I'm still seeking out an upgrade sailboat from my old Lido 14. I like the Macgregor 22, but visited a Catalina 22 last week that I really liked also. The owner wants $3,000 for the boat which seems fair. It also comes with a 8 HP Honda 4 stroke motor (not in the photos). The boat looks very solid, a little dirt, and needs some paint on the deck, but otherwise looks pretty good. He also has a trailer for it, but I haven't seen that yet. Next thing I'll do is meet him in a couple weeks and tow the boat out of the water with my Ford Ranger (V6 2WD) to see how it will handle pulling the boat out of the water, and I also need to check out the hull and keel before I decide what to do next. Also comes with the full bimini cover which goes over the entire cockpit. Opinions on this from what you can see in the photos?? http://home.comcast.net/~tegwilym/boat/index.htm Tom Renton, WA
Looking for boat - checked out a '71 Catalina 22
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Shee looks good!
Need one heck of a good cleaning but she looks good inside. I don't see anything that looks like it is a problem at all! How can you go wrong for $3000.
Need one heck of a good cleaning but she looks good inside. I don't see anything that looks like it is a problem at all! How can you go wrong for $3000.
Go for it !
We had a 1973 Catalina 22 as our first boat.For the money the boat you are looking at is worth the money.The racers want the earlier years.Once you clean it up you should easily get what you paid for it if not more.The deal clincher is the motor and trailer.Those two items alone are expensive.
We had a 1973 Catalina 22 as our first boat.For the money the boat you are looking at is worth the money.The racers want the earlier years.Once you clean it up you should easily get what you paid for it if not more.The deal clincher is the motor and trailer.Those two items alone are expensive.
Can't go wrong
Looks good from the pictures. If she floats, doesn't have deck delamination or centerboard crank issues, $3000 is a bargain. If you clean her up good, you will be able to sell her for more than you paid. Presentable Catalina 22's rarely go for less than $4000 her in Conn.
Looks good from the pictures. If she floats, doesn't have deck delamination or centerboard crank issues, $3000 is a bargain. If you clean her up good, you will be able to sell her for more than you paid. Presentable Catalina 22's rarely go for less than $4000 her in Conn.
Check the Sails
I bought a 22' Helsen and rolled the sails out on the graound and they looked OK old but usable. BUT when I got home with the boat and ran the main up the mast it was too short. We had to get another mainsail. We made one from a Sailrite kit but it was still an added expense. Once a boat is in the $3000 price range dock fees become more important to the seller than the price of the boat. We were offered an older steel hull ketch just to take the boat off the owner's hands. As the others have said it seems like a great deal.
I bought a 22' Helsen and rolled the sails out on the graound and they looked OK old but usable. BUT when I got home with the boat and ran the main up the mast it was too short. We had to get another mainsail. We made one from a Sailrite kit but it was still an added expense. Once a boat is in the $3000 price range dock fees become more important to the seller than the price of the boat. We were offered an older steel hull ketch just to take the boat off the owner's hands. As the others have said it seems like a great deal.
Cat 22
Amazing!! I'm always surprised when I see a boat in this condition. Looks like you are getting a good deal. If the owner had spend a couple of days cleaning it up he probably could have gotten at least $1500-$2000 more.
Amazing!! I'm always surprised when I see a boat in this condition. Looks like you are getting a good deal. If the owner had spend a couple of days cleaning it up he probably could have gotten at least $1500-$2000 more.
Motor and trailer....
Yeah, I think this one looks pretty good! I had a good feeling when I was poking around in this boat. Of course the flash on my camera washes out the white walls of the boat so dirt won't show, but for the most part it all looked pretty clean. I haven't been introduced to the motor or trailer in person yet, but here is photo of the motor - http://home.comcast.net/~tegwilym/boat/motor.jpg He said the trailer is in good shape too, and has the tongue extension, which I think is a good idea also. If anyone has read my earlier posts in the Macgregor forum, I'm watching the boat weights also for towing behind a 2WD Ranger. I might be paranoid, but I did have to spend $2,300 on a new transmission for my truck last year so I like to be careful about these things! I still have to check out the trailer, peek at the hull and keel when I get a chance to try pulling it out of the water, look at the sails, and of course get look at the motor. Another question, I've seen many different weights for the Catalina 22, anywhere between 1,800 and 2490 lbs. This one is one of the first 1,000 made and is the Hall of Fame list with Serial number #880. Are the older ones lighter than the newer ones? Seems that way from what I've seen while exploring information on the internet. Anyway, he is out of town for a few weeks, so hopefully I can peek at it again in a couple weeks and make a decision. I really like this one though! It won't be until sometime next month when he has some more time to show me more. Tom - Seeking my hole in the water to toss some money!
