I’ve been without a sailboat for 10 years and am ready to get one now that my children are old enough to not get in the way. I previously had a Tanzer 16 daysailer and loved it. I would appreciate any general advice on what type of boat to buy. Most of my time sailing will be single handed, but I will occasionally carry my wife and our two teenage children along and occasionally overnight I live on a shallow tidal creek and will keep the boat at my dock. I will occasionally go in the ocean which is 3 miles away. The creek is tidal so I will need a centerboard or swing keel. I have always liked the Catalina 22 and am curious if it will be too large or possibly too small. I’ve always noticed McGregors are very inexpensive and my hardcore sailor friends used to laugh at them. I believe they had a water ballast tank which was great for trailering, but I won’t need that feature. Another boat I’ve heard of is a Kells 23. Any general hints or advice is appreciated.
Is a 22 footer large enough?
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What about a Hunter 22?
Especially mine, lol, its for sale for the right price, seriously though, it has been a great boat to learn on and i am in the process of upgrading to something bigger.
Especially mine, lol, its for sale for the right price, seriously though, it has been a great boat to learn on and i am in the process of upgrading to something bigger.
Hard core sailor friends?
Your hard core sailor friends laugh at MacGregors and yet THEY sail in a creek? What a bunch of idiot snobs. Anyway, what size for you? The only way you will know what size you want is to go with your wife and look at 22 to 26 foot boats. Thats 2 adults and 2 teens, on occasion, that will all be on the same boat at the same time. You might get a lot of talk here, but if you dont look, everything else is just talk. IMHO Tony B
Your hard core sailor friends laugh at MacGregors and yet THEY sail in a creek? What a bunch of idiot snobs. Anyway, what size for you? The only way you will know what size you want is to go with your wife and look at 22 to 26 foot boats. Thats 2 adults and 2 teens, on occasion, that will all be on the same boat at the same time. You might get a lot of talk here, but if you dont look, everything else is just talk. IMHO Tony B
Sounds like a 22 may be right for what you want..
Ease for single handling is relative. Some 30' boats are easier to single hand than some 22'; it all depends on the setup, roller furling, lines leading aft, lazy jacks, auto pilot etc. Water ballast and swing keels are mainly desired for trailering but they have some serious drawbacks. My recommendation would be a short keel center board configuration which provides a shallow draft (2.5')with full ballasted stability. You can go out in the ocean with a Catalina 22' but pick a good weather window. To overnight with 4 people on a 22' will definetely be cramped but it can be done quite nicely with a little planning. Every summer us and another couple will trailer our Starwind 223 to a different sailing venue for a 10 day trip. To prevent the boat from getting to small we frequent marinas almost every day for ice, showers, sightseeing and restaurants. We reserve a couple of nights to anchor out and we'll throw some steaks on the grill and just sit in the cockpit and talk and listen to a radio. Our friends don't mind the V-berth and me and the wife will sleep on the quarter berths under the cockpit seats. Electric 12v fans are a plus. Since the boat will be kept in the water do not forget to paint the bottom with anti foul paint to include painting the swing keel or center board. A 22' Cataline you can operate with a 6-8 HP outboard but get a long shaft to reduce having the prop leave the water in choppy situations. An 8-10 HP engine may be required if currents in the tidal creek are strong. I think MacGregors are a great fun boat to do what they are designed for. They are basically a small motor sailer. For entertaining and for spacious accomodations at anchor they will out perform the Catalina 22. They don't motor well and sail even worst but will adequately perform both functions in protected waters. (ocean not recommended) These boats are great for weekend trips where the main goal is getting someplace as they will get you there faster (under power) and will allow you to play for a while with the sails. Not a bad deal to get there early into a congested anchorage. If you like a fine sailer get the Catalina. Good luck.
