Just finished reading "getting rid of Boat Odors" and it is clear we need to re place the majority of our system. The system has never been serviced, there are no vents, the hoses are shot, ETC!!! My plan is to reuse the tank. It is in good shape, is heavy plastic with reinforced fittings etc and replace EVERYTHING else. Is there a way to deodorise the tank??? Once the hoses are removed it is easy to remove the tank. I would replace the tank too but the tank has a custom shape so I imagine it would be very difficult to find a replacement tank. We have a 30 foot sailboat and plan to stick with a manual head. The current head is a "Headmate" (probably 10 years old). Any suggestions on what to replace it with??? Thanks!!!!! Mal Leichter
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Peggie Hall/HeadMistress
Wise decision
And, as long as the tank is in good shape--hasn't permeated and doesn't have a layer of sludge on the bottom that's turned to concrete, there's no reason to replace it...in fact, the tank was the only part of a 20 yr old sanitation system I kept when I restored my last boat. There's no need to "sanitize" it...just clean it out well with detergent and water. While it's out of the boat and clean would be a good time to relocate any fittings if necessary--to put the tank inlet and vent toward the centerline of the boat and increase the diameter of the vent. Your best choice for a new toilet is the Raritan PH II, which has been rated best manual toilet under $500 for decades. If space is tight, the PHC is the same pump on a compact base. Hoses: go with SeaLand "OdorSafe" brand for all the 1.5"...pricy at $8/ft list, but the only hose that really is "bullet proof" against odor permeation. Use Shields or Trident #148 for all other sizes--tank vent, head intake, and the 1" hose coming out of an macerator. Complete the job by installing a tank level indicator...check out the Snake River AcuGage...you can even put your water and fuel tanks on the same system. Their website is at http://www.snake-river.org The online chandlery here has it for a VERY good price. If your budget will stand it, now would be an excellent time to add a Lectra/San (CG certified Type I MSD that treats waste and discharges it overboard legally) to the system--a MUCH sounder ecological approach to onboard waste management than holding tanks. CT and NY coastal waters are not "no discharge"...you'd only have to use your holding tank if/when you do visit "no discharge" waters. Check out the Lectra/San on the Raritan site at http://www.raritaneng.com If there's any way you can get by with what you have till the weather cools off--even if it means putting a portapotty aboard for the rest of this season--this project will be a lot more pleasant job than doing it in the heat of the summer.
And, as long as the tank is in good shape--hasn't permeated and doesn't have a layer of sludge on the bottom that's turned to concrete, there's no reason to replace it...in fact, the tank was the only part of a 20 yr old sanitation system I kept when I restored my last boat. There's no need to "sanitize" it...just clean it out well with detergent and water. While it's out of the boat and clean would be a good time to relocate any fittings if necessary--to put the tank inlet and vent toward the centerline of the boat and increase the diameter of the vent. Your best choice for a new toilet is the Raritan PH II, which has been rated best manual toilet under $500 for decades. If space is tight, the PHC is the same pump on a compact base. Hoses: go with SeaLand "OdorSafe" brand for all the 1.5"...pricy at $8/ft list, but the only hose that really is "bullet proof" against odor permeation. Use Shields or Trident #148 for all other sizes--tank vent, head intake, and the 1" hose coming out of an macerator. Complete the job by installing a tank level indicator...check out the Snake River AcuGage...you can even put your water and fuel tanks on the same system. Their website is at http://www.snake-river.org The online chandlery here has it for a VERY good price. If your budget will stand it, now would be an excellent time to add a Lectra/San (CG certified Type I MSD that treats waste and discharges it overboard legally) to the system--a MUCH sounder ecological approach to onboard waste management than holding tanks. CT and NY coastal waters are not "no discharge"...you'd only have to use your holding tank if/when you do visit "no discharge" waters. Check out the Lectra/San on the Raritan site at http://www.raritaneng.com If there's any way you can get by with what you have till the weather cools off--even if it means putting a portapotty aboard for the rest of this season--this project will be a lot more pleasant job than doing it in the heat of the summer.
M
Mal Leichter
Vented Loop
Peggy In your book you talk about changing the 90 degree fitting to a straight fitting on the waste line and putting the vented loop in th head area. Is it OK to route it down through the floor and then up behind the cabinets and install the loop there??? Do the Vented loops need to be vented to the outside. If so can you tie the Intake vent, the discharge vent, and the tank vent all together? Seems to me that the vented loop on the discharge side is going to make it it so the bowl can't be pumped dry. Is that right??? If so How high should the top of the vented loop be??? The lid of my current toilet is just about at the waterline (without heel) Thanks!!!!! Mal
Peggy In your book you talk about changing the 90 degree fitting to a straight fitting on the waste line and putting the vented loop in th head area. Is it OK to route it down through the floor and then up behind the cabinets and install the loop there??? Do the Vented loops need to be vented to the outside. If so can you tie the Intake vent, the discharge vent, and the tank vent all together? Seems to me that the vented loop on the discharge side is going to make it it so the bowl can't be pumped dry. Is that right??? If so How high should the top of the vented loop be??? The lid of my current toilet is just about at the waterline (without heel) Thanks!!!!! Mal
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Peggie Hall/HeadMistress
You got it backwards...