Yeah, I think this one looks pretty good! I had a good feeling when I was poking around in this boat. Of course the flash on my camera washes out the white walls of the boat so dirt won't show, but for the most part it all looked pretty clean. I haven't been introduced to the motor or trailer in person yet, but here is photo of the motor - http://home.comcast.net/~tegwilym/boat/motor.jpg He said the trailer is in good shape too, and has the tongue extension, which I think is a good idea also. If anyone has read my earlier posts in the Macgregor forum, I'm watching the boat weights also for towing behind a 2WD Ranger. I might be paranoid, but I did have to spend $2,300 on a new transmission for my truck last year so I like to be careful about these things! I still have to check out the trailer, peek at the hull and keel when I get a chance to try pulling it out of the water, look at the sails, and of course get look at the motor. Another question, I've seen many different weights for the Catalina 22, anywhere between 1,800 and 2490 lbs. This one is one of the first 1,000 made and is the Hall of Fame list with Serial number #880. Are the older ones lighter than the newer ones? Seems that way from what I've seen while exploring information on the internet. Anyway, he is out of town for a few weeks, so hopefully I can peek at it again in a couple weeks and make a decision. I really like this one though! It won't be until sometime next month when he has some more time to show me more. Tom - Seeking my hole in the water to toss some money!
Motor
Yeah, I definitely realize that value on the motor! Probably worth more when it was new, but it's a few years old now also, but still looks good. Owner said he wanted to get it tuned up before selling the boat also. Tom
Yeah, I definitely realize that value on the motor! Probably worth more when it was new, but it's a few years old now also, but still looks good. Owner said he wanted to get it tuned up before selling the boat also. Tom
Honda 7.5? The Best!
On my two Catalina 25's and Hunter 25.5 I had the Honda 7.5 engine. Man, are they tough! The 8 hp is the same engine basically. Not only do they have an alternator that will charge your battery underway, but the four-stroke performance is quiet and very dependable. The biggest issue I recall though is the "varnishing" of the fuel bowl that will mess up the needle valve and your engine will not start. When your done for the day and your engine is running at the dock, pull the fuel line off and let the fuel run out. The engine will labor and sputter when the fuel from the bowl is exhausted, but it keeps the bowl empty and the varnish down. Figure five minutes at idle to burn it off. Otherwise, you will be taking off the carb, taking everything apart, soaking the needle and blowing compressed air thru the lines to clean the fuel system (recommeded annually anyways). On older Honda's, watch for the intake impellor performance and max water cooling. It would pay to take the engine to a shop, have it checked out, get an oil change, lower boot oil change, replace cooling water impellor and have the head/electronics bench tested. Their is a module that can go out, but not a common problem. Once all this is done your good for another 10 years. Its worth the bucks compared to shelling out thousands for a new engine. In St. Augustine a few years ago, we came across a Catalina 27 with an outboard painted white, and stenciled on the cover was "Maytag". It was the Honda 7.5. Nough said. Great 22, by the way. Bob Catalina 30 Breezin II
On my two Catalina 25's and Hunter 25.5 I had the Honda 7.5 engine. Man, are they tough! The 8 hp is the same engine basically. Not only do they have an alternator that will charge your battery underway, but the four-stroke performance is quiet and very dependable. The biggest issue I recall though is the "varnishing" of the fuel bowl that will mess up the needle valve and your engine will not start. When your done for the day and your engine is running at the dock, pull the fuel line off and let the fuel run out. The engine will labor and sputter when the fuel from the bowl is exhausted, but it keeps the bowl empty and the varnish down. Figure five minutes at idle to burn it off. Otherwise, you will be taking off the carb, taking everything apart, soaking the needle and blowing compressed air thru the lines to clean the fuel system (recommeded annually anyways). On older Honda's, watch for the intake impellor performance and max water cooling. It would pay to take the engine to a shop, have it checked out, get an oil change, lower boot oil change, replace cooling water impellor and have the head/electronics bench tested. Their is a module that can go out, but not a common problem. Once all this is done your good for another 10 years. Its worth the bucks compared to shelling out thousands for a new engine. In St. Augustine a few years ago, we came across a Catalina 27 with an outboard painted white, and stenciled on the cover was "Maytag". It was the Honda 7.5. Nough said. Great 22, by the way. Bob Catalina 30 Breezin II
Weight
Our Cqatalina 22 had a listed weight of 2400 pounds.However I took it too a truckstop scale just for grins.The complete weight was actually 3700 pounds. The trailers are not light.Neither is all the stuff we just have to cram in. I towed ours with a small(318) v-8 that did okay.I'd be a little apprehensive with a Ranger.Please don't forget that you aslo have to stop this thing.
