My wife and I are looking to take a week and head across, probably Racine to South Haven and then back, this summer. She's never gone across or sailed at night. I have once, during the Queen's Cup race. We'll be going with the kids, so although safety is always a concern, it's even more so with them aboard. We spend quite a bit of time together on the boat, but this'll be the longest stretch on the water we've done. What I'm looking for is several things - 1. Advice on timing crossing the lake. I've heard late July to August has the best weather window, but we're open to experienced advise. 2. Advice on safety equipment. Obviously the basics, life jackets for all, etc. But what else? I'm planning on getting a handheld VHF as a backup, I'll have the GPS, compass, harnesses for my wife and I while on deck at night, alone, foul weather, etc. What else? Does anyone have a checklist? 3. Alternative beginning/ending points. We typically keep the boat slipped in Racine, and South Haven is one of our favorite spots to tow to. But, we're open to suggestions that would make the trip across more enjoyable/shorter/safer/etc. 4. Anyone interested in crossing with us. We've got a H26, which is not a racer and we'll be obviously well loaded. If you've got a comparable speed boat and are interested, let me know. Whether you've done it before and want to offer advice and company, or whether this would be your first time and you don't want to head out alone. Let me know. Summer calendar is relatively open so dates are flexible. Fair winds and clear skies. (And warm weather!) T J
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P
Paul
Info
I've crossed these waters in a 22, a 26, a 27 and a 356. I'd be glad to give you my thoughts, but offline seems best. Email: pbargren@foleylaw.com
I've crossed these waters in a 22, a 26, a 27 and a 356. I'd be glad to give you my thoughts, but offline seems best. Email: pbargren@foleylaw.com
J
John H380 1999
Tow and sail?
We have been cruising out of Racine for a month at a time on Lake Michigan for 7 years now and love it. We go for a month at a time and have been at most all harbors on the lake in that time. Weather - if you can pick and choose your days, leave early (5 or 6 am) and you won't have to night sail. Get to the other side and have a nice supper. It is not hard to find good weather days to go across. We do not have a committment date returning to Racine so we wait for a good window to return. It is the people that have to be back on a certain date that get in trouble. Information on distance (assuming 5 knots average): -Racine to So Haven is 70 mi or 14 hours. That is a really long time for a family to sit. We have done it and don't mind it with one hour alternating watches. Time goes really fast. You have a trailerable. Here are some suggestions for shorter distance crossing. Trailer north to Sheboygan, a really nice place, and sail to Ludington (56 mi or 11+ hr.) Or launch in Manitowoc (visit Maritime Museum and tour sub - really neat. Then Manitowoc to Ludington is 52 mi. or 10 hr. Kewanee (visit ocean tug) to Manistee (one of the best places to stop) is 53 mi 10 hr. How about trailering to Door County for a week. Launch in Fish Creek, anchor in Horseshoe Island and have a great time at Nicolet? What about trailering and doing one overnight camp in the Upper Pennisula and heading to Blind River or Little Current the nest day and spending some time in one of the two best cruising grounds in the world, the North Channel? Allow a minimum of two weeks. With your boat you can gunkhole where few others have gone and you will love it. Stop and visit us at Pugh's on the river slip 273 this summer and we can show you where we have been in the last 25 years and give you some ideas. Enigma the sailboat. Or email us. John
We have been cruising out of Racine for a month at a time on Lake Michigan for 7 years now and love it. We go for a month at a time and have been at most all harbors on the lake in that time. Weather - if you can pick and choose your days, leave early (5 or 6 am) and you won't have to night sail. Get to the other side and have a nice supper. It is not hard to find good weather days to go across. We do not have a committment date returning to Racine so we wait for a good window to return. It is the people that have to be back on a certain date that get in trouble. Information on distance (assuming 5 knots average): -Racine to So Haven is 70 mi or 14 hours. That is a really long time for a family to sit. We have done it and don't mind it with one hour alternating watches. Time goes really fast. You have a trailerable. Here are some suggestions for shorter distance crossing. Trailer north to Sheboygan, a really nice place, and sail to Ludington (56 mi or 11+ hr.) Or launch in Manitowoc (visit Maritime Museum and tour sub - really neat. Then Manitowoc to Ludington is 52 mi. or 10 hr. Kewanee (visit ocean tug) to Manistee (one of the best places to stop) is 53 mi 10 hr. How about trailering to Door County for a week. Launch in Fish Creek, anchor in Horseshoe Island and have a great time at Nicolet? What about trailering and doing one overnight camp in the Upper Pennisula and heading to Blind River or Little Current the nest day and spending some time in one of the two best cruising grounds in the world, the North Channel? Allow a minimum of two weeks. With your boat you can gunkhole where few others have gone and you will love it. Stop and visit us at Pugh's on the river slip 273 this summer and we can show you where we have been in the last 25 years and give you some ideas. Enigma the sailboat. Or email us. John
W
Ward
Keep it on line Paul
Paul, I for one would love to hear your thoughts on crossing and options. I learn a lot from discussions like this. Thanks Ward
Paul, I for one would love to hear your thoughts on crossing and options. I learn a lot from discussions like this. Thanks Ward
F
Frank Arndorfer
Keep it online also.
