Lexan for Dodger Windows

[Charlie98117]

It's time to replace the dodger so I've been talking to some shops. I'm looking at one proposal that wants to use 20 mil lexan instead of the 40 mil clear vinyl everyone else proposes. I've done some research and see that with proper care lexan is a good product but I'm wondering about the thickness, does that seem too thin? Is thinner better only better for rolling up (which I don't do often) or are there other concerns?

 

[Gunni]

No to polycarbonate (Lexan), ask for Strataglass.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

No to polycarbonate (Lexan), ask for Strataglass.

My dodger windows have always been Strataglass. First windows lasted 15 years and then had them re-done with Strataglass a couple of years ago. Expensive but well worth it for clarity.

 

[thinwater]

I think you are not understanding the OP. There are new semiflexible materials (Macralon) out there that do not roll-up but do give MUCH better visibility than products like Strataglass (and BTW, O'sea may be better than Strataglass, just not as well known in marine circles). And although Lexan gets a bad rap for hatch lenses, perhaps it outwears soft vinyl a ton.

I'd like to hear from folks that have lived with Makralon for a while.

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

Our dodger guy talked us into using Makrolon on our fixed dodger and 'canvas' bimini' about 4 years ago to improve visibility and durability. Previously, I had never heard of it.

It won't scratch or craze like other materials.Great stuff much better than Stratoglas which it replaced. Not as flexible (depending on what thickness sheet you chose) but we can still unzip the fwd window and flip it up to promote ventilation. It had UV inhibitors which is particularly important here to preserve longevity . Consequently, we don't need to cover the Windows like everyone else does.

I was assured we could use Rain-X type compounds without damaging the Markalon and water beads and runs off just like windshield wipers were on. The Bimini window has a nice blue tint to exaggerate the sky color, something which seems trivial but is indicative of the choices available compared with the old school stuff.

 

[Maine Sail]

I think you are not understanding the OP. There are new semiflexible materials (Macralon) out there that do not roll-up but do give MUCH better visibility than products like Strataglass (and BTW, O'sea may be better than Strataglass, just not as well known in marine circles). And although Lexan gets a bad rap for hatch lenses, perhaps it outwears soft vinyl a ton.

I'd like to hear from folks that have lived with Makralon for a while.

Bingo!! Makrolon AR (abrasion resistant) is what you'd want but you want it double sided AR or Makrolon AR-2 vs. just AR-1.... If you go Makrolon you should not fold or roll it. Folding or rolling destroys all dodger windows yet I see folks abuse $5000.00 dodgers all the time..

If you want to see clearly Makrolon AR-2 is simply amazing. EZ2CY is another top notch extremely clear product that is an acrylic hybrid. Strataglass & O'Sullivan's O'sea is a good alternative to Makrolon or EZ2CY but nowhere near as optically clear.

 

[Spindrift NH]

My experience is that EZT2CY is somewhat brittle and will crack. Replacing an EZ2CY panel is difficult as it's adhered to the material(usually Stamoid). Makrolon on the other hand is not brittle and can be stitched in place making any replacement much easier.
Anyone bringing a broken EX2CY enclosure panel to our shop gets Makrolon for a replacement and it's not an easy job, all the little shards of glass have to be removed from the binding without tearing the material and that can take hours!
If you're looking for roll-up goods, go with the sheet vinyl vs. the rolled vinyl. Sheet goods are laminated so hold their shape better and have better optics. When you see enclosure windows that are all warped, wrinkled, and saggy, your looking at rolled goods.

 

[Maine Sail]

My experience is that EZT2CY is somewhat brittle and will crack. Replacing an EZ2CY panel is difficult as it's adhered to the material(usually Stamoid). Makrolon on the other hand is not brittle and can be stitched in place making any replacement much easier.
Anyone bringing a broken EX2CY enclosure panel to our shop gets Makrolon for a replacement and it's not an easy job, all the little shards of glass have to be removed from the binding without tearing the material and that can take hours!
If you're looking for roll-up goods, go with the sheet vinyl vs. the rolled vinyl. Sheet goods are laminated so hold their shape better and have better optics. When you see enclosure windows that are all warped, wrinkled, and saggy, your looking at rolled goods.

I had been told EZ2CY changed their formulation to make it less brittle. Any truth to that or will it still crack when whipped by a sheet? I went Makrolon AR-2 in 2009 and it I s as clear today as it was when new. Absolutely no visible or clarity changes in 7 years. IMAR is all that has or ever will touch it. I am beginning to think the Makrolon AR-2 is going to outlast the Sunbrella. If I had known how good it was then I would have gone Stamoid not Sunbrella..