Our Cqatalina 22 had a listed weight of 2400 pounds.However I took it too a truckstop scale just for grins.The complete weight was actually 3700 pounds. The trailers are not light.Neither is all the stuff we just have to cram in. I towed ours with a small(318) v-8 that did okay.I'd be a little apprehensive with a Ranger.Please don't forget that you aslo have to stop this thing.
towing
3700 lbs? Yikes! My truck is about 4,000 lbs empty. Is there a difference in the weight of the older and newer Catalina 22s? I just seem to see different things all over websites (and books) and don't know what to believe. The owner told me that the previous owners of the boat towed it with a Volvo station wagon. Not sure what model, but I think all those wagons are pretty much the same. I looked at a Macgregor 24 that should be around 2200 lbs (this one was more since it had a lot of water in the bilge), so why is the smaller Catalina 22 more than a 24 Macgregor? Thicker fiberglass? More ballast? I'll be towing it only about 2 miles each way at the most since I'm very close to the lake and boat launch. Tom
3700 lbs? Yikes! My truck is about 4,000 lbs empty. Is there a difference in the weight of the older and newer Catalina 22s? I just seem to see different things all over websites (and books) and don't know what to believe. The owner told me that the previous owners of the boat towed it with a Volvo station wagon. Not sure what model, but I think all those wagons are pretty much the same. I looked at a Macgregor 24 that should be around 2200 lbs (this one was more since it had a lot of water in the bilge), so why is the smaller Catalina 22 more than a 24 Macgregor? Thicker fiberglass? More ballast? I'll be towing it only about 2 miles each way at the most since I'm very close to the lake and boat launch. Tom
towing specs
The swing keel weighs in at about 2300 lbs, you should add the trailer weight, O.B. and all the other equipment you'll be carrying in the boat...so 3700 is not unreasonable. This will put you into the Class III towing range. I found a link to Ford Ranger 150 specs... http://www.fordf150.net/specs/04ranger.php http://199.237.51.208/manuals/sales/c2283d.jpg
The swing keel weighs in at about 2300 lbs, you should add the trailer weight, O.B. and all the other equipment you'll be carrying in the boat...so 3700 is not unreasonable. This will put you into the Class III towing range. I found a link to Ford Ranger 150 specs... http://www.fordf150.net/specs/04ranger.php http://199.237.51.208/manuals/sales/c2283d.jpg
Catalina 22's
Hi, That boat looks Ok in the pictures. It has the swing keel (you can see the winch used to raise / lower it in one of the pictures. When the boat is hauled be sure to check that the keel pivots are in good condition. Have you seen this site? http://www.chipford.com/ It has great information on Catalina 22's. A few other random thoughts. In July of 2004 I bought a 1981 Catalina 22 with good sails, including roller furling 150, 1994 trailer (good shape), 1994 Nissan 5 Hp motor for $4500. The boat was very clean and in great shape. I trailer sailed it the rest of the year and put her on a mooring in 2005. In July 2005 I bought a bigger boat (Newport 28) and sold the Catalina for $4000. I didn't do much to the boat except change the headstay (I didn't use the furler properly and put a kink in the origina) and added a tongue extension to the trailer. If you are going to be towing often and some distance I would get a bigger truck. If you will only be towing a few miles your truck will be fine. The trailer should have brakes (preferably surge brakes) and you won't be going real fast anyway. Good luck, Barry
