Inflatable PFD

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Jim

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May 21, 2007
775
Catalina 36 MK II NJ
Larry, Michigan City is tough

you are right I didn;t read it through. The law is the law. I can't believe they gave him a ticket fot that. We don't do that in New Jersey. Never the less the law is the law and he will have to pay the ticket! He was more than likely boating without them on. If he is on the boat, then they need to be on. That is why I carry 6 standard PDFs.
 

CalebD

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Jun 27, 2006
1,479
Tartan 27' 1967 Nyack, NY
Those savages (salvors) were just like lawyers

following a hearse. I also heard somewhere that it is not a good idea to tether yourself to a sinking boat. Not quite sure where I got that idea from but there it is. It is always a good idea to comply with the Colregs of where you are sailing regarding pfds, liferafts and other equipment. Once out of sight of land you can make your own rules.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
Jim , My ocean sailing friends tell me that

ten miles off shore in the ocean is far better than the Chesapeake Bay in twenty knots.
 

LJR

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Jun 22, 2004
80
Macgregor 26S Dallas, TX
I agree

Jim, I also carry plenty and keep them handy. I have one inflatible that I use especially when kayaking. as a former law enforcement officer I've just found that some of my compatriots became a little "badge happy" and that a judge could level out the playing field. Certainly violations should not be overlooked, but neither should technicalities be used like battering rams. These laws are there to protect us when we sometimes don't use good judgement on our own. Interestingly, I just had an interchange locally with a deputy who was wearing a full pfd when all the officers I had seen lately wore an inflatible. I asked him about it. He replied, "take yours and throw it as far as you can and wear a real one". He related the recent loss of a working buddy in a rescue situation. He went into the water attempting to rescue an overturned boater in flood conditions. The current caught the officer and pulled him under even though he had on the inflatible (inflated) pfd and was a strong swimmer. I haven't thrown mine away, but I am more cognisant of what conditions I'm dealing with. If I had 4-8 foot seas (which I have many times in the Gulf), I'd wear the regular pfd now rather than the inflatible. Better safe than sorry.......or dead. Life is so short and death is so long.
 

Mike B

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Apr 15, 2007
1,013
Beneteau 43 Baltimore, MD
Prevention

Ross the tether is to help prevent you from going over and therefore needing the vest at all. You could just wear a harness for the same purpose but the vests are nice for when you're not tethered. Let's you have your cake and eat it too. As far as the ruling that it must be worn to qualify, I recall early versions were not USCG certified and there was a battle over if they should be approved or not. There were a couple of manufacturers with variability in design. Additionally there were no standards to work from so each was designed differently. Taking into account that folks are slow to accept change, the technical nature of the firing devices, plus the legal issues should one fail to work properly the CG was slow to recognize them as approved PFDs. Their acceptance was one of compromise which mandated that they be worn to be counted as a PFD. For what it's worth I can get mine on a lot faster than any of my traditional PFDs plus it's far less cumbersome and certainly more comfortable to wear. Mike
 
Dec 9, 2006
694
Oday 22 Hickory, NC
I also wonder...

...while having no more information than was provided...if there could have been some'attitude' involved that made DNR write the ticket? For what it's worth! Jack
 
May 11, 2005
3,431
Seidelman S37 Slidell, La.
Ross your right

Ross your right about the Chessy vs offshore. One of the worst beatings I have ever taken was off the mouth of the Potomac last fall coming south. About thirty knots out of the north. Would much rather be out in the open gulf with thirty knots than that.
 

LloydB

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Jan 15, 2006
927
Macgregor 22 Silverton
inflatables aren't infallible do you check yours?

fyi The passenger from the left rear seat stated that she did not know how to swim and was panicked. She stated that she donned her PFD vest but had trouble remembering the safety briefing and tried to inflate it while inside the helicopter but could not figure out how to do it. 21 She stated that she attempted to assist the passenger in the rear right center seat, who was having difficulty because he was tangled with his headset. After she exited the helicopter out the left side and reached the surface, she still could not figure out how to inflate her PFD. The passenger from the right rear seat assisted her by pulling at least one of the inflation handles to inflate her vest for her. The passenger from the right rear seat stated that he then dove back down to the helicopter to attempt to extricate the passenger from the rear right center seat. When he resurfaced with that passenger, who was having difficulties breathing, he put that passenger’s PFD vest over the passenger’s head and inflated it for him. 22 The pilot stated that he was already completely under water when he released his seatbelt. He stated that, as he made his way out the helicopter’s left side, he tried to see or feel for passengers as he exited, but he did not find anyone. He stated that he made his way to the surface then tried to dive back down to the helicopter, but he could not find its door. He then returned to the surface and found one passenger being supported by two others. He stated that he helped one of the passengers don and inflate a life vest and that he donned and inflated his own vest. Recovery personnel found the body of the passenger in the front center seat still secured in the seat by the lap belt and wearing an uninflated PFD vest. The body of the passenger from the front left seat was found floating facedown in the water and wearing a PFD vest. First responders recalled that the passenger’s PFD vest appeared inflated, but they did not know if only one or both chambers appeared inflated. At some point during recovery of the victim, the PFD was removed from the body and misplaced; therefore, it was not available for examination to determine its actual inflation configuration. TESTS AND RESEARCH Examination and Functional Testing of Recovered Personal Flotation Devices Four of the six PFDs from the accident were recovered for examination; 23 all of the recovered PFDs were Hoover Industries model FV-35E, manufactured in accordance with Technical Standard Order (TSO)-C13e. This model PFD features two separate inflation chambers that a user must inflate separately by pulling each chamber’s plastic handle. According to the PFD’s design, each chamber is equipped with a pressurized, 16-gram, carbon dioxide cylinder that punctures when the handle is pulled, releasing the pressurized gas into the chamber to inflate it fully within 2 seconds. Each chamber is also equipped with an oral inflation tube into which the user can blow to inflate the chamber. One of the recovered PFDs belonged to the passenger in the front center seat. Examination revealed that neither chamber was inflated and that the plastic inflation handles were not pulled. Testing revealed both chambers inflated when the handles were pulled. The three other recovered PFDs were, on the basis of passenger interviews, those that were used by the pilot and the two surviving passengers, though it was not known which PFD belonged to which occupant. Examination of these vests revealed one had both chambers inflated, and the other two vests each had only one chamber inflated. Examination and testing of one PFD that had only one chamber inflated revealed the other chamber inflated when the handle was pulled. Examination of the other PFD that had only one chamber inflated revealed that the inflation cylinder for the uninflated section was dimpled in the discharge area but was not punctured. Testing revealed that, after the dimpled cylinder was reinstalled in the PFD, pulling the inflation handle punctured the cylinder, and the chamber inflated. Water-Immersion Performance Demonstration of Personal Flotation Devices Heli-USA provided the investigative team with two PFDs: one was a Hoover Industries model FV-35E, and the other was an Eastern Aero Marine model KSE- 35HC2L8. 24 Heli-USA had recently retired both PFDs from service after about 12 months of use in accordance with the manufacturers’ recommended inspection interval. 25 These PFDs were used for water-immersion demonstrations to examine donning procedures and to compare vest performance with one and both chambers inflated. Two test subjects 26 entered the water before donning the PFD vests, and each described that the vests were “relatively easy” to put on but that two hands were required to place the vest over the head while in the water. The subjects found that, with only one vest chamber inflated, each PFD provided flotation for the wearer, and they were able to remain at the surface with their heads above the water. The subjects also found that, with only one chamber inflated, if they simulated unconsciousness and made no attempts to right themselves, it was possible for them to float facedown. With both vest chