Lithium cold storage question

[ice breaker]

I want to convert my lead bank to Lithium. The potential problem is my jan-feb temps can approach -11F as measured in the boat. Most of the literature I have read, give a cold storage of no lower than 10 to 14 F. Any body have any real world experience with cold storage on the great lakes or elsewhere?

And NO I will not take them home every year at haul out. I am trying to make my life easier not harder.

Thanks

 

[jssailem]

I am trying to make my life easier not harder.

I want the benefits of Lithium batteries. I, therefore, put up with any pain that may cause.

The batteries' chemistry works well when the temperatures are within the range identified by the manufacturer. This provides a long life and excellent power storage.

When I have something temperature-sensitive outside, I provide a source of heat to keep the thing(person) from freezing solid. It is the cost of possession. When temperatures drop below freezing, the car comes into the garage, the truck gets the engine block heater plugged in, and my wife gets to hog the down comforter.

We each have to make sacrifices.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Have you read Maine Sail's guides to LFP? www.marinehowto.com

He lives in Maine and has had LFP for 15 years.

 

[Davidasailor26]

What LiFePO4 batteries are you looking at with a storage temperature that high? Victron lithium, for example, has a minimum storage temperature of -45C ( https://www.victronenergy.com/uploa...lithium-iron-phosphate-batteries-Smart-EN.pdf ). The typical problem with lithium is that they can’t be charged near or below freezing, but just sitting idle should be pretty forgiving.

 

[ice breaker]

What LiFePO4 batteries are you looking at with a storage temperature that high? Victron lithium, for example, has a minimum storage temperature of -45C ( https://www.victronenergy.com/uploa...lithium-iron-phosphate-batteries-Smart-EN.pdf ). The typical problem with lithium is that they can’t be charged near or below freezing, but just sitting idle should be pretty forgiving.

Thanks for the link. Very interesting.

Epoch has conflicting data on there site. One data sheet shows 10F as low storage, another shows down to -4F for up to a month, then another shows greater than a month of storage at 32f. LiTime tech support got back to me with 14F as the low for storage and also said not to let them discharge below 50%.

This is part of the reason I am looking for some real world data points.

Thanks again.

 

[marcham]

Do you have shore power when the boat is in storage? If so, most modern lifepo4 have a self-heating feature....

 

[ice breaker]

Unfortunately not. Thanks for the idea.

 

[dlochner]

I want to convert my lead bank to Lithium. The potential problem is my jan-feb temps can approach -11F as measured in the boat. Most of the literature I have read, give a cold storage of no lower than 10 to 14 F. Any body have any real world experience with cold storage on the great lakes or elsewhere?

And NO I will not take them home every year at haul out. I am trying to make my life easier not harder.

Thanks

The most prudent course will be to find a battery manufacturer who says their battery can be stored at the temperatures you expect and go with that company. That may mean you will have to purchase more expensive batteries. If it is a reputable company, like Victron, I would expect them to stand behind their product.

The alternatives are taking the batteries out or taking your chances with the cold.

Generally LFP batteries do not like be put on a float charge and do not like being stored at high SOCs. Some BMS's may have a "storage" mode for long term storage.

 

[marcham]

Unfortunately not. Thanks for the idea.

In that case, irrespective of what any manufacturer says, I would suggest your only course of action is to remove the batteries. If you stick to 200Ah, they are very manageable.... (lighter than a group 31 AGM).

Considering what they cost and that the ROI only makes sense if you get 3000 + cycles / 10 years out of them ..... it's worth looking after the batteries.

 

[ice breaker]

I think the best solution is to move the boat south!

 

[jssailem]

How far South are you willing to go?

Out of the COLD zone and into the HURRICANE zone?

 

[marcham]

Last I checked, tail end of hurricanes go all the way to Nova Scotia... Plenty of cold there!

 

[danstanford]

I had an Oceanvolt electric boat with 4 Lithium batteries and the manufacturer said run them down a bit and leave them in the boat. This worked perfectly for the 10 years the boat was around on the north shore of Lake Ontario.

 

[sailme88]

Batteries create electricity.... electricity can be used to provide heat...heat will keep your batteries within range... solar panels will charge the batteries... exercising the batteries in a use ( heating) charge with solar is also a benefit....

 

[dlochner]

Last I checked, tail end of hurricanes go all the way to Nova Scotia... Plenty of cold there!

Yep. We sat through the tail end of 3 hurricanes this year. 1 near Montreal and 2 in Charlottetown, PEI, while Newfoundland was getting hammered.

 

[MFD]

Presuming you have shore power or another way to keep the batteries charged, there are quite a few options now for LifePO4 with self heating built in.