Hi, That boat looks Ok in the pictures. It has the swing keel (you can see the winch used to raise / lower it in one of the pictures. When the boat is hauled be sure to check that the keel pivots are in good condition. Have you seen this site? http://www.chipford.com/ It has great information on Catalina 22's. A few other random thoughts. In July of 2004 I bought a 1981 Catalina 22 with good sails, including roller furling 150, 1994 trailer (good shape), 1994 Nissan 5 Hp motor for $4500. The boat was very clean and in great shape. I trailer sailed it the rest of the year and put her on a mooring in 2005. In July 2005 I bought a bigger boat (Newport 28) and sold the Catalina for $4000. I didn't do much to the boat except change the headstay (I didn't use the furler properly and put a kink in the origina) and added a tongue extension to the trailer. If you are going to be towing often and some distance I would get a bigger truck. If you will only be towing a few miles your truck will be fine. The trailer should have brakes (preferably surge brakes) and you won't be going real fast anyway. Good luck, Barry
Older Cat 22
That Catalina looks good. I have a 1970 #81 Catalina 22 and I like it better that the new Mk11. I'm the orginal owner. I pull my Catalina with a 1979 Chev Van. The One big Item that may be a problem is the Keel hanging. I have the old through hull keel bolt this was a major area for leaks, also check the keel lock down pin in the boat as this is at the water line and sometimes leaks and will rust in place making it unusable. Other than those two problems the boat is great. I paid $3000 for my boat in 1970,that included the trailer. I think that the older Catalinas are better build with thicker fiber glass. When I bought my boat I was told that it was rated for miget ocean racing, but I have great fun in the San Francisco Bay Area. I hopes this helps. Fair Winds AL
That Catalina looks good. I have a 1970 #81 Catalina 22 and I like it better that the new Mk11. I'm the orginal owner. I pull my Catalina with a 1979 Chev Van. The One big Item that may be a problem is the Keel hanging. I have the old through hull keel bolt this was a major area for leaks, also check the keel lock down pin in the boat as this is at the water line and sometimes leaks and will rust in place making it unusable. Other than those two problems the boat is great. I paid $3000 for my boat in 1970,that included the trailer. I think that the older Catalinas are better build with thicker fiber glass. When I bought my boat I was told that it was rated for miget ocean racing, but I have great fun in the San Francisco Bay Area. I hopes this helps. Fair Winds AL
Short tow distance
Ok, from what I hear from a lot of people that respond to my silly questions is that I should be ok with my truck and a Catalina 22. Just some more details on my truck: 1998 2WD, Supercab, 3.0L, Automatic transmission, Ford Ranger. In anticipation of a future boat, I upgraded from the flimsy bumper hitch (2000/200 lbs) to a Class II frame/bumper mount hitch that should handle up to 3500lbs and 350 tongue weight. But then someone mentioned that this boat would put me into the class III range. I figured the Class II hitch would be ok since I didn't want to to anything 3500lbs anyway with a 4,000 lb truck so I didn't get anything bigger than that. I don't plan on towing on the freeway since I'm only about 2 miles from the boat launch in Renton on Lake Washington. So the only time it will probably be towed on the freeway is when I pick up the boat (unless I do get this one which I'll just sail to the launch and pick up). Also, this boat has the trailer extension so the boat can be launched without getting the truck in the water. I figure that this would help also since the truck would remain on dry pavement for pulling the boat out of the water. Am I correct in this thought also? I'm just checking all this out carefully since I don't want to burn out my transmission (only a year old), get stuck at the bottom of a hill unable to pull it home, get pushed down the hill by the boat unable to stop, launch both the truck AND the boat in the lake, or just do something stupid that will make me too embarrassed to ever admit that I had this idea in the first place! Tom - paranoid but asking stupid questions!
Ok, from what I hear from a lot of people that respond to my silly questions is that I should be ok with my truck and a Catalina 22. Just some more details on my truck: 1998 2WD, Supercab, 3.0L, Automatic transmission, Ford Ranger. In anticipation of a future boat, I upgraded from the flimsy bumper hitch (2000/200 lbs) to a Class II frame/bumper mount hitch that should handle up to 3500lbs and 350 tongue weight. But then someone mentioned that this boat would put me into the class III range. I figured the Class II hitch would be ok since I didn't want to to anything 3500lbs anyway with a 4,000 lb truck so I didn't get anything bigger than that. I don't plan on towing on the freeway since I'm only about 2 miles from the boat launch in Renton on Lake Washington. So the only time it will probably be towed on the freeway is when I pick up the boat (unless I do get this one which I'll just sail to the launch and pick up). Also, this boat has the trailer extension so the boat can be launched without getting the truck in the water. I figure that this would help also since the truck would remain on dry pavement for pulling the boat out of the water. Am I correct in this thought also? I'm just checking all this out carefully since I don't want to burn out my transmission (only a year old), get stuck at the bottom of a hill unable to pull it home, get pushed down the hill by the boat unable to stop, launch both the truck AND the boat in the lake, or just do something stupid that will make me too embarrassed to ever admit that I had this idea in the first place!
Tom - paranoid but asking stupid questions!Towing Thoughts
Tegwilym: Joe is right on about weight and class III towing. If all you do is launch and retrieve at marina your little truck might be OK, but if you ever drive over Snoqualamie Pass with the boat/trailer, best to use something heavier. Stopping the boat and truck could be the major issue especially on a steep hill. Hope the trailer has good surge or electric brakes. And maybe you'll like the new boat enough to get a new tow vehicle anyway! Dick K.
Tegwilym: Joe is right on about weight and class III towing. If all you do is launch and retrieve at marina your little truck might be OK, but if you ever drive over Snoqualamie Pass with the boat/trailer, best to use something heavier. Stopping the boat and truck could be the major issue especially on a steep hill. Hope the trailer has good surge or electric brakes. And maybe you'll like the new boat enough to get a new tow vehicle anyway! Dick K.
Mountain passes....no, not going there!
No, I don't plan on towing over the mountains. Just down the hill to the nearby park. No freeway driving required, and for the most part it's just a residential street about half of the distance. I can take the direct route down a hill (somewhat busy street 35mph limit), turn right, and I'm at the lake. Or...take a longer route, less busy street, longer but shallower hill, then find my way to the launch from there. Maybe someday I could look for a cheap used truck that I could use mainly for towing, but for now I don't want to pay insurance on two vehicles. Maybe my next truck will be bigger, but for now I'm staying with the Ranger so I'm hoping that should handle an average 22 foot sailboat. (Catalina 22 or Macgregor 22). I haven't seen a Macgregor 22 yet other than a couple ads on craigslist that just didn't look very promising. Tom
No, I don't plan on towing over the mountains. Just down the hill to the nearby park. No freeway driving required, and for the most part it's just a residential street about half of the distance. I can take the direct route down a hill (somewhat busy street 35mph limit), turn right, and I'm at the lake. Or...take a longer route, less busy street, longer but shallower hill, then find my way to the launch from there. Maybe someday I could look for a cheap used truck that I could use mainly for towing, but for now I don't want to pay insurance on two vehicles. Maybe my next truck will be bigger, but for now I'm staying with the Ranger so I'm hoping that should handle an average 22 foot sailboat. (Catalina 22 or Macgregor 22). I haven't seen a Macgregor 22 yet other than a couple ads on craigslist that just didn't look very promising. Tom
input
I also have a 3.0 V6 Ranger, but mine is 4WD. My boat weighs 3300# dry (says the book) but on the trailer, the whole rig is at or a little over 5000#. I can pretty easily pull it out of the water, but I use low range and all four wheels. Don't know how it would do with 2WD, but mine is a stick, and your automatic will work better going up the ramp - probably it will do fine if your rear wheels are not on wet or muddy ground/paving. If you only have to go a couple of miles, and not on a major highway, you would probably be OK, but remember the rig will most likely outweigh your truck or at least come close, and especially if it doesn't have brakes, you will need a LOT of distance for stopping. Since you only have a short distance, you can most likely nurse it home all right, but if you are involved in an "incident" and are in violation of any trailering laws, guess whose fault it will be. I move my rig around the marina and around my yard and can take it a little ways (1/4 mi) up the road to my buddy's barn (we hang it in straps so as to do bottom work), but I wouldn't take it to the lake (about 50 mi) with my Ranger. If you have to go any real distance, cultivate a friendship with someone who has a bigger truck, then buy him a tank of gas and an oil change or tune up. Much cheaper than buying another truck.