There's no way to use a straight toilet discharge fitting if you're gonna install a vented loop...would you aim the hose straight up to the loop unless it's a 90? "Is it OK to route it down through the floor and then up behind the cabinets and install the loop there?" Why would that be easier than just coming straight up out of the toilet to a loop mounted over the toilet? How are you gonna get to the loop to clean the air valve occasionally if it's buried behind cabinets? No, it does not have to be vented to the outside of the boat if the air valve that's SUPPOSED to be in the hole in the nipple on the top of the loop is there. "If so can you tie the Intake vent, the discharge vent, and the tank vent all together?" I wouldn't...if any one of 'em gets clogged, they're all clogged. "Seems to me that the vented loop on the discharge side is going to make it it so the bowl can't be pumped dry. Is that right???" Nope. Any toilet that's working anywhere near specs can move waste at least 6' in the dry mode--and that includes at least foot of vertical rise at the beginning. "If so How high should the top of the vented loop be???" 8-12" above the boat's waterline any angle of heel. (That's in my book, btw) You might want to spend a bit more time reading the book a bit more carefully before you start any work...'cuz you've already confused at least one thing and missed something else. I'd hate to have to tell you got something backwards AFTER you did it.
There's no way to use a straight toilet discharge fitting if you're gonna install a vented loop...would you aim the hose straight up to the loop unless it's a 90? "Is it OK to route it down through the floor and then up behind the cabinets and install the loop there?" Why would that be easier than just coming straight up out of the toilet to a loop mounted over the toilet? How are you gonna get to the loop to clean the air valve occasionally if it's buried behind cabinets? No, it does not have to be vented to the outside of the boat if the air valve that's SUPPOSED to be in the hole in the nipple on the top of the loop is there. "If so can you tie the Intake vent, the discharge vent, and the tank vent all together?" I wouldn't...if any one of 'em gets clogged, they're all clogged. "Seems to me that the vented loop on the discharge side is going to make it it so the bowl can't be pumped dry. Is that right???" Nope. Any toilet that's working anywhere near specs can move waste at least 6' in the dry mode--and that includes at least foot of vertical rise at the beginning. "If so How high should the top of the vented loop be???" 8-12" above the boat's waterline any angle of heel. (That's in my book, btw) You might want to spend a bit more time reading the book a bit more carefully before you start any work...'cuz you've already confused at least one thing and missed something else. I'd hate to have to tell you got something backwards AFTER you did it.
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Mal Leichter
I read it!!!!
Peggy I did read the 8"-12" above the water line piece in the book. It just didn't make sense that (in the dry mode) liquid could be "pumped" and uphill too, by air. That is contrary to all the fluid dynamic principles I learned in physics. The reason I asked about the straight vs 90 degree fitting is because my current head has a straight fitting that goes through the base of the cabinet then up to the tank (with no vented loop). I AM trying to get this right prior to doing it. That is why I am asking these stupid questions. Thanks for the advise of waiting til it is cooler. That is what I was trying to convince my wife of. Your response did it
Peggy I did read the 8"-12" above the water line piece in the book. It just didn't make sense that (in the dry mode) liquid could be "pumped" and uphill too, by air. That is contrary to all the fluid dynamic principles I learned in physics. The reason I asked about the straight vs 90 degree fitting is because my current head has a straight fitting that goes through the base of the cabinet then up to the tank (with no vented loop). I AM trying to get this right prior to doing it. That is why I am asking these stupid questions. Thanks for the advise of waiting til it is cooler. That is what I was trying to convince my wife of. Your response did it
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Peggie Hall/HeadMistress
Test it on the bench...
A little water will remain in the hose between the toilet and the top of the loop--which is no big deal as long as it IS just water, not waste--but at least 90% of what's in the bowl will make it over the top of the loop. Vented loops are only required on lines that connect to below-waterline thru-hulls. So, if the toilet will only flush into the tank--no y-valve in the discharge line to allow you flush directly overboard at sea, you don't need a vented loop in the head discharge line...only a high arch in the line--which can be anywhere--to prevent waste in the tank from running back toward the toilet when you're heeled...and if the head intake fitting on the tank is toward the centerline of the boat instead of toward the hull, you don't even need that. It may require moving the tank inlet and vent fittings...but that's not hard to do while the tank is out of the boat and clean. Threaded plugs will seal the existing fittings.
A little water will remain in the hose between the toilet and the top of the loop--which is no big deal as long as it IS just water, not waste--but at least 90% of what's in the bowl will make it over the top of the loop. Vented loops are only required on lines that connect to below-waterline thru-hulls. So, if the toilet will only flush into the tank--no y-valve in the discharge line to allow you flush directly overboard at sea, you don't need a vented loop in the head discharge line...only a high arch in the line--which can be anywhere--to prevent waste in the tank from running back toward the toilet when you're heeled...and if the head intake fitting on the tank is toward the centerline of the boat instead of toward the hull, you don't even need that. It may require moving the tank inlet and vent fittings...but that's not hard to do while the tank is out of the boat and clean. Threaded plugs will seal the existing fittings.
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