Irwin Citation 35.5 project boat ?'s

[Vic H.]

I'm looking at an Irwin Citation 35.5 project boat. Major concerns, p.o. whacked a rock hard off the keel. Keel to hull is cracked fore and aft and rear of keel appears to be pushed into hull about 1"-2", not broken completely thru (cabin holds water!), but water is leaking out around rear of keel. Interior is trashed.

Also, stand poppets have compressed into hull from? yrs on the hard.

Is this worth getting into? (impossible question, I know. Just would like thoughts).

Any thoughts on the Irwin Citation 35.5 in general and hull strenght and keel attachment in particular?

Thanks,
Vic H.

 

[Bad Obsession]

RUN!!!!! Run away fast!!!!!!!!

I don't know what your budget is but this boat is going to suck you dry. You would be better off finding a different boat.

www.yachtworld.com

Check that site out....tons of boats out there. A project boat is only worth it if you can fix it....this boat is ready for the scrap yard!

 

[Vic H.]

That bad Huh? Boat is free.

 

[Vic H.]

Is the Irwin 35.5 a bad boat in general?

 

[AtlanticAl]

I had an Irwin 35, and i wouldnt buy one again. They are kind of flimsy. I took that one to Bermuda in December from Florida, had the spreader touching the water at one time, water poured into the boat, came through the hull deck joint, everything about the boat was a problem, the engine filled up with water, becuase their was no vent on the exhaust pipe, the wood round the chainplates had rotted away, and we didnt find it until we were way out at sea, the hull is not the thickest around, she was shoa drafted and just would not sail to the wind, the main sheet was forward of the cockpitt and we had to unzip the dodger to operate it, for the size of boat, it had a poor layout, it had great access to the engine, better than any other boat i have seen, but a huge loss in accomodation, and the lazzaret and cockpitt hatches, everything that went in there, just ended up in the one space, next to the engine, as it all just dumped down to where the engine was. Their were no hand holds inside the cabin. It had quite a roomy cockpitt, but in foul weather you couldnt jam yourself in, and had to relly on a harness. It had a roomy forward cabin, and a nice cozy quarter berth, think i paid about 25k for it, sold it for 15k, got it with all the ocean cruising equipment, liferaft, mf/hf radio, epirb, had a hot water heater, had pretty much everything, and that was why i bought it.

I would suggest unless you are getting it for next to nothing, dont buy it, its a boat that needs a huge amount of work to make it suitable for offshore cruising, and that is even if its in perfect condition.

 

[Vic H.]

I had an Irwin 35, and i wouldnt buy one again. They are kind of flimsy. I took that one to Bermuda in December from Florida, had the spreader touching the water at one time, water poured into the boat, came through the hull deck joint, everything about the boat was a problem, the engine filled up with water, becuase their was no vent on the exhaust pipe, the wood round the chainplates had rotted away, and we didnt find it until we were way out at sea, the hull is not the thickest around, she was shoa drafted and just would not sail to the wind, the main sheet was forward of the cockpitt and we had to unzip the dodger to operate it, for the size of boat, it had a poor layout, it had great access to the engine, better than any other boat i have seen, but a huge loss in accomodation, and the lazzaret and cockpitt hatches, everything that went in there, just ended up in the one space, next to the engine, as it all just dumped down to where the engine was. Their were no hand holds inside the cabin. It had quite a roomy cockpitt, but in foul weather you couldnt jam yourself in, and had to relly on a harness. It had a roomy forward cabin, and a nice cozy quarter berth, think i paid about 25k for it, sold it for 15k, got it with all the ocean cruising equipment, liferaft, mf/hf radio, epirb, had a hot water heater, had pretty much everything, and that was why i bought it.

I would suggest unless you are getting it for next to nothing, dont buy it, its a boat that needs a huge amount of work to make it suitable for offshore cruising, and that is even if its in perfect condition.

I can get it for nothing!

 

[MrUnix]

Boat is free.

The financial downfall of many a sailor...
began with those exact words

If anything, get it and part it out.
Send whats left to the scrap metal yard and dump.

Cheers,
Brad

 

[tommays]

Having spent two years on the 500 dollar Cal 29 i can assure with those hull issues they need to pay YOU a good 20,000 and that would just about cover the keel repiar as that is a GIANT issue that goes out of DIY stuff

 

[Bad Obsession]

There is no such thing as a free boat. For what you are going to spend on this boat to fix it, parts alone, will cost you more than buying an operational boat. You can find a NICE Catalina 30 for around 25K or less.