I also have a 3.0 V6 Ranger, but mine is 4WD. My boat weighs 3300# dry (says the book) but on the trailer, the whole rig is at or a little over 5000#. I can pretty easily pull it out of the water, but I use low range and all four wheels. Don't know how it would do with 2WD, but mine is a stick, and your automatic will work better going up the ramp - probably it will do fine if your rear wheels are not on wet or muddy ground/paving. If you only have to go a couple of miles, and not on a major highway, you would probably be OK, but remember the rig will most likely outweigh your truck or at least come close, and especially if it doesn't have brakes, you will need a LOT of distance for stopping. Since you only have a short distance, you can most likely nurse it home all right, but if you are involved in an "incident" and are in violation of any trailering laws, guess whose fault it will be. I move my rig around the marina and around my yard and can take it a little ways (1/4 mi) up the road to my buddy's barn (we hang it in straps so as to do bottom work), but I wouldn't take it to the lake (about 50 mi) with my Ranger. If you have to go any real distance, cultivate a friendship with someone who has a bigger truck, then buy him a tank of gas and an oil change or tune up. Much cheaper than buying another truck.
ranger
So is yours 3300 lbs including the trailer? I know they keep getting heavier with age, but I'm still trying to figure out if this 1971 boat is 1800 or 2490 lbs. I'm just not sure. Not including the trailer of course. Originally I was looking for something like a Macgregor 22 which is 1800lbs and figured that would be about right. Then I looked at this Catalina and really like it and still wonder about weight. My girlfriend does have a 4WD Ford Explorer that would most likely work also. Her bumper hitch is rated for 3500lbs (mine was 2000 lbs - I upgraded to a frame mounted class II hitch, so it could go to 3500lbs now) Again my plan is to leave the boat launch, turn left, go about a mile up a hill (or go around to a longer less-steep hill) and slowly crawl up, turn right, go 2 blocks, then I'm home. Not a long trip at all. It takes me less than 5 minutes to get down there or back. Longer when towing something of course! So it seems that about 75% of the opinions say "go for it, you'll be fine" then there is a few other guys that say "Should be ok, but watch yourself". I will tow it out of the lake as a test when the owner can meet me again with the trailer, then I'll see how things work out. Great forum though, thanks again for all the advice I'm getting from everyone! Tom
So is yours 3300 lbs including the trailer? I know they keep getting heavier with age, but I'm still trying to figure out if this 1971 boat is 1800 or 2490 lbs. I'm just not sure. Not including the trailer of course. Originally I was looking for something like a Macgregor 22 which is 1800lbs and figured that would be about right. Then I looked at this Catalina and really like it and still wonder about weight. My girlfriend does have a 4WD Ford Explorer that would most likely work also. Her bumper hitch is rated for 3500lbs (mine was 2000 lbs - I upgraded to a frame mounted class II hitch, so it could go to 3500lbs now) Again my plan is to leave the boat launch, turn left, go about a mile up a hill (or go around to a longer less-steep hill) and slowly crawl up, turn right, go 2 blocks, then I'm home. Not a long trip at all. It takes me less than 5 minutes to get down there or back. Longer when towing something of course! So it seems that about 75% of the opinions say "go for it, you'll be fine" then there is a few other guys that say "Should be ok, but watch yourself". I will tow it out of the lake as a test when the owner can meet me again with the trailer, then I'll see how things work out. Great forum though, thanks again for all the advice I'm getting from everyone! Tom
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