Ease for single handling is relative. Some 30' boats are easier to single hand than some 22'; it all depends on the setup, roller furling, lines leading aft, lazy jacks, auto pilot etc. Water ballast and swing keels are mainly desired for trailering but they have some serious drawbacks. My recommendation would be a short keel center board configuration which provides a shallow draft (2.5')with full ballasted stability. You can go out in the ocean with a Catalina 22' but pick a good weather window. To overnight with 4 people on a 22' will definetely be cramped but it can be done quite nicely with a little planning. Every summer us and another couple will trailer our Starwind 223 to a different sailing venue for a 10 day trip. To prevent the boat from getting to small we frequent marinas almost every day for ice, showers, sightseeing and restaurants. We reserve a couple of nights to anchor out and we'll throw some steaks on the grill and just sit in the cockpit and talk and listen to a radio. Our friends don't mind the V-berth and me and the wife will sleep on the quarter berths under the cockpit seats. Electric 12v fans are a plus. Since the boat will be kept in the water do not forget to paint the bottom with anti foul paint to include painting the swing keel or center board. A 22' Cataline you can operate with a 6-8 HP outboard but get a long shaft to reduce having the prop leave the water in choppy situations. An 8-10 HP engine may be required if currents in the tidal creek are strong. I think MacGregors are a great fun boat to do what they are designed for. They are basically a small motor sailer. For entertaining and for spacious accomodations at anchor they will out perform the Catalina 22. They don't motor well and sail even worst but will adequately perform both functions in protected waters. (ocean not recommended) These boats are great for weekend trips where the main goal is getting someplace as they will get you there faster (under power) and will allow you to play for a while with the sails. Not a bad deal to get there early into a congested anchorage. If you like a fine sailer get the Catalina. Good luck.
Click on the Boat Info button
You can check the owners' review on the Catalina 22 on this website. The Catalina 22 has been around since 1969. It’s the first and longest running production sailboat in Catalina Yachts model line; the Catalina 22 is in the American Sailboat Hall of Fame. There should be a lot of used Catalina 22 for sale for a reasonable price. For day-sailing, four adults are doable. The brochure list the Catalina 22 as having berths for five adults, but it might have to be five really short and skinny people. Fair Winds, Clyde
You can check the owners' review on the Catalina 22 on this website. The Catalina 22 has been around since 1969. It’s the first and longest running production sailboat in Catalina Yachts model line; the Catalina 22 is in the American Sailboat Hall of Fame. There should be a lot of used Catalina 22 for sale for a reasonable price. For day-sailing, four adults are doable. The brochure list the Catalina 22 as having berths for five adults, but it might have to be five really short and skinny people. Fair Winds, Clyde
22
While having four people on a Catlaina 22 for a day sail is doable, we do it all the time no problems. Sleeping four, that might raise some problems especially if you have overnight bags with you. I think you'll find it a bit on the cramped side. Might work fine with smaller kids. You might also want to consider a Catalina 25 with a swing keel.
While having four people on a Catlaina 22 for a day sail is doable, we do it all the time no problems. Sleeping four, that might raise some problems especially if you have overnight bags with you. I think you'll find it a bit on the cramped side. Might work fine with smaller kids. You might also want to consider a Catalina 25 with a swing keel.
C22/C25
Having daysailed rented C22s with 4-5, yes, it is large enough for a daysail. I'd step up to a 25 for weekenders and sleeping Saturday nights, a 30 for longer trips with 4. I usually sail a J22 in the summer and find more than 4 for a daysail is too tight, maybe 5 if the crew has maturity, but with kids who may fight in a small space, 4 max is best. I sail with kids aged 6-14 a lot. When we charter, a 34-35 is really nice for 4-5 and days to a week afloat. With teens, they can handle the lines on a bit bigger boat. One nice thing about the J22 is the jib is small and my little ones can handle the jib sheets in most reasonable conditions. A little breeze, a kid at the helm, life is not bad... OC
Having daysailed rented C22s with 4-5, yes, it is large enough for a daysail. I'd step up to a 25 for weekenders and sleeping Saturday nights, a 30 for longer trips with 4. I usually sail a J22 in the summer and find more than 4 for a daysail is too tight, maybe 5 if the crew has maturity, but with kids who may fight in a small space, 4 max is best. I sail with kids aged 6-14 a lot. When we charter, a 34-35 is really nice for 4-5 and days to a week afloat. With teens, they can handle the lines on a bit bigger boat. One nice thing about the J22 is the jib is small and my little ones can handle the jib sheets in most reasonable conditions. A little breeze, a kid at the helm, life is not bad... OC
I vote for a 25
22 would be small with all aboard. Some 25's have a swing keels, so shallow areas are no problem. And a fair amount of room for four. Sail some boats nearby and check them out and see which ones you like. Good luck and take your time looking. It's a buyers market. Aren't you the lucky one with a dock in your backyard. I'm jealous. Good luck. Keep it up, Ctskip
22 would be small with all aboard. Some 25's have a swing keels, so shallow areas are no problem. And a fair amount of room for four. Sail some boats nearby and check them out and see which ones you like. Good luck and take your time looking. It's a buyers market. Aren't you the lucky one with a dock in your backyard. I'm jealous. Good luck. Keep it up, Ctskip
Happy Hunting
Catalinas are very nice boats and they hold up well. The 25 would be a good choice. I think it would balance what you want to do very well. The Hunter 260 might also meet your needs pretty well. Swing keel, water balast, and trailerable (with a moderate sized tow vehicle). Just look around and try a few boats, you'll find something that will work. It's all a bunch of trade offs though, to get shallow you will lose some stability and to get big enough to spend some time on you will lose shallow. Look for the right balance and you will be happy.
