Been reading alot of info from this site. Have a couple of questions. Looking for a diagram and parts list to run the topping lift, outhaul, and main halyard and maybe the jib halyard into the cockpit. I have a winch and lewmar rope clutches for the cabin top. The spar on my 23 is z-spar and it currently has jaws in the end of the boom to cleat the topping lift, outhaul and reefing line. Want to take those jaws out and replace with rollers, lead down to turning blocks then aft. Next question, I currently sail my boat out of Hillsboro Inlet in Lighthouse Point, Fl. Do club races and have done well but feel there is more in the boat. Have a 135 and the original 110, and will probably spring for a new main this spring. What is the right wind speed to switch from the 135 to the 110. And someone said don't over heel the boat. What percent of heel is best? Thanks
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To Been There
With the current configuration the topping lift slips in the jaws at the boom or sometimes get tangled in the back stay adjuster. suppose there could be an alternative, like a ridged boom vang. I am aware that this may not be all that important but since I was asking anyway.
With the current configuration the topping lift slips in the jaws at the boom or sometimes get tangled in the back stay adjuster. suppose there could be an alternative, like a ridged boom vang. I am aware that this may not be all that important but since I was asking anyway.
Something to consider...
...When running the lines back to the cockpit is how you plan to route them over the cabintop. I have routed the main and jib halyards for my H23 back to the cockpit, but I had to put one on each side of the boat- There isn't enough space (width) at the forward edge of the handrails on the deck to route more than one or two lines without rubbing up against the gel coat for the base of the handholds (producing chafe, friction, and potentially wearing through the gel coat). I suppose you could alleviate this by elevating the winch, rope clutches, and deck organizer by about 1-1/2 to 2 inches... Another item of interest (I discovered this one the hard way
) involves your mast-raising and lowering technique - If you use the jib halyard to raise and lower your mast, then you'll want to keep the winch/cleat combination that's already on the mast- Trying to pay out the jib halyard to the winch on the cabintop can get awkward (at best). Using the winch on the mast, I found I have much better control during the lowering process. As far as leading the outhaul, topping lift, and reefing lines back, it sounds like you've got a good basic plan. Bear in mind that if you cleat these off on deck, the tension on these lines will increase as the boom swings away from the centerline of the boat (The exit point for these lines is far enough away from the gooseneck to make this a factor). Personally, I'd just leave the cam-locks, but I'm a "BBQ Grill & Cold beverage sailor", not trying to win races- I don't fuss over these lines too much. If you'd like to see pictures of how I ran my lines aft (I used a VERY simple method), I can take pictures and E-mail them to you. Drop me a line at jonbastien@yahoo.com or leave a message for me on HOW and I'll get back to you as soon as I can! --Jon Bastien H23 '2 Sheets to the Wind'
...When running the lines back to the cockpit is how you plan to route them over the cabintop. I have routed the main and jib halyards for my H23 back to the cockpit, but I had to put one on each side of the boat- There isn't enough space (width) at the forward edge of the handrails on the deck to route more than one or two lines without rubbing up against the gel coat for the base of the handholds (producing chafe, friction, and potentially wearing through the gel coat). I suppose you could alleviate this by elevating the winch, rope clutches, and deck organizer by about 1-1/2 to 2 inches... Another item of interest (I discovered this one the hard way
) involves your mast-raising and lowering technique - If you use the jib halyard to raise and lower your mast, then you'll want to keep the winch/cleat combination that's already on the mast- Trying to pay out the jib halyard to the winch on the cabintop can get awkward (at best). Using the winch on the mast, I found I have much better control during the lowering process. As far as leading the outhaul, topping lift, and reefing lines back, it sounds like you've got a good basic plan. Bear in mind that if you cleat these off on deck, the tension on these lines will increase as the boom swings away from the centerline of the boat (The exit point for these lines is far enough away from the gooseneck to make this a factor). Personally, I'd just leave the cam-locks, but I'm a "BBQ Grill & Cold beverage sailor", not trying to win races- I don't fuss over these lines too much. If you'd like to see pictures of how I ran my lines aft (I used a VERY simple method), I can take pictures and E-mail them to you. Drop me a line at jonbastien@yahoo.com or leave a message for me on HOW and I'll get back to you as soon as I can! --Jon Bastien H23 '2 Sheets to the Wind'Oh, another thought.