I sail out of Milwaukee and am looking for any advice, tips, etc. on lake crossings, spots to visit, etc. We recently sold our H340 and are looking forward to taking delivery of a new H426DS by the end of April. Keep up the chat or go to a different forum.?????
I sail out of Milwaukee and am looking for any advice, tips, etc. on lake crossings, spots to visit, etc. We recently sold our H340 and are looking forward to taking delivery of a new H426DS by the end of April. Keep up the chat or go to a different forum.?????
P
Paul
Crossing
Ok, here goes, on-line as requested: 1. A 26-footer is a small boat for a family to to cross in, especially if the kids are small. You know your own capabilities. But you need to be completely satisified that all of you can take whatever the unpredictable big lake has to offer, for long, long day. You also have to assume that you are absolutely, positively on your own, with no possibility of help from anyone else. I trust you've sailed off Racine in the bumps and the blow. Are you ready -- all of you -- to do that for 12 or 15 or 18 hours, or maybe more? 1a. Try a coastwise sail to Port Washington first? You'll get the feel of a crossing (although the distance is shorter), but you can pull in at Milwaukee if things aren't working out. There's no place to pull in 35 mi east of Racine. 2. I'm not sure about taking a trailerable across the lake. I'm sure it's been done, but I'd be hesitant. I want that keel beneath me. 3. Ok, enough discouragement. On to the joys and the tactics. 4. An ideal first crossing is probably 50% or 75% motoring (make sure you have the fuel capacity.) The reason is that it means you have purposely chosen very quiet weather to make your first voyage. You can sail when the breeze comes, motorsail when it fades, and motor-only when it dies. For your first crossing, you want to error on the side of calm weather, not a blow. You'll enjoy it, and be ready for more. 4a. On the other hand, you may need to motor if the wind is on the nose and something's going wrong so there's a need for speed. 4b. So, regardless of why you might find yourself motoring, I'd like to know I had enough fuel for the entire trip under power if the need arose. Especially with kids aboard. 5. All of this means watching the weather and picking a day. You can't decide to go on a certain day and shove off without much regard to weather, unless (broken record) you are really, really sure that all of you can handle whatever might come along. In broad generality, most of the summer weather here comes in weekly cycles, c. 3 days warmer from the sw/se, then c. 3 days cooler from the nw/ne, often separated by some kind of blow and rain. (That's why it always seems to rain every weekend, get sunny every Monday.) Look for the lulls (usually the 2d or 3d day of the 3 day-cycle) and go then. And remember, you'll need good weather coming back, too, and this time you'll be heading into the prevailing winds. Again, give yourself plenty of time. I'd plan a week to get over and back comfortably. You can always sail coastwise a little over in Michigan if there's time. With luck and good weather, you could make it over and back in 24 hours. I did it this summer. But I'd never count on it. Take your time and pick your spot, and you'll be glad you did. 6. People ask me how long it takes to sail across the lake. I say 12 to 24 hours. It all depends, and you need to be ready for 24, especially in the smaller boats. You're looking at 75 mi, minimum, more like 80 to South Haven. Even if you motor/motorsail/sail all the way at 6 mph, you're over 13 hours. If you end up sailing more, and your average drops just a bit to 5, you're probably enjoying the ride but you're looking at 16 hours. If the wind comes up on the nose, you're probably thinking 18 pretty uncomfortable hours. And it always takes longer than you think. By the time you find the harbor, get inside the pierheads, get into the river or lake and into town and all tied up, Even a "13-hour" trip is going to be more like 15, all said and done. That "18-hour" slog turns into an even longer 20-hour trek. 7. From Milwaukee, I have always crossed to Michigan at night, leaving in the early evening, sailing through the night. Dawn finds me off the shore. Reasons: The Michigan shore is dark and not well marked. Yet there are dozens of lights, all of which seem to look like harbor entrances. If you find yourself trying to find the gap in the dark, it can be very difficult, especially in fog or low vis, even with GPS. I started the night-time crossing in the days before GPS, but I still like it. Of course, sailing at night raises additional problems for many. You need to know your boat better. You need to keep a better watch for freighters in the mid-lake lanes. Dark can add to the difficulties of wind and wave, too. But it certainly adds to the edventure. Last time across, the highlight was a huge meteor track across probably 90 degrees of sky. Also, it's not dark long. There's a bit of a glow in the sky till 10 p.m. or even later most of the summer, and it starts graying up maybe six or seven hours later. Pick your date for a full moon or waning moon, and you'll have moonlight much of the night, barring clouds. 