Inverter thoughts, plans, schemes, maybe a plot..

[Chris Patterson]

Greetings again from the lunatic fringe. To start, I am SO glad I'm not moored close to Maine Sail, or I'm fairly sure he would dink over in the middle of the night and scuttle me for this thought. But I've got a 1000 watt inverter, (I forgot the name of it, but recognizable manufacturer), and I guess I'll put the silly thing in, I already own it, and why not. It does not charge the batteries, I have the old Truecharge for that. So instead of just putting it in, and on the occasion that I want to run a LITTLE something on the hook, maybe a small tv or something. But there is no way am I going to have a drop cord running around the cabin. I started by thinking I would just wire in into the 10 amp A.C. receptacles, and put in a double pole switch for when I want to use it. I even heard said to hook it up to the 30 amp main coming in, and be careful about what I turn on. Either of which would work "for me", as no one EVER touches a switch or valve on this boat. It has turned so complex at this time, I have to think about it hard sometimes.

The simplest things....it would seem. So anybody got any connection ideas on this one?

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

There are always a bunch of ways to do something, some of which may not be ideal but with prudent care, will suffice.

One such option which may be appropriate if you are the sole manager of the boat is to simply run the inverter output to the shore power plug as long as the charger if off.

 

[Delezynski]

Chris,

I was going to do a short video about inverters, but decided it might not be the best as some people might not take the warnings I would have to add seriously.

What we do/did for years aboard Guenevere is to use small, portable inverters. We carry about 4 or 5 at any given time. ALL up less than $200.

I made up a small pigtail that has a 110 V plug on both ends. When away from dock, I shut off the 110 battery charger, connect or plug in one of the small inverters and then run the small pigtail from the small inverter to any local 110 outlet aboard. I now have 110 at any outlet. At times I would connect it up in our aft cabin so it was out of the way.

To go that route, you just have to make sure that the charter is OFF!

Greg

 

[Benny17441]

Unless you intend to use the inverter unsupervised The most efficient and economical way of transferring 120V power is through the use of a suitable extension cord. The inverter can easily handle a 50' 14 gauge extension cord which can be easily routed and tucked away to the point of use. The greatest dangers would be tripping on it or pulling it and loosening the plug. I personally would never run the inverter unsupervised but if those are your intentions than connecting to the breaker protected boat wiring would be the way to go.

 

[Chris Patterson]

Yeah, oh wow. Usually I'll ask a question, and then reading a couple of responses is when I remember the info I left out.
Yes, I am the sole operator exclusively. No one is allowed to touch a switch or valve unless I have told them to. This is not a 'harsh' thing, nor do I announce to everyone how "This is MY boat, it is my way", or some equally nutty crap. Most folks recognise immediately that this is not a day boat, and there are many, many switches, and nobody has any knowledge of what they do anyway. (I'm not bragging one iota, but not a lot of 29's are fitted out quite like this one). I'm considering an outrigger..

I did think about building a double male NEMA 5-15 jumper, and that may well be the answer. Simple enough, but Ye Gods! I almost feel like I'm doing something illegal or immoral just to contemplate it. But I might. It ain't like I've never done anything illegal, in fact, your government used to pay me to do it. Anyway..

And no, the boat would never be unattended with a live inverter on. For the exception of the fridge and/or dehumidifier, I rarely leave much going. I basically live on the boat now anyway, so I get to keep close tabs on it.
(I think lovely bride just thinks I'm going thru some mid-life crisis by doing this, and I told her it's either this, or I'm buying a yellow Corvette and wear gold chains with a barely buttoned shirt. It was an easy choice).

And Greg, what is a 'charter'? You talking chartplotter? (I'm just confused, mate. Mostly)..

Hey guys, thanks for the input so far. Big plans coming..

 

[Delezynski]

And Greg, what is a 'charter'? You talking chartplotter? (I'm just confused, mate. Mostly)..

Oooppsssss....

