does anyone have any experience with lazy jacks. Do they cause additional or excessive chafing to the main? Thanks Dennis
lazy jacks
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Chafe isn't the problem...
I added lazy jacks on my Oday 28 about 3 years ago. I haven't had any chafe problems to speak of, and it makes flaking the sail neater on the boom easier, but it also makes raising and lowering it harder. The battens are always getting caught on the jack lines on the way up, and on the way down. Personally I think it's more trouble than it's worth, and I'm planning on taking mine off this summer.
I added lazy jacks on my Oday 28 about 3 years ago. I haven't had any chafe problems to speak of, and it makes flaking the sail neater on the boom easier, but it also makes raising and lowering it harder. The battens are always getting caught on the jack lines on the way up, and on the way down. Personally I think it's more trouble than it's worth, and I'm planning on taking mine off this summer.
I agree with rogkee
I couldn't agree with rogkee more. My Catalina 30 came with them and it took about two weeks till I went up the mast and took them down. Every time I used the main I had to deal with the lazy jacks. If your boat has a large main, that you feel you need something, I like the dutchman. I sail on my dad's tartan 4100 and with that large a sail, it makes sense to have something. Just on sailer's option, -Andrew Modus Vivendi
I couldn't agree with rogkee more. My Catalina 30 came with them and it took about two weeks till I went up the mast and took them down. Every time I used the main I had to deal with the lazy jacks. If your boat has a large main, that you feel you need something, I like the dutchman. I sail on my dad's tartan 4100 and with that large a sail, it makes sense to have something. Just on sailer's option, -Andrew Modus Vivendi
Dennis, I think that lazy jacks are great--on a cat boat with a long boom, but for a sloop you're better off installing a sail jock under your boom. A good topping lift is also needed. I'm not against lazy jacks, but not on my boat, because a lot of times I'll stop and anchor for a half hour or so to take my dog over to curb her, and I always cover my sail. I just think that having lazy jacks would hinder my efforts to get my sail covered. My sails are old but they are in excellent shape because I've managed to keep the sun from rotting them out. Two years ago, someone on this forum posted a site called sail ties, and I sent it to my friend Walter, God rest his soul, who made a sail jock for his Mac 26 from this site, and he said that it worked out great for him. I'm using an old Davis Sail Jock that is no longer being sold, and one of the plastic hooks got broken last year, so I intend on retiring the old Davis for this particular type of sail jock, and all we're talking about is some plastic hooks and Bungee cord, which is very cheap and economical, yet will do the job. Joe
It depends on your outlook
Lazy jacks came on my O'Day 302 I bought 3 years ago. I don't like them -- they catch the battens when raising the sail and it's a pain to get the sail cover to fit around them. BUT....my friend/crew who is the guy who goes forward and wrestles with the mainsail says they're absolutely worth it. In fact, last year the lines started to fall apart and I suggested taking the entire contraption off the mast. He was pretty emphatic about their usefulness -- and now I have brand new lines and blocks. As Einstein said, It's all relative.
Lazy jacks came on my O'Day 302 I bought 3 years ago. I don't like them -- they catch the battens when raising the sail and it's a pain to get the sail cover to fit around them. BUT....my friend/crew who is the guy who goes forward and wrestles with the mainsail says they're absolutely worth it. In fact, last year the lines started to fall apart and I suggested taking the entire contraption off the mast. He was pretty emphatic about their usefulness -- and now I have brand new lines and blocks. As Einstein said, It's all relative.