I just re-read your post and had a few other thoughts. 1.) Recommend you route over the starboard side of the boat - No worries about drilling holes into the interior lighting, or hitting one of the electrical lines. 2.) Strongly recommend a backing plate for your winch and clutches- THat part of the cabintop isn't reinforced, as far as I know. 3.) As an afterthought, I wish I had invested in some kind of line bag to put on the bulkhead - Even with just the halyards, the cockpit can very quickly become a mess-o'-spaghetti when raising the sails and setting jib sheets. This could be avoided with a bag to catch the lines as they're being hoisted. 4.) Afterthought, part two: If you want to route the topping lift et al to the cockpit, you might want to run them to a turning block near the gooseneck on the mast, first- That should get rid of the varying-tension problem. As far as the jib choices go, I'm not much help- I only have the 110 that came with the boat. I can only imagine what the 135 would do... A note on the heeling question- My experience has been that the 23 actually moves forward faster when heeled only to about 15 degrees, rather than "burying the rail". If you heel this boat over too far, it tends to slide sideways more than it moves forward. --Jon Bastien H23 '2 Sheets to the Wind'
I just re-read your post and had a few other thoughts. 1.) Recommend you route over the starboard side of the boat - No worries about drilling holes into the interior lighting, or hitting one of the electrical lines. 2.) Strongly recommend a backing plate for your winch and clutches- THat part of the cabintop isn't reinforced, as far as I know. 3.) As an afterthought, I wish I had invested in some kind of line bag to put on the bulkhead - Even with just the halyards, the cockpit can very quickly become a mess-o'-spaghetti when raising the sails and setting jib sheets. This could be avoided with a bag to catch the lines as they're being hoisted. 4.) Afterthought, part two: If you want to route the topping lift et al to the cockpit, you might want to run them to a turning block near the gooseneck on the mast, first- That should get rid of the varying-tension problem. As far as the jib choices go, I'm not much help- I only have the 110 that came with the boat. I can only imagine what the 135 would do... A note on the heeling question- My experience has been that the 23 actually moves forward faster when heeled only to about 15 degrees, rather than "burying the rail". If you heel this boat over too far, it tends to slide sideways more than it moves forward. --Jon Bastien H23 '2 Sheets to the Wind'
Lines run aft.
Jon, Thanks for the guidelines , you are most helpful. Where do you sail? Gotta run, talk to you later.
Jon, Thanks for the guidelines , you are most helpful. Where do you sail? Gotta run, talk to you later.
No problem!
Hi Darrell, No problem sharing what I know, although there are many on this site who know the boat better than I do. When I get to sail, I've been sailing out of Key West and Stock Island (here at the end of US-1). If you're ever down this way, I know where the only 2 ramps in town that are deep enough for a 23 are located! ;o) --Jon Bastien jonbastien@yahoo.com
Hi Darrell, No problem sharing what I know, although there are many on this site who know the boat better than I do. When I get to sail, I've been sailing out of Key West and Stock Island (here at the end of US-1). If you're ever down this way, I know where the only 2 ramps in town that are deep enough for a 23 are located! ;o) --Jon Bastien jonbastien@yahoo.com
No problem!
Hi Darrell, No problem sharing what I know, although there are many on this site who know the boat better than I do. When I get to sail, I've been sailing out of Key West and Stock Island (here at the end of US-1). If you're ever down this way, I know where the only 2 ramps in town that are deep enough for a 23 are located! ;o) --Jon Bastien jonbastien@yahoo.com
Hi Darrell, No problem sharing what I know, although there are many on this site who know the boat better than I do. When I get to sail, I've been sailing out of Key West and Stock Island (here at the end of US-1). If you're ever down this way, I know where the only 2 ramps in town that are deep enough for a 23 are located! ;o) --Jon Bastien jonbastien@yahoo.com
halyards aft - yes
Darrel: I led my halyards aft seveal years ago and it works find. I cut a 2nd exit on the starboard side of my mast, led both lines down to turning blocks just above the mast tabernacle, then out to the side and through turning blocks to run aft just inside the handrail to a rope cluch and winch at the aft end of the cabin. Yes, the lines sit on the top of the cabin, but no wear is visible. Make sure you put backing plates under everything. You could do something similar with your outhaul, uphaul and reefing lines, but do you actually adjust them that much outside of racing? About using and switching your 110% and 135%. My H23 had a 100%, and I added a 150% and track on the side decks to provide an adjustable lead. I use the 150% until it feels like I'm being overpowered by it, somewhere around 15 kts. of wind, then change to the 100%. The 150% makes the boatt pleasantly fast. The only time I use the 100% in under 15 kts wind is if I'm feeling truly lazy. Jim Kolstoe H23 "Kara's Boo"
Darrel: I led my halyards aft seveal years ago and it works find. I cut a 2nd exit on the starboard side of my mast, led both lines down to turning blocks just above the mast tabernacle, then out to the side and through turning blocks to run aft just inside the handrail to a rope cluch and winch at the aft end of the cabin. Yes, the lines sit on the top of the cabin, but no wear is visible. Make sure you put backing plates under everything. You could do something similar with your outhaul, uphaul and reefing lines, but do you actually adjust them that much outside of racing? About using and switching your 110% and 135%. My H23 had a 100%, and I added a 150% and track on the side decks to provide an adjustable lead. I use the 150% until it feels like I'm being overpowered by it, somewhere around 15 kts. of wind, then change to the 100%. The 150% makes the boatt pleasantly fast. The only time I use the 100% in under 15 kts wind is if I'm feeling truly lazy. Jim Kolstoe H23 "Kara's Boo"
me too
I also have both lines running aft. My boat came set up that way. the lines run into clutches and I have a winch on the cabin. It is very east to raise and lower single handed, which is something I do often. I have a 150 sail with the tracks on the decks. I don't like it over about 15-20 knots. to much power I will be switching over to a roller furling this spring. I believe that will help. Good luck with the conversion!
I also have both lines running aft. My boat came set up that way. the lines run into clutches and I have a winch on the cabin. It is very east to raise and lower single handed, which is something I do often. I have a 150 sail with the tracks on the decks. I don't like it over about 15-20 knots. to much power I will be switching over to a roller furling this spring. I believe that will help. Good luck with the conversion!
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