The 26S gets a +1 for sailing in skinny water. A fully ballasted boat with a swing keel that can ride over obstructions without damaging the boat.
Lock the keel down? or not?
- Thread starter pulsewave
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I'd have to agree with this statement. I was looking for a 26S but when I stumbled upon this 26D I couldn't pass it up.
Thanks everyone for the great info and insight. Nice to have such a congenial and respectful forum. One follow up question in case anyone wants to weigh in. I was wondering how easy the lock bolt is to remove if the sailboat (and keel) gets lodged on a reef or sandbar. I can image a scenario where the boat/keel is lodged (perhaps where the boat is taking wind from the side) - with keel getting torqued and twisted while the person tries to dislodge the pin and swing the keel up. Any thoughts? Again, thanks for the help on these issues, as I'm still learning the ropes.
It would also be interesting to know if anyone knows of a case where the boat was seriously heeled over, with lock bolt not installed, and the keel swung up into the trunk. Ocean sailing I can see wave action having a big bearing on this, but lake sailing I can't envision a situation where the keel would move much unless the boat was already past 90* heel.
I'm not promoting one way or the other, but I am curious of actual case history.
I'm not promoting one way or the other, but I am curious of actual case history.
I have grounded on sand, tearing a small arc in my keel trunk and bending the lockbolt. I was able to finagle it out.
I will step out on the limb and say I believe its impossible for a 600lb keel with a bit of friction at the side of the trunk to overcome gravity and swing upwards, and remain there.... but as you say, when the boat approaches 90degrees there may be a problem, and as it exceeds 90 degrees, there will be a problem.
when the masthead is in the water, the boat is past 90degrees, and if the sail gets water in/on it, the angle can be held long enough for the keel to swing into the trunk... probably not with enough power to cause damage, but it will remove a very high percentage of the righting ability the keel offers the boat when extended. so when the keel swings into the trunk, the boat will turtle without any chance of it righting itself.... if by some chance before the sails fill with water and before the boat turtles, a rogue wave from the other direction does set the boat back up, the keel slamming down will be a fearful and damaging event... and may very well be sunk because of it.
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I had a mac25 for 12 years, significantly over powered with over sized spinnaker that I'd leave out too long in strong wind. Knocked it down several times. Keel not locked. No harm done. Tiller pilot helped recovering. Wear a life jacked. I rarely locked iron keel, called it my mechanical depth finder. Good boat for gunk holing.
I sail on Chesapeake, and with a 2-foot chop, the keel would swing and bang into the hull with enough force to shake the boat. I can assure you that I was not far from developing a crack at the point where the edge of a 600 lbs sheet of iron slammed into a fiberglass...
I briefly knew a guy who had sailed a V-21 out of Eureka harbor w/o the swing keel locked down. A huge wave flipped the boat and the keel slammed into the bottom and destroyed the boat. He was lucky the coastguard was watching but he was still more dead than alive when they got him. Lots of people saw the whole thing.
Hello. I'm Carlton and in May purchased a Mac Venture 25 and going through her. I just removed the keel to clean it up and paint. Read this post and didn't know about locking the keel. So my first thought was you just lower it, but now I'm puzzled. If there is a locking pin, where?
Yep. There should be 2 rubber covers about 2 inches in diameter covering the holes in the trunk - one for the swivel bolt and the other for the locking pin. in my 25, I lower the keel to vertical and then give between 10 and 20 cranks until I see a locking hole in the keel, and then I insert the locking pin.
if your keel is out, it should have 2 different holes - one for the keel bolt, the other for your locking pin.
I prefer not to lock a swing keel or center board in the down position so-as to prevent damage if I hit something. Most of them have plenty of mass to prevent it from beginning to rotate up. That said, I also use a depth/fish finder with minimum depth alerts set. As the bottom comes up, I watch the depth. If I get distracted, the finder will will alarm while I still have some maneuvering room.
The MAC 26S has a swing centerboard and a swing rudder. The rudder was originally equipped with a shear pin made from delrin (a plastic material) to lock the rudder in the down position. The delrin pins are still available for about $8-10 for a pack of 5. The delrin pin has a shear strength of 150-175 pounds. It will keep the rudder down but easily shear to prevent significant damage if something is hit. The centerboard has no mechanism to lock it down and relies solely on gravity. I choose not to use the delrin pins on my rudder. Instead, I use a lighter cord as a downhaul for the rudder blade. A lighter cord with a rating of 50 to 90 pounds should be able to keep it down but still break if you hit something.
In the case of the keel or centerboard, it is possible that flow could provide some rotating lift moment reducing the effectiveness of the foil to prevent slippage but it is unlikely by a significant amount.
In the case ion the rudder, if not held down, flow can cause enough rotation lift to significantly increase your weather helm to the point where you will have trouble controlling the boat in any fresh breeze and wear your arm out as well. Best to locket down somehow.