If the engine isn't working and you need to replace it you are looking at 12K. The keel and hull repairs will be even more.

As is it would take a lot of work to get the boat in the water.

Keep looking, figure out what you can afford, and move on. There is a better deal out there. This free boat is like one of those scams where they say that you inherited one million dollars but you need to send them five thousand dollars to get it released from the government.

 

[25yearslater]

I agree wholeheartedly with all the above. Run and don't look back. A recycling project on a larger boat is likely to cost two to three times as much as the average purchase price. And that all depends on an intact hull. If it can't float it ain't a boat.

 

[CaptJake]

For what it's worth............I own an Irwin and can tell you from experience that if the hull is damaged that severely you couldn't pay me to take it. I love 'em and don't find them to be "timid" as other people do but the hull is their weak point. As long as it's sound and well maintained they are great boats and will last forever. A broken keel is like a horse with a bad leg, we all know how that one ends.
"a free boat is worth every penny you paid for it"

 

[AtlanticAl]

I would disagree with what a lot of people commenting say. If the boats free, and you can do the work on her, that it can be a good deal. If howevor, you are not technicaly minded, then forget it. If the boat is not fully equiped, forget it, a new set of saild can be five thousand, i got a secondhand main for the irwin i had, for 1600, it was going to be 3000 new, a winch can cost an easy thousand, but if the keel is the only problem, ou are talking a few hundred in fiberglass gel, and matt, plus, the wood stringers, I would unbolt the keel, drop it, and that is (cant remember rightly) but about five thousand pounds, maybe four or three minimum) then jack the hull back into position, from inside, and outside, then glass it all with tons of glass, thirty dollars a gallon, and you will use easy ten gallons. Plus matt, same amount of money again. Then you have to come up with a way of lowering that keel, then raising it back up, probably easier to build a frame to hold the keel, and raise and lower the boat, with a lot of friends, and several ten ton bottle jacks and a jig built round the boat. Its not like a car, where you can simply attach a ram and push things back into position, you cant push that keel back into position.

I think though if you are getting the boat for free, and you have time, and skills, you could do it. If howevor, you have to hire a skilled man to work on that boat, you could very quickly be out thousands. Even taking the mast down, to transpor it, could cost you six hundred for the hire of a crane, that is the only way you will get that mast down, plus a few thousand to move it, so you leave it where its at, and pay a monthly fee, then travel cost to and from to work on it.

I would say, if you are carefull, and you have some friends to help you, and you were techincaly minded, and able to follow instructions, you could probably fix the keel for less than five grand. I would say between 3 and 5. Sturcturaly, you can make it stronger than it was when it was built, but you will probably never get the angles right, keel will be slightly off, how much difference that will make, i dont know.

Either way, its a big job, and it will take a lot of time and money, and as someone else said, take the boat, part it out, then take the rest to the recylers, i dont know if the keel is lead or cast, but either way, you will get quite a few bucks for it. All the fittings alone, ebay them, mine had self tailing winches a few hundred each.

 

[Vic H.]

Thanks

I would disagree with what a lot of people commenting say. If the boats free, and you can do the work on her, that it can be a good deal. If howevor, you are not technicaly minded, then forget it. If the boat is not fully equiped, forget it, a new set of saild can be five thousand, i got a secondhand main for the irwin i had, for 1600, it was going to be 3000 new, a winch can cost an easy thousand, but if the keel is the only problem, ou are talking a few hundred in fiberglass gel, and matt, plus, the wood stringers, I would unbolt the keel, drop it, and that is (cant remember rightly) but about five thousand pounds, maybe four or three minimum) then jack the hull back into position, from inside, and outside, then glass it all with tons of glass, thirty dollars a gallon, and you will use easy ten gallons. Plus matt, same amount of money again. Then you have to come up with a way of lowering that keel, then raising it back up, probably easier to build a frame to hold the keel, and raise and lower the boat, with a lot of friends, and several ten ton bottle jacks and a jig built round the boat. Its not like a car, where you can simply attach a ram and push things back into position, you cant push that keel back into position.

I think though if you are getting the boat for free, and you have time, and skills, you could do it. If howevor, you have to hire a skilled man to work on that boat, you could very quickly be out thousands. Even taking the mast down, to transpor it, could cost you six hundred for the hire of a crane, that is the only way you will get that mast down, plus a few thousand to move it, so you leave it where its at, and pay a monthly fee, then travel cost to and from to work on it.

