on the hard was made to allow out of water stowage for 4-5 months. Survey post purchase was made by buyer (now new owner) due to survey prior to purchase having made clear and specific statements concerning repairs made by seller that were now obviously lacking.
Hi agn. A survey was made by the buyer prior to purchase. Placement of boat on the hard was made to allow out of water stowage for 4-5 months. Survey post purchase was made by buyer (now new owner) due to survey prior to purchase having made clear and specific statements concerning repairs made by seller that were now obviously lacking.
Surveyor?
Can the surveyor be held responsible? Also, what about the insurance company? If they required a survey prior to coverage, accepted that survey and covered the boat, are they now responsible to cover the repairs? I may be in a similar situation.
Can the surveyor be held responsible? Also, what about the insurance company? If they required a survey prior to coverage, accepted that survey and covered the boat, are they now responsible to cover the repairs? I may be in a similar situation.
bag of worms but typical
of what comes in a lawyer office! haha. Curious has a god question...where is the surveyor. Possibly the Seller was a victim too.... bottom line is, it'll definitely take a good lawyer and a good expert to forensically determine what happened and explain it to a judge or jury in detail. Unfortunately...it is so expensive....time consuming and not fun. IslandJack
of what comes in a lawyer office! haha. Curious has a god question...where is the surveyor. Possibly the Seller was a victim too.... bottom line is, it'll definitely take a good lawyer and a good expert to forensically determine what happened and explain it to a judge or jury in detail. Unfortunately...it is so expensive....time consuming and not fun. IslandJack
The can of worms thickens.....
Not only is the new wife to sailing becoming more frustrated with each passing swell (of the bruised dreams as well as the pocketbook), but after having the boat moved, additional damage was discovered whose cause has yet to be determined. Was it the sending yard or the shipping medium? Questions. If only there were as many answers as questions.
Not only is the new wife to sailing becoming more frustrated with each passing swell (of the bruised dreams as well as the pocketbook), but after having the boat moved, additional damage was discovered whose cause has yet to be determined. Was it the sending yard or the shipping medium? Questions. If only there were as many answers as questions.
This experience only proves to demonstrate
the importance of making any offer "subject to survey and sea trial," and the even greater importance of paying for a full pre-purchase survey, done for buyer by a surveyor hired by and working for the buyer. A seller is under no obligation to disclose anything...a survey done for a seller is worthless to a buyer...and a survey done after the deal is closed isn't likely to provide any recourse against a seller unless it can be proven that the seller lied. Proving that can be very difficult unless you can also prove that the seller is knowledgable enough to have known that work that he claimed to have been told, or believed, that was done properly wasn't. As for any recourse against the seller's surveyor, only if the seller joins you in the claim...because that surveyor was working for him, not you. Unfortunately, when it comes to buying a boat, CAVEAT EMPTOR rules. Even more unfortunately, you're not the first, and won't be the last, boat buyer for whom learning that turned out to be very expensive. I sincerely hope that there's a loophole in the wording of the Bill of Sale, or witnesses to your conversations with the seller that will allow a good lawyer to cut the cost of your education without adding even more to the cost of it. I wouldn't count on it, though.
the importance of making any offer "subject to survey and sea trial," and the even greater importance of paying for a full pre-purchase survey, done for buyer by a surveyor hired by and working for the buyer. A seller is under no obligation to disclose anything...a survey done for a seller is worthless to a buyer...and a survey done after the deal is closed isn't likely to provide any recourse against a seller unless it can be proven that the seller lied. Proving that can be very difficult unless you can also prove that the seller is knowledgable enough to have known that work that he claimed to have been told, or believed, that was done properly wasn't. As for any recourse against the seller's surveyor, only if the seller joins you in the claim...because that surveyor was working for him, not you. Unfortunately, when it comes to buying a boat, CAVEAT EMPTOR rules. Even more unfortunately, you're not the first, and won't be the last, boat buyer for whom learning that turned out to be very expensive. I sincerely hope that there's a loophole in the wording of the Bill of Sale, or witnesses to your conversations with the seller that will allow a good lawyer to cut the cost of your education without adding even more to the cost of it. I wouldn't count on it, though.
Peggie Hall-----Thanks
a lot for your input. Your first paragraph says it all. It is on the money and saves money if it is executed properly. In this case: The seller didn’t pay for the survey stating needs pertaining to this particular issue. The survey was done as a favor for the broker months before the boat was even known by the buyer. After the survey was completed the boat yard made repairs. It is these repairs, that were then resurveyed by the same surveyor, paid for by the new owner, that are being held in question. This same surveyor stated that the work appeared to have not been attempted or completed correctly inspite of the photo that showed the work was done along with the paid invoice. Are we having fun yet? Thanks for your time and clarity of thought.
a lot for your input. Your first paragraph says it all. It is on the money and saves money if it is executed properly. In this case: The seller didn’t pay for the survey stating needs pertaining to this particular issue. The survey was done as a favor for the broker months before the boat was even known by the buyer. After the survey was completed the boat yard made repairs. It is these repairs, that were then resurveyed by the same surveyor, paid for by the new owner, that are being held in question. This same surveyor stated that the work appeared to have not been attempted or completed correctly inspite of the photo that showed the work was done along with the paid invoice. Are we having fun yet? Thanks for your time and clarity of thought.
Where is Justin when you need him....
Justin, Have you thought about this line of the practice. Your knowledge and ability to explain boat problems, has to be valuable in a situation like this. r.w.landau
Justin, Have you thought about this line of the practice. Your knowledge and ability to explain boat problems, has to be valuable in a situation like this. r.w.landau
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