8. If you'd rather not night sail, get up and go at first light, or a little before. A good fast trip puts you in port before supper. A slow trip should still give you a visual sighting of the pierheads before dark. 9. Coming back, I find the navigation much different. The city lights from Milwaukee, Racine, Kenosha and Chicago are so bright that most nights they can be see 50 or 60 miles out, and I don't think it is uncommon anymore to see them from just off the Michigan shore itself. They provide a beacon that can make a compass almost obsolete. Aim the nose at the Racine glow and off you go. Plus, you are sailing into your home waters, so you can pick out your entrance even at night. So, I have not usually made the nighttime passage back, but rather get an early start and go through the day, and don't worry much about arriving after dark 10. I always feel better on the trip if I've spent the night before on the boat. Your body gets used to the feel. That time also allows you to get everything stowed, listen again to weather reports, check the charts and GPS, etc. 11. I agree with the earlier correspondent who suggested a shorter crossing. Sheboygan to Ludington is very nice, and should be an easy daylight passage. Crossing from Sturgeon Bay in Door County to Frankfort is even shorter, with excellent scenery on each side. Try that first? 12. How dry is the 26? If a chops means your decks are getting wet and spray is flying back to the cockpit, you can expect things to start getting damp below, too. If 3-5' waves mean you're taking a wave top on the cabin top every now and then, you'll be really damp below in short order. Just moving back and forth from the cockpit brings a lot of damp below. Be ready for it. Here again, it means knowing your boat. 13. I wouldn't plan to do much cooking underway on a 26 footer. Sandwiches and finger food; hot stuff in a thermos before you leave. 14. Time of summer: Last 2 weeks in July and 1st two in August trend mellow, and by then the water's warmer. Expect 50s if you're out overnight, tho, no matter how warm the days. 15. You can always turn back. No wind and tired of motoring? Wind on the nose and tired of tacking? Waves building? Stomachs churning? You won't be the first and won't be the last to turn around. The main thing is to make your decision based on the facts, not pride. You'll get back and still have a great adventure to tell about. Especially with the kids on board, it's kind of the opposite of that old lifeboat saw: You don't have to go out, but you sure as heck have to get back. Most of this is aimed at the 26, of course. Frank, with your 426, you'll be in much better shape, and much more comfortable. I moved from an old 27 (not Hunter) to a new 356 last summer and the difference was beyond anything I'd imagined. Good sailing. Stay safe. --Paul
Ok, here goes, on-line as requested: 1. A 26-footer is a small boat for a family to to cross in, especially if the kids are small. You know your own capabilities. But you need to be completely satisified that all of you can take whatever the unpredictable big lake has to offer, for long, long day. You also have to assume that you are absolutely, positively on your own, with no possibility of help from anyone else. I trust you've sailed off Racine in the bumps and the blow. Are you ready -- all of you -- to do that for 12 or 15 or 18 hours, or maybe more? 1a. Try a coastwise sail to Port Washington first? You'll get the feel of a crossing (although the distance is shorter), but you can pull in at Milwaukee if things aren't working out. There's no place to pull in 35 mi east of Racine. 2. I'm not sure about taking a trailerable across the lake. I'm sure it's been done, but I'd be hesitant. I want that keel beneath me. 3. Ok, enough discouragement. On to the joys and the tactics. 4. An ideal first crossing is probably 50% or 75% motoring (make sure you have the fuel capacity.) The reason is that it means you have purposely chosen very quiet weather to make your first voyage. You can sail when the breeze comes, motorsail when it fades, and motor-only when it dies. For your first crossing, you want to error on the side of calm weather, not a blow. You'll enjoy it, and be ready for more. 4a. On the other hand, you may need to motor if the wind is on the nose and something's going wrong so there's a need for speed. 4b. So, regardless of why you might find yourself motoring, I'd like to know I had enough fuel for the entire trip under power if the need arose. Especially with kids aboard. 