Lazy Jacks reply
I think it all depends on how large your boat is. If I had a 30' boat I'd probably want lazy jacks on it too. As it is, I can get away with a sail jock on a 222 O'Day, but I also experience chafing problems from my topping lift. So you can't win for losing. Joe
I think it all depends on how large your boat is. If I had a 30' boat I'd probably want lazy jacks on it too. As it is, I can get away with a sail jock on a 222 O'Day, but I also experience chafing problems from my topping lift. So you can't win for losing. Joe
Boom kicker
Rob, I like that! My friend Wayne has a boom kicker on his Seaward 22 and we helped our friend Walter install one on his Mac 26 last year. These guys like them and are very happy with them too. I've managed to keep my topping lift slack enough so that it's loose under sail, and at the same time isn't hitting my Main Sail, by adding a small 3/16" Bungee cord into the hole under the Goose Neck fitting. I usually get the right tension on the topping lift and stretch the Bungee around the back of all three of the small rope clutches on my boom where my internal pendant lines exit. Wayne always removes his Main Halyard from his sail at the end of the day and connects it to the end of his boom and uses it to take the tension off the boom kicker while his boat is left on the mooring. He actually built his own Dutchman for his Seaward and it works great. I'd like to buy stuff like that for my boat, but I've put them at the end of the list this year for the stuff that I really need, like my new Super Ship Bottom paint that I just ordered, and the Water Pump and thermostat kits for my outboard that I just bought the other day. Something is always coming up. Hey Rob! I'm glad you posted that picture. I'm looking at your boom vang and I see that you have some kind of a wire or rope attachment connected under your pulling block to the bail on your mast. Why didn't I think of that? I'm going to give that a try. I have a utility plate under my mast hinge, but I had to cut the back portion of the plate off because it interfered with lowering my mast all the way down to rest in my stern pulpit crotch. So I'm going to have to Mickey Mouse some kind of a bail to my utility plate using the holes on the outside of the plate. That's a pretty good idea having the lower block positioned a little higher. Mine has always been too close to the deck. Thanks Rob! Consider that idea stolen. Joe
Rob, I like that! My friend Wayne has a boom kicker on his Seaward 22 and we helped our friend Walter install one on his Mac 26 last year. These guys like them and are very happy with them too. I've managed to keep my topping lift slack enough so that it's loose under sail, and at the same time isn't hitting my Main Sail, by adding a small 3/16" Bungee cord into the hole under the Goose Neck fitting. I usually get the right tension on the topping lift and stretch the Bungee around the back of all three of the small rope clutches on my boom where my internal pendant lines exit. Wayne always removes his Main Halyard from his sail at the end of the day and connects it to the end of his boom and uses it to take the tension off the boom kicker while his boat is left on the mooring. He actually built his own Dutchman for his Seaward and it works great. I'd like to buy stuff like that for my boat, but I've put them at the end of the list this year for the stuff that I really need, like my new Super Ship Bottom paint that I just ordered, and the Water Pump and thermostat kits for my outboard that I just bought the other day. Something is always coming up. Hey Rob! I'm glad you posted that picture. I'm looking at your boom vang and I see that you have some kind of a wire or rope attachment connected under your pulling block to the bail on your mast. Why didn't I think of that? I'm going to give that a try. I have a utility plate under my mast hinge, but I had to cut the back portion of the plate off because it interfered with lowering my mast all the way down to rest in my stern pulpit crotch. So I'm going to have to Mickey Mouse some kind of a bail to my utility plate using the holes on the outside of the plate. That's a pretty good idea having the lower block positioned a little higher. Mine has always been too close to the deck. Thanks Rob! Consider that idea stolen. Joe
Boomkicker
I used a boomkicker on my 192 last season and while I really liked what it can do for sail shape I don't think it is correct to say that it really takes the place of a topping lift. With a topping lift you can grab the boom and count on it as a handhold while furling the sail or putting in a reef. With the boomkicker the boom kind of floats weightless above the cockpit but mine was not secure if I put any weight on it. My other complaint is that it added a bit of hassle to the rigging process and, since I trailer the boat a lot, I went back to a topping lift for this year. Joe, in a situation like your where the boat is on a mooring for the season, this would be a non-issue This is probably less of a concern on a 222 than a 192, since the mast section is bigger, but under certain conditions the boomkicker would put so much tension on the gooseneck that I could see curvature in my mast as a result.