Catalinas are very nice boats and they hold up well. The 25 would be a good choice. I think it would balance what you want to do very well. The Hunter 260 might also meet your needs pretty well. Swing keel, water balast, and trailerable (with a moderate sized tow vehicle). Just look around and try a few boats, you'll find something that will work. It's all a bunch of trade offs though, to get shallow you will lose some stability and to get big enough to spend some time on you will lose shallow. Look for the right balance and you will be happy.
Careful About Reading In
Tidal makes it hard to tell, but I'm betting he's talking about four for daysailing, but overnighting by himself or w/ spouse. Just a hunch. Take the wife far enough to be away from the teenagers, but close enough to look through binoculars to see if they've set the house on fire… I'm a former C22 owner. The large cockpit makes it perfectly adequate for four when daysailing, and overnighting for two is cozy ("good' cozy, not "cramped" cozy). Two in the V-berth and two on the pop-down dinette is doable, but with four, there's not much room to turn around belowdecks, and there's the whole porta-potty/privacy thing to be worked out. Easy to single-hand with a few simple equipment/gear additions, and it can do the ocean in sane weather. Thousands of hulls, active owner's fleets, company still in business offering excellent customer service for "5th owners." The Hunter is also an option, but it's really hard to go wrong with this boat.
Tidal makes it hard to tell, but I'm betting he's talking about four for daysailing, but overnighting by himself or w/ spouse. Just a hunch. Take the wife far enough to be away from the teenagers, but close enough to look through binoculars to see if they've set the house on fire… I'm a former C22 owner. The large cockpit makes it perfectly adequate for four when daysailing, and overnighting for two is cozy ("good' cozy, not "cramped" cozy). Two in the V-berth and two on the pop-down dinette is doable, but with four, there's not much room to turn around belowdecks, and there's the whole porta-potty/privacy thing to be worked out. Easy to single-hand with a few simple equipment/gear additions, and it can do the ocean in sane weather. Thousands of hulls, active owner's fleets, company still in business offering excellent customer service for "5th owners." The Hunter is also an option, but it's really hard to go wrong with this boat.
Catalina 22
I just bought a Cat 22 and I'm very impressed with the construction and her sailing ability. I've had 4 people on board for a daysail and we were very comfortable. I bought the boat for daysailing and the occasional overnight with my wife and 11 yr. old daughter. I can launch it in about 40 minutes and recover it and put awayin about 30. I'm sure there are other boats just as good, but in my opinon a Cat 22 would serve you well.
I just bought a Cat 22 and I'm very impressed with the construction and her sailing ability. I've had 4 people on board for a daysail and we were very comfortable. I bought the boat for daysailing and the occasional overnight with my wife and 11 yr. old daughter. I can launch it in about 40 minutes and recover it and put awayin about 30. I'm sure there are other boats just as good, but in my opinon a Cat 22 would serve you well.
Like anything, a few limitations...
Hey! I was just reading your question about a 22-footer being big enough, and since I started out on a Hunter 22 (GREAT boat) I'll throw in my 2 cents. I'd probably still have my 22 if I could have stood up inside it. For some reason that really wore on me after a while - having to crouch down while inside the boat. It was a blast and a wonderful-sailing vessel, but I just wanted a boat that was big enough to stand up in (I'm 6' tall, and now have a Hunter 30 that has plenty of headroom) BTW, Sounds like you might be at my old marina - Otter Creek. Fun place. Good luck in your search.
Hey! I was just reading your question about a 22-footer being big enough, and since I started out on a Hunter 22 (GREAT boat) I'll throw in my 2 cents. I'd probably still have my 22 if I could have stood up inside it. For some reason that really wore on me after a while - having to crouch down while inside the boat. It was a blast and a wonderful-sailing vessel, but I just wanted a boat that was big enough to stand up in (I'm 6' tall, and now have a Hunter 30 that has plenty of headroom) BTW, Sounds like you might be at my old marina - Otter Creek. Fun place. Good luck in your search.
GREAT SIZE for day sailing
you can overnight too but she would be too small for a weedender. Make sure you get or add a kick up rudder for the shallow. Not all Mac are water ballast. I have never sailed one but I think water ballast boat sail ok. You might want to look at a boats in the 23 - 26 foot range to see if you would like the extra room.
you can overnight too but she would be too small for a weedender. Make sure you get or add a kick up rudder for the shallow. Not all Mac are water ballast. I have never sailed one but I think water ballast boat sail ok. You might want to look at a boats in the 23 - 26 foot range to see if you would like the extra room.