5. All of this means watching the weather and picking a day. You can't decide to go on a certain day and shove off without much regard to weather, unless (broken record) you are really, really sure that all of you can handle whatever might come along. In broad generality, most of the summer weather here comes in weekly cycles, c. 3 days warmer from the sw/se, then c. 3 days cooler from the nw/ne, often separated by some kind of blow and rain. (That's why it always seems to rain every weekend, get sunny every Monday.) Look for the lulls (usually the 2d or 3d day of the 3 day-cycle) and go then. And remember, you'll need good weather coming back, too, and this time you'll be heading into the prevailing winds. Again, give yourself plenty of time. I'd plan a week to get over and back comfortably. You can always sail coastwise a little over in Michigan if there's time. With luck and good weather, you could make it over and back in 24 hours. I did it this summer. But I'd never count on it. Take your time and pick your spot, and you'll be glad you did. 6. People ask me how long it takes to sail across the lake. I say 12 to 24 hours. It all depends, and you need to be ready for 24, especially in the smaller boats. You're looking at 75 mi, minimum, more like 80 to South Haven. Even if you motor/motorsail/sail all the way at 6 mph, you're over 13 hours. If you end up sailing more, and your average drops just a bit to 5, you're probably enjoying the ride but you're looking at 16 hours. If the wind comes up on the nose, you're probably thinking 18 pretty uncomfortable hours. And it always takes longer than you think. By the time you find the harbor, get inside the pierheads, get into the river or lake and into town and all tied up, Even a "13-hour" trip is going to be more like 15, all said and done. That "18-hour" slog turns into an even longer 20-hour trek. 7. From Milwaukee, I have always crossed to Michigan at night, leaving in the early evening, sailing through the night. Dawn finds me off the shore. Reasons: The Michigan shore is dark and not well marked. Yet there are dozens of lights, all of which seem to look like harbor entrances. If you find yourself trying to find the gap in the dark, it can be very difficult, especially in fog or low vis, even with GPS. I started the night-time crossing in the days before GPS, but I still like it. Of course, sailing at night raises additional problems for many. You need to know your boat better. You need to keep a better watch for freighters in the mid-lake lanes. Dark can add to the difficulties of wind and wave, too. But it certainly adds to the edventure. Last time across, the highlight was a huge meteor track across probably 90 degrees of sky. Also, it's not dark long. There's a bit of a glow in the sky till 10 p.m. or even later most of the summer, and it starts graying up maybe six or seven hours later. Pick your date for a full moon or waning moon, and you'll have moonlight much of the night, barring clouds. 8. If you'd rather not night sail, get up and go at first light, or a little before. A good fast trip puts you in port before supper. A slow trip should still give you a visual sighting of the pierheads before dark. 9. Coming back, I find the navigation much different. The city lights from Milwaukee, Racine, Kenosha and Chicago are so bright that most nights they can be see 50 or 60 miles out, and I don't think it is uncommon anymore to see them from just off the Michigan shore itself. They provide a beacon that can make a compass almost obsolete. Aim the nose at the Racine glow and off you go. Plus, you are sailing into your home waters, so you can pick out your entrance even at night. So, I have not usually made the nighttime passage back, but rather get an early start and go through the day, and don't worry much about arriving after dark 10. I always feel better on the trip if I've spent the night before on the boat. Your body gets used to the feel. That time also allows you to get everything stowed, listen again to weather reports, check the charts and GPS, etc. 11. I agree with the earlier correspondent who suggested a shorter crossing. Sheboygan to Ludington is very nice, and should be an easy daylight passage. Crossing from Sturgeon Bay in Door County to Frankfort is even shorter, with excellent scenery on each side. Try that first? 12. How dry is the 26? If a chops means your decks are getting wet and spray is flying back to the cockpit, you can expect things to start getting damp below, too. If 3-5' waves mean you're taking a wave top on the cabin top every now and then, you'll be really damp below in short order. Just moving back and forth from the cockpit brings a lot of damp below. Be ready for it. Here again, it means knowing your boat. 13. I wouldn't plan to do much cooking underway on a 26 footer. Sandwiches and finger food; hot stuff in a thermos before you leave. 14. Time of summer: Last 2 weeks in July and 1st two in August trend mellow, and by then the water's warmer. Expect 50s if you're out overnight, tho, no matter how warm the days. 15. You can always turn back. No wind and tired of motoring? Wind on the nose and tired of tacking? Waves building? Stomachs churning? You won't be the first and won't be the last to turn around. The main thing is to make your decision based on the facts, not pride. You'll get back and still have a great adventure to tell about. Especially with the kids on board, it's kind of the opposite of that old lifeboat saw: You don't have to go out, but you sure as heck have to get back. Most of this is aimed at the 26, of course. Frank, with your 426, you'll be in much better shape, and much more comfortable. I moved from an old 27 (not Hunter) to a new 356 last summer and the difference was beyond anything I'd imagined. Good sailing. Stay safe. --Paul
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