Does anyone have suggestions as to how to select mainsail battens. I know you should use a stiffer batten in heavier winds and a softer batten in lighter winds. How would you determine how stiff a batten you should use as the wind speed increases? Besides supporting the roach and keeping the trailing edge straight, would a stiffer batten change the amount of draft or is that solely a function of the sail design?
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You shouldn't have to change battens for wind speed, because the battens are more or less permanently installed in your mainsail. Hence, don't understand what the question is.
Batton use
Hi Ted
I agree with Stu, I've never heard of anyone changing battens for different wind strengths. That would be both dangerous and a pain. Where would you store them when not in use???
I think you will find that no matter which batten you get it will act the same. They are just not stiff enough to change the shape of the sail. Their only purpose is to support a roach. If you don't have a roach then you don't NEED battens. With that said they do tend to make the sail quiet and can hold it in its shape when there is no wind. The shape of the sail is controlled by the sail-maker at construction time. The sail-maker will also design in provisions for the owner to flatten the shape by pulling on a verity of lines (sheet, boom vang, traveler, halyard, reef, Cunningham, outhaul).
Hi Ted
I agree with Stu, I've never heard of anyone changing battens for different wind strengths. That would be both dangerous and a pain. Where would you store them when not in use???
I think you will find that no matter which batten you get it will act the same. They are just not stiff enough to change the shape of the sail. Their only purpose is to support a roach. If you don't have a roach then you don't NEED battens. With that said they do tend to make the sail quiet and can hold it in its shape when there is no wind. The shape of the sail is controlled by the sail-maker at construction time. The sail-maker will also design in provisions for the owner to flatten the shape by pulling on a verity of lines (sheet, boom vang, traveler, halyard, reef, Cunningham, outhaul).
Supporting the original posters agenda, Hobie Cat sells "batten tensionners" and "trentec draft gauges" to adjust sail shape for different wind conditions. These are full batten sails, compared to a Mac25, Hobie battens are freakishly gigantic.
Short of sharing this knowledge nugget, I am with Bill and Stu. I don't want extra sticks laying around, and if the sail isn't flapping I am happy. My bottom two battens are wood trim, I tapered to shape with a wood plane; I get a dozen for a couple bucks. I have found my cheapo-battens are not flexible enough for the top batten slot and had to buy one real one.
Short of sharing this knowledge nugget, I am with Bill and Stu. I don't want extra sticks laying around, and if the sail isn't flapping I am happy. My bottom two battens are wood trim, I tapered to shape with a wood plane; I get a dozen for a couple bucks. I have found my cheapo-battens are not flexible enough for the top batten slot and had to buy one real one.
While this is a nice idea in theory, in reality almost no one does it. It is fairly difficult to make a sail that can handle different battens for different wind conditions, since the batten pockets would have to accommodate the largest/heaviest battens, and would probably be too big for the lighter battens, leading to chafe problems, etc.
Ideally battens should be adjusted for wind speed. It's time for someone to invent an inflatable sail batten that can be endlessly adjusted as needed from below without having to drop the sail.
This would solve the problem of wind strength and leech support as well as allow skippers with roller mains furl their sails.
This would solve the problem of wind strength and leech support as well as allow skippers with roller mains furl their sails.
Check on Google
US Patent 5333569 - Inflatable sail battens
I think they had the same idea...
Fair winds!
Sailndive345
US Patent 5333569 - Inflatable sail battens
I think they had the same idea...
Fair winds!
Sailndive345
A question
Would there be a difference between regular battens and full length battens in this discussion? It seems full length battens wouldn't be a susceptible to varying weights.
Would there be a difference between regular battens and full length battens in this discussion? It seems full length battens wouldn't be a susceptible to varying weights.
After poking around the internet today, I came across this article about mainsail battens written by someone at Ullman sails. The article seems to support my belief that different mainsail battens will change the designed shape of the sail. My specific question was how to determine the correct stiffness batten to use. Here is the link to the article by Ullman Sails. This begins to answer my original post.
http://www.sailingproshop.com/ullman_sails_mainsail_battens.aspx
Stu, unless your battens are sewn into your batten pockets, they should be readily removable. The batten tension should also be able to be adjusted as wind strength increases. My question is, how would someone determine the correct batten stiffness?