Thanks for the information
El Coyote I’m on Hewlett’s Creek ½ mile west of the waterway and go to the ocean via Masonboro Inlet. I’m familiar with Otter Creek, in fact the Carolina Beach Inlet has had major shoaling problems lately and some large boats have to travel to Masonboro to go offshore unless it’s high tide. I would like to thank everyone for all the info, it will help me narrow down my search. I’ve owned 3 boats and realize the perfect boat doesn’t exist and it’s always a compromise. Tony B I must apologize for bringing out your rudeness, I’m sure you’re normally a pleasant person.
El Coyote I’m on Hewlett’s Creek ½ mile west of the waterway and go to the ocean via Masonboro Inlet. I’m familiar with Otter Creek, in fact the Carolina Beach Inlet has had major shoaling problems lately and some large boats have to travel to Masonboro to go offshore unless it’s high tide. I would like to thank everyone for all the info, it will help me narrow down my search. I’ve owned 3 boats and realize the perfect boat doesn’t exist and it’s always a compromise. Tony B I must apologize for bringing out your rudeness, I’m sure you’re normally a pleasant person.
H22, or another....
Hunter 22 is an interesting possibility. But if you intend to do the family overnighter or weekender, any 22 will probably be too small. As an alternative, the Hunter 25.5 shoal keel might be an interesting option. Or a Hunter 26 / 260. IMO, the H25.5 would be a great family boat and sails great, draws a little over 3'. The 26 / 260 is a cavern inside the cabin. The 26 / 260 is water ballast with a centerboard. Catalina 25 swing keel might also be one for on your short list. Great boat, smaller than the H25.5 and 26 / 260, but a lot out there for sale.
Hunter 22 is an interesting possibility. But if you intend to do the family overnighter or weekender, any 22 will probably be too small. As an alternative, the Hunter 25.5 shoal keel might be an interesting option. Or a Hunter 26 / 260. IMO, the H25.5 would be a great family boat and sails great, draws a little over 3'. The 26 / 260 is a cavern inside the cabin. The 26 / 260 is water ballast with a centerboard. Catalina 25 swing keel might also be one for on your short list. Great boat, smaller than the H25.5 and 26 / 260, but a lot out there for sale.
v22 vs m25
My brother has a Venture 22, that was great for he and I but when the wives joined, it started to get kind of tight. Certainly four adults and any number of kiddies would have been too many people in too tight quarters for me. After spending time on his boat, I tracked down a Mac 25. 4 adults and two or three kids would be comfortable for a few hours, and my family of four overnighting will be no problem at all.
My brother has a Venture 22, that was great for he and I but when the wives joined, it started to get kind of tight. Certainly four adults and any number of kiddies would have been too many people in too tight quarters for me. After spending time on his boat, I tracked down a Mac 25. 4 adults and two or three kids would be comfortable for a few hours, and my family of four overnighting will be no problem at all.
Hall of Fame
The Macgregor 25 may be for you. Sails well, trailors well, can be found, very economical. You may want a boat with stand up head room. A family decision usually makes the best crew choice. Good Luck!
The Macgregor 25 may be for you. Sails well, trailors well, can be found, very economical. You may want a boat with stand up head room. A family decision usually makes the best crew choice. Good Luck!
Forget the Teens
It is very hard to get teenagers to go on a small boat for a weekend. If your experience turns out like mine it will be mostly you and sometimes the wife. 22' is good. Also a tent can work. My son Richard liked to sleep on shore in a tent at the Land Between the Lakes. We were anchored less than 100' away but for a 13 year old he felt like he was being independent. Buy the 22' and if you start having crowded weekends get something larger. But my bet is that overnighters with the teenagers will be few in number. Also the costs goes up exponentially with the size of the boat. If you buy a 22' boat and it doesn't work out the money involved won't be great.
It is very hard to get teenagers to go on a small boat for a weekend. If your experience turns out like mine it will be mostly you and sometimes the wife. 22' is good. Also a tent can work. My son Richard liked to sleep on shore in a tent at the Land Between the Lakes. We were anchored less than 100' away but for a 13 year old he felt like he was being independent. Buy the 22' and if you start having crowded weekends get something larger. But my bet is that overnighters with the teenagers will be few in number. Also the costs goes up exponentially with the size of the boat. If you buy a 22' boat and it doesn't work out the money involved won't be great.
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