 

[Gunni]

If you go Makrolon you should not fold or roll it. Folding or rolling destroys all dodger windows yet I see folks abuse $5000.00 dodgers all the time..

Which kind of negates the ability to reduce windage on a boat being prepared for a blow. You should be able to easily strike a dodger and Bimini to reduce the load on your docklines, anchor or mooring. I've been rolling up dodger windows all my life, and my 10 year old Strataglass rolls just fine, looks great. It also folds down nicely with the dodger where it can be laced to the deck. There are real good reasons for Dodgers to fold up.

 

[Maine Sail]

Which kind of negates the ability to reduce windage on a boat being prepared for a blow. You should be able to easily strike a dodger and Bimini to reduce the load on your docklines, anchor or mooring. I've been rolling up dodger windows all my life, and my 10 year old Strataglass rolls just fine, looks great. It also folds down nicely with the dodger where it can be laced to the deck. There are real good reasons for Dodgers to fold up.

With a well designed & constructed dodger, & most are not, there is no reason to ever roll a window or to fold a window. I have not rolled a dodger window in over 25 years. Boat owners are forced to roll windows because canvas makers take shortcuts. I have had multiple different designs that don't require rolling. My favorite is a California style (removable side curtains), with a double articulating center window which can flip open and lay on top of the dodger or be clipped under the dodger.

Even when we owned many different dodgers/boats, with Strataglass, we never rolled a window, did not need to. Our current dodger is a three piece California style with an articulating center window and removable side curtains. The side curtains go into a fleece lined storage bag and slide under a berth cushion, you never even know they are there. With the side curtains removed the main part of the dodger zips off in less than two minutes. For stowability it's a tri-fold design with fleece pads placed between the windows that allow the glass to remain flat, only the Sunbrella part of the dodger gets folded and the front windows triple stacked. It is then stowed below, if need be. Striking the entire dodger an stowing it takes about 4 minutes and the bimini another minute.

With all the lobster pots & fog in Maine occluded visibility is just not something I want to deal with..

 

[Charlie98117]

I think you are not understanding the OP. There are new semiflexible materials (Macralon) out there that do not roll-up but do give MUCH better visibility than products like Strataglass (and BTW, O'sea may be better than Strataglass, just not as well known in marine circles). And although Lexan gets a bad rap for hatch lenses, perhaps it outwears soft vinyl a ton.

This has been a very informative thread but the product the canvas guy actually proposed is a 20 mil Lexan film. The data sheet says it has UV and abrasion resistant coatings on both sides but that is still quite different than the Makrolon which as I understand is 60 mil. I thought it sounded too thin because I was usually seeing references to 40 mil vinyl or Strataglass or the Makrolon.

Maine Sail's windows really do look great and I don't really want to spend a bunch on a dodger that isn't right. Guess I need to break out a few more boat bucks.

 

[Spindrift NH]

I had been told EZ2CY changed their formulation to make it less brittle. Any truth to that or will it still crack when whipped by a sheet? I went Makrolon AR-2 in 2009 and it I s as clear today as it was when new. Absolutely no visible or clarity changes in 7 years. IMAR is all that has or ever will touch it. I am beginning to think the Makrolon AR-2 is going to outlast the Sunbrella. If I had known how good it was then I would have gone Stamoid not Sunbrella..

I couldn't say if they changed their formulation, I do know that I continue to see broken panels come into the shop. Two from Hermine. I spent 3 hours removing an EZ2CY glass(40x27) from an enclosure panel yesterday. I know that if we had to remove a Makrolon panel it would take about 10 minutes, simply cut the stitching to get it out.
Stamoid is a good choice for larger biminis and enclosure panels but I don't think it would make good dodger material mainly because it will not keep tension on the side of the dodger, just below the radius of the bows, as well as the solution dyed acrylics(Sunbrella). I am rebuilding my bimini, dodger, ect and will be using a coated solution dyed acrylic for the top parts to achieve better water repellency. The Sunbrella version of which is called Seamark. There are other brands of soulution dyed acrylic out there which are actually better at longevity and water repellancy but don't have as many colors to choose from.

 

[Gunni]

There are other brands of soulution dyed acrylic out there which are actually better at longevity and water repellancy but don't have as many colors to choose from.

I would be very interested in hearing about these alternatives. My 10 y.o. Sunbrella dodger is on it's last few years and it is time to spec the replacement.

 

[SFS]

I would as well, as my bimini is on its last season.