Bill, dangerous, how? Pain, I definitely agree. All sail trim controls aren't easy to adjust. Some require more effort than others. Some people don't like to make any adjustments at all. I'm not one of them and will do almost anything to get that extra 1/10 knot of speed when racing. As far as storing extra battens, I store mine inside the boom. The outboard end of my boom is partially open so I just slip the unused battens inside the boom and fasten the end of the battens to the boom with a light line to prevent them from falling out.
http://www.sailingproshop.com/ullman_sails_mainsail_battens.aspx
Stu, unless your battens are sewn into your batten pockets, they should be readily removable. The batten tension should also be able to be adjusted as wind strength increases. My question is, how would someone determine the correct batten stiffness?
Bill, dangerous, how? Pain, I definitely agree. All sail trim controls aren't easy to adjust. Some require more effort than others. Some people don't like to make any adjustments at all. I'm not one of them and will do almost anything to get that extra 1/10 knot of speed when racing. As far as storing extra battens, I store mine inside the boom. The outboard end of my boom is partially open so I just slip the unused battens inside the boom and fasten the end of the battens to the boom with a light line to prevent them from falling out.
Ours are velcro-ed in with a flap. Easy enough to remove, but they are full elngth and quite long and cumbersome. I remove them only when I take the sail off for servicing. I wouldn't want to have to do that on any kinda regular basis and will read the article to see what I'm missing. Thanks for your research.
adjustable battens
Not trying to hurt anyone's feelings here... but tension adjusters for tapered battens are regularly used on racing catamarans. There are a few different adjuster systems commonly used. On my NACRA there are special caps(TrenTec) on the ends that allow your to run a small adjusting line to the pocket and back to the small cleat on the cap itself. Typically the batten tension is set on the beach depending on the conditions expected. It is easily done by tipping the cat over on its side, mainsail is up of course, and sighting down the leech to optain the shape you want........... This is much easier than changing out different weight battens.
Here...... a picture is worth a thousand words
http://www.murrays.com/archive/38-39.pdf
That said.... I don't see the benefit unless you have some compelling reason to make you sailing life more complicated.
Not trying to hurt anyone's feelings here... but tension adjusters for tapered battens are regularly used on racing catamarans. There are a few different adjuster systems commonly used. On my NACRA there are special caps(TrenTec) on the ends that allow your to run a small adjusting line to the pocket and back to the small cleat on the cap itself. Typically the batten tension is set on the beach depending on the conditions expected. It is easily done by tipping the cat over on its side, mainsail is up of course, and sighting down the leech to optain the shape you want........... This is much easier than changing out different weight battens.
Here...... a picture is worth a thousand words
http://www.murrays.com/archive/38-39.pdf
That said.... I don't see the benefit unless you have some compelling reason to make you sailing life more complicated.
Re: adjustable battens
Most of the folks that visit this forum are cruisers. When you understand the function of battens you could conclude that the simplest thing for a cruiser to do is to go with the battens that came with the sail. The sail makers choice was a middle ground batten that would work in all conditions.
The main purpose of a batten (full or partial) is to provide rigidity to the leech of the mainsail. The luff of the sail gets it rigidity from the mast and the foot of the sail gets its rigidity from the boom. Without battens the leech would not have any rigidity and would be as limp as a dish rag. Battens help maintain the shape of the mainsail. They also help maintain the draft depth set by the mainsail trimmer. Without battens his chore would be hopeless. it is as simple as that.
Most of the folks that visit this forum are cruisers. When you understand the function of battens you could conclude that the simplest thing for a cruiser to do is to go with the battens that came with the sail. The sail makers choice was a middle ground batten that would work in all conditions.
The main purpose of a batten (full or partial) is to provide rigidity to the leech of the mainsail. The luff of the sail gets it rigidity from the mast and the foot of the sail gets its rigidity from the boom. Without battens the leech would not have any rigidity and would be as limp as a dish rag. Battens help maintain the shape of the mainsail. They also help maintain the draft depth set by the mainsail trimmer. Without battens his chore would be hopeless. it is as simple as that.
The relatively new North main that came on my boat has what seem to be batten tension adjusters on it. There are knobs you spin at the luff to push back on the battens, which are held in place at the leach with velcro. The set-up truly puzzled me when I first tried to insert the battens!
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