The MAC 26S has a swing centerboard and a swing rudder. The rudder was originally equipped with a shear pin made from delrin (a plastic material) to lock the rudder in the down position. The delrin pins are still available for about $8-10 for a pack of 5. The delrin pin has a shear strength of 150-175 pounds. It will keep the rudder down but easily shear to prevent significant damage if something is hit. The centerboard has no mechanism to lock it down and relies solely on gravity. I choose not to use the delrin pins on my rudder. Instead, I use a lighter cord as a downhaul for the rudder blade. A lighter cord with a rating of 50 to 90 pounds should be able to keep it down but still break if you hit something.
In the case of the keel or centerboard, it is possible that flow could provide some rotating lift moment reducing the effectiveness of the foil to prevent slippage but it is unlikely by a significant amount.
In the case ion the rudder, if not held down, flow can cause enough rotation lift to significantly increase your weather helm to the point where you will have trouble controlling the boat in any fresh breeze and wear your arm out as well. Best to locket down somehow.
I found the keel locking bolt. It was bent and has cut about 1-1/2 inch slot. It took a bit to get it out. So, I think the previous owner didn't lock the keel and left the bolt in place, causing it to whack at it and bend it. Now the question is, how to fix it? It looks like it's above the water line, but if I just leave it and only put the bolt in when I lock the keel, it will follow the worn slot. It isn't easy to get to for repairing.
I had the same issue with my V-222 (which is why I got it fairy cheaply). You're right, it is above the waterline. The problem is that water splashes through the slot while the boat is moving. I took the boat out once before repairing it and in 8 hours of sailing she took on about 6 gallons of water. Not dangerous but definitely not acceptable either. I ended up using the following procedure to repair it:
1: Cut access hole through the hull liner.
2: Place a floor jack under the forward end of the keel and raise it enough to remove the pivot bolt.
3: Keeping some tension on the keel winch lower the keel with the jack enough to gain access to the inside of the keel trunk.
3: Patch one side of the trunk.
4: Replace keel and pivot bolt and launch boat.
5: While on the water lower keel into position and use the keel lock-down hole to align the drill to make a hole in the new patch.
6: Spend the rest of the day sailing. (only took on 2-1/2 gallons of water this time.)
7: Bring the boat home and repeat process for second side of keel trunk.
Hint: I found it helpful to make an X over the pivot hole in the keel and paint each quadrant a different color. Seeing what color showed through the hole in the trunk allowed me to know which direction the keel needed to go while trying to realign it.
Thank you Bud. The good thing is, my keel is out and I am refinishing it. So I can fix to locking pin issues before taking her out. I'm hoping not to have to cutting any access holes in the cabin. The port side is easier by going through the seat access port, but the starboard side is the harder side.
I like the painting the keel different colors to help alignment.
I like the painting the keel different colors to help alignment.
Previous owner hit a rock with his pin in. I found out he tested the flotation in Buzzards Bay! I saw the repair two years after I bought the boat. Sloppy job. Clear arc about 10" long cut through the glass. It was glassed over and a source of water leaking into bilge. I re-glassed it from the inside on both sides. I then glassed the trunk side with shaved glass and epoxy. Just to fill the depression. Tight spot. Too narrow to get your hand in. While I was in there I took a couple two inch strips of glass/ epoxy and made wear surfaces for were the keel contacted the trunk. It tightened up the space a little and acts a sacrificial surface against the keel. I still need to drill out the holes for the pin. I purchased 3/8" friction plugs and 3/8" nylon threaded rod, washers and wingnuts. Like NASA I made two. One for spare. I just never finished the repair. I think I will bring my drill this weekend and get it done. I will be in a quiet location in Cuttyhunk pond.
The story about the keel smashing the boat makes sense, That would suck. All it would take is a random breaking wave at the wrong time. I have seen them. I do my fair share of deep water passages with the wind and waves on the beam. During those times I would lock it. You just never know when a good blow can happen. Especially this time the year with storms.
If you guys have a chance check out the article I wrote on our web page. Got caught in a squall last year in Buzzards Bay in my little V25. It is called TsatzSue's Vineyard Sound Crawl. That was a tough morning. Kinda put things in perspective. The sea is a powerful and beautiful place.
http://www.ne-ts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=452
Happy Sailing Everyone!!
Ken B.
CMDRE
North East Trailer Sailor Yacht Club
The story about the keel smashing the boat makes sense, That would suck. All it would take is a random breaking wave at the wrong time. I have seen them. I do my fair share of deep water passages with the wind and waves on the beam. During those times I would lock it. You just never know when a good blow can happen. Especially this time the year with storms.
If you guys have a chance check out the article I wrote on our web page. Got caught in a squall last year in Buzzards Bay in my little V25. It is called TsatzSue's Vineyard Sound Crawl. That was a tough morning. Kinda put things in perspective. The sea is a powerful and beautiful place.
http://www.ne-ts.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=452
Happy Sailing Everyone!!
Ken B.
CMDRE
North East Trailer Sailor Yacht Club