I used a boomkicker on my 192 last season and while I really liked what it can do for sail shape I don't think it is correct to say that it really takes the place of a topping lift. With a topping lift you can grab the boom and count on it as a handhold while furling the sail or putting in a reef. With the boomkicker the boom kind of floats weightless above the cockpit but mine was not secure if I put any weight on it. My other complaint is that it added a bit of hassle to the rigging process and, since I trailer the boat a lot, I went back to a topping lift for this year. Joe, in a situation like your where the boat is on a mooring for the season, this would be a non-issue This is probably less of a concern on a 222 than a 192, since the mast section is bigger, but under certain conditions the boomkicker would put so much tension on the gooseneck that I could see curvature in my mast as a result.
Boom kicker
Dave, I feel the same way that you do about adding more to my rigging time, even though I no longer trailer my boat. However, I do have to trailer it twice a year, and that's enough for this Ole' guy. Also, I agree with you about using the boom as a hand hold because I've done it many times myself. Although I had made a lot of changes in my mast when I replaced it years ago, I still have those flimsy cast aluminum extrusions on my boom, like the goose neck. That stuff can bend and break similar to the flimsy Tabernacle that was on the old mast. Back in the 1990s when Rudy was building the Weekender, which is the 192, he used all stainless steel extrusions on the spars. So unfortunately, a boom kicker is out of the question for me. I like to keep things simple if I can. Well! Today, I said, "the heck with it, the boat cover is coming off, for I ain't going to wait any longer." So I removed the cover. I can remember doing an overnighter on my boat on Prudence Island, off of Bristol RI, in the month of March, many years ago. So, I can at least get her uncovered now, and get a head start on the work that I have to do on her. Be brave guys, and think spring! Joe
Dave, I feel the same way that you do about adding more to my rigging time, even though I no longer trailer my boat. However, I do have to trailer it twice a year, and that's enough for this Ole' guy. Also, I agree with you about using the boom as a hand hold because I've done it many times myself. Although I had made a lot of changes in my mast when I replaced it years ago, I still have those flimsy cast aluminum extrusions on my boom, like the goose neck. That stuff can bend and break similar to the flimsy Tabernacle that was on the old mast. Back in the 1990s when Rudy was building the Weekender, which is the 192, he used all stainless steel extrusions on the spars. So unfortunately, a boom kicker is out of the question for me. I like to keep things simple if I can. Well! Today, I said, "the heck with it, the boat cover is coming off, for I ain't going to wait any longer." So I removed the cover. I can remember doing an overnighter on my boat on Prudence Island, off of Bristol RI, in the month of March, many years ago. So, I can at least get her uncovered now, and get a head start on the work that I have to do on her. Be brave guys, and think spring! Joe
Think Spring Chuck!
Hey Chuck! Come on,--be Brave! This stuff isn't going to last! It'll be gone before you know it. It's raining up here right now and if it starts snowing---it's too late now, for me anyway. I pulled the cover off my boat yesterday and stowed it down my cellar. Spring has almost sprung, and the clocks go ahead tonight! I challenge everyone to get those boats uncovered. I dare you! I double-dog dare you! Warmest Regards to all, Joe
Hey Chuck! Come on,--be Brave! This stuff isn't going to last! It'll be gone before you know it. It's raining up here right now and if it starts snowing---it's too late now, for me anyway. I pulled the cover off my boat yesterday and stowed it down my cellar. Spring has almost sprung, and the clocks go ahead tonight! I challenge everyone to get those boats uncovered. I dare you! I double-dog dare you! Warmest Regards to all, Joe
Spring???
Hi Y'all, I was just wondering...What the hell do you yankees live up there for? Just kidding, I'm from Buffalo originally and CT later,so I guess I can say that. Down here in VA I took my cover off the beginning of Feb, and the only reason I put it on in the first place was to keep the pine cones and pine needles off it. I hope to launch next week. Keep the faith, spring is just around the corner. George
Hi Y'all, I was just wondering...What the hell do you yankees live up there for? Just kidding, I'm from Buffalo originally and CT later,so I guess I can say that. Down here in VA I took my cover off the beginning of Feb, and the only reason I put it on in the first place was to keep the pine cones and pine needles off it. I hope to launch next week. Keep the faith, spring is just around the corner. George
Uhhhhh.....
....not to make you East Coast guys feel too bad, but out here in CA my boat was never covered. I went sailing last weekend and I'm going again this afternoon. Joe, if you want to try the boomkicker, I'm flying to Providence RI on business for the week starting 3/24. I could toss the boomkicker in my luggage and we could figure out a way to do a hand-off one evening during the week. Dave
....not to make you East Coast guys feel too bad, but out here in CA my boat was never covered. I went sailing last weekend and I'm going again this afternoon. Joe, if you want to try the boomkicker, I'm flying to Providence RI on business for the week starting 3/24. I could toss the boomkicker in my luggage and we could figure out a way to do a hand-off one evening during the week. Dave
Boom Kicker
Hi Dave, You lucky son-of-a-gun! You get to sail all year round. I'm envious. No Dave,--that's too much trouble for you, and I thank you for the offer. My friend Wayne has one on his Seaward 22 and I've tried it out, but if you're coming up this way, why don't you stop down to my house and I'll show you my boat? My place is very simple to get to from providence by taking Route#95 North toward Boston to 495 South toward Cape Cod. My place is not far from the Bay Street exit of 495 heading toward Taunton. I'm at 105 Lakeview Ave. in Taunton, Ma 02780. Check it out with map Quest. Here's my phone number; (508)822-7084 Rob, We've been getting some unbelievable winds in my area too. We've also been experiencing high water levels on Lake Sabbatia where I live, along with a dam crises which has been in the local news lately. I've been fortunate because my house is on the other side of the street from the people who live on the lake. They've been getting water in their cellars, but the water is high everywhere. As long as that sump pump keeps working, you should be OK Rob. Good luck! Joe
Hi Dave, You lucky son-of-a-gun! You get to sail all year round. I'm envious. No Dave,--that's too much trouble for you, and I thank you for the offer. My friend Wayne has one on his Seaward 22 and I've tried it out, but if you're coming up this way, why don't you stop down to my house and I'll show you my boat? My place is very simple to get to from providence by taking Route#95 North toward Boston to 495 South toward Cape Cod. My place is not far from the Bay Street exit of 495 heading toward Taunton. I'm at 105 Lakeview Ave. in Taunton, Ma 02780. Check it out with map Quest. Here's my phone number; (508)822-7084 Rob, We've been getting some unbelievable winds in my area too. We've also been experiencing high water levels on Lake Sabbatia where I live, along with a dam crises which has been in the local news lately. I've been fortunate because my house is on the other side of the street from the people who live on the lake. They've been getting water in their cellars, but the water is high everywhere. As long as that sump pump keeps working, you should be OK Rob. Good luck! Joe
Thanks Rob!
I can make one of those. I even have some extra stainless steel thimbles. I don't remember where my Vang came from. It's a Schaeffer with two double fiddle blocks and a cam cleat. I think that it came with my boat. Hey thanks for posting that pic. I'll make one up for my boat. Hopefully, the water levels will recede, and the weather will start to get a little milder so that we can start getting the boats ready. Thanks again, Rob! Joe
I can make one of those. I even have some extra stainless steel thimbles. I don't remember where my Vang came from. It's a Schaeffer with two double fiddle blocks and a cam cleat. I think that it came with my boat. Hey thanks for posting that pic. I'll make one up for my boat. Hopefully, the water levels will recede, and the weather will start to get a little milder so that we can start getting the boats ready. Thanks again, Rob! Joe
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