I would say, if you are carefull, and you have some friends to help you, and you were techincaly minded, and able to follow instructions, you could probably fix the keel for less than five grand. I would say between 3 and 5. Sturcturaly, you can make it stronger than it was when it was built, but you will probably never get the angles right, keel will be slightly off, how much difference that will make, i dont know.

Either way, its a big job, and it will take a lot of time and money, and as someone else said, take the boat, part it out, then take the rest to the recylers, i dont know if the keel is lead or cast, but either way, you will get quite a few bucks for it. All the fittings alone, ebay them, mine had self tailing winches a few hundred each.

Boat is fully equipped, main & roller furling, lines, halyards, etc. I have done a lot of glass work on smaller boats. I have a friend who owns a boat yard and has a travel lift to lift boat from keel. I looked it over carefully today. I think I will go for it. Worse case is salvage!

Thanks,
Vic H.

 

[Prime Time]

Steps to success with this project!

1. Remove all useable hardware and gear
2. Sell them on ebay
3. Remove keel as sell as scrap
4. Cut up hull with sawzall and place in garbage bin
5. Take proceeds and buy a better project boat

 

[AtlanticAl]

Boat is fully equipped, main & roller furling, lines, halyards, etc. I have done a lot of glass work on smaller boats. I have a friend who owns a boat yard and has a travel lift to lift boat from keel. I looked it over carefully today. I think I will go for it. Worse case is salvage!

Thanks,
Vic H.

I am the type of person to take chances too, some pay off, some dont, but i am in my forties, and dont really work for a living, (well manage my own business part time) I would be very interested to hear how you get on. I owned an Irwin Citation 35, I didnt think it was a good boat, but i was using it for blue water cruising, it just wasnt really up to that, all the ports leaked (they were plastic ports that opened, and you couldnt shut them tight enough) When the cockpitt filled, water flowed through the hatch that went to the engine room, but i will say, that cockpitt drained faster than any other boat i have been on. It was quite a roomy boat, and huge amount of space to work on the engine, on a benetua of the same size, you cant even get to the engine, its a couple of small hatches to see the engine. My boat was the shoal draft version. It was awfull to windward, and the Atlantic beat the shit out of it.

A good book for you, would be "The Fiberglass Boat Repair Manual" by Allan H Vaitses, I have a copy, and it covers pretty much everything.

I would say that boat, is worth probably around 25k in great condition, so do your calculations, and bear in mind, if you go to sell it, a surveyor will pick up the reapairs you have done, and carefull and experienced buyer will probably pick them up, and that will either void any interest, or knock a huge amount off the price. So if you do it to get a 25k boat cheap, that is one thing, but you wont ever get 25k for that boat, may be as good as a 25k one when its finished, but the repair willl put people off.

 

[Skipper]

I love that the guy asks for advice, then a dozen savvy sailors advise him in multiple straightforward ways to run like Hell, and then he says, "Yeah, I think I'll go for it".

I love it because, well, I did the same thing:dance:

15 years ago I found a "great deal" on a 1970 24' Seabird sportfisher. 6 months and $9,000 in paid repairs later, I gave it to my mechanic. The trailer wheels were literally falling off, and the transom came up rotten, among other things. I cut my losses and signed it over. I'm not sure he wanted it, but it had a motor that ran, and he was aware of all the parts I had just paid for in the motor, new fuel tank, steering, hoses, electrical, fiberglass, etc etc etc, so he took the boat.

The bright side is that, from doing much myself and also learning from my mechanic, this was how I was forced to learn about boats. Everything....about boats.

 

[Vic H.]

I love that the guy asks for advice, then a dozen savvy sailors advise him in multiple straightforward ways to run like Hell, and then he says, "Yeah, I think I'll go for it".

I love it because, well, I did the same thing:dance:

15 years ago I found a "great deal" on a 1970 24' Seabird sportfisher. 6 months and $9,000 in paid repairs later, I gave it to my mechanic. The trailer wheels were literally falling off, and the transom came up rotten, among other things. I cut my losses and signed it over. I'm not sure he wanted it, but it had a motor that ran, and he was aware of all the parts I had just paid for in the motor, new fuel tank, steering, hoses, electrical, fiberglass, etc etc etc, so he took the boat.

The bright side is that, from doing much myself and also learning from my mechanic, this was how I was forced to learn about boats. Everything....about boats.

I figure worst case if it goes wrong, can part out; good yanmar fresh water cooled, roller furling, decent sails, big piece of lead, etc.

Thanks,
Vic H.