I HATE auto correct! Charger is what I was trying to type.

Greg

 

[Maine Sail]

Chris,

The safest method of installing that type of inverter, on a boat, is to simply wire it to its OWN dedicated AC outlet or AC outlets.

There are many good safety & financial reasons why not to wire it into your AC panel, such as proper marine compliant grounding, transfer switches, the ability for HEF (human error factor) etc. etc..

Hard wire it to the house bank, with the proper sized wire, then place an appropriate Class T or ANL fuse within 7" of the + battery post. Ground/bond the inverter case to the DC ground bus on the boat using green wire no less than 1 size smaller than the pos & neg DC wires. You can now run some 14/3 triplex AC wire and install some AC outlets that will only be run from that inverter. Label them with a label maker "INVERTER ONLY" and you will be good to go. If doing this you really want to be sure this inverter has proper internal protections and a GFCI.

It is tying into the existing AC system where it gets dangerous & costly with inverters. Most "non-marine" inverters don't have the proper grounding protocol so when tying them into the existing system they don't technically meet safety standards where Earth and Neutral are bonded at the source, but only when it is operating...

If you keep the 120V side of your inverter isolated from your ships 120V system it will be easier & less costly. Some cover plates a couple of single gang plastic boxes and a couple of outlets will run you $5.00 - $10.00. A good quality transfer switch will run you a LOT more....

 

[capta]

I'm now on my 4th inverter and every one died an unceremonial death because I turned on the generator (I'm never at the dock) forgetting to cut the power to the inverter. Red tags, red and blue lights everywhere on the switch board, and they just became an often seen and soon forgotten notices of "danger Will Robinson, danger".
So it might be best if you had an either/or switch as we do now. We cannot turn on both, no matter how many rum punches our favorite bartender donates to our sunset tipple.

 

[Chris Patterson]

Haaaaaha. Yeah, I understand the 'self warnings' thing, and agree totaly. The propensity to error, and it is generally on the organic side of the circuit. Kind of like your typical construction jobsite. As safety director on a jobsite, I actually outlawed backup beepers. In direct violation of OSHA standards, but I went with the sensical approach. In observation, there were 2 dozen pieces of heavy equipment, and fully half of them at any given point in time were BEEP, BEEP, BEEPING like holy hell. And NO ONE was paying them any attention because they all became so acclimated to hearing the constant din, it wasn't even noticeable anymore by the crew. It put the responsibility back into the hands of the operator to look out for what he is doing, and the responsibility of ground crews to simply stay away from heavy moving machinery. It became quieter on the job, less 'stimulation overload' from the damn beeping, and the funny thing was, nobody got run over, not even close.
(I'll tell you some other time about me burning down their porta jons. I have a way of getting peoples attention)..

But why I didn't even think of dedicated outlets I'll never know. I guess that is why we ask these things here, the obvious sometimes seems 'lost'. That would for sure eliminate the possibility of letting the smoke out of something. There again, the 'organic' problem being humans, that being me in this example, sooner or later, the wrong switch is thrown. Yep, how many times in a rolling water have I reached for a breaker, and hit the adjacent switch instead. Yeah.

And now I am really bummed out. I was hoping the inverter would run the charger, thereby creating perpetual motion per se. Was even thinking of selling some of the excess power off of my boat..

 

[capta]

.
And now I am really bummed out. I was hoping the inverter would run the charger, thereby creating perpetual motion per se. Was even thinking of selling some of the excess power off of my boat..

What, it doesn't? And here all this time I thought I was cheating the laws of nature. Oh well.

 

[Mark Maulden]

Totally agree with Maine. Yrs ago, I put a Heart Interface 1800 up against a 6KW gennie. Guess who won? Since I live 1/2 hr from where Heart used to be, I took it down there and poured my guts out. They fixed it for free. What I did after that was severe the connection between outlets on the outlet fixture. Just broke off the tabs. Upper outlet was inverter and lower was shore power. Then you don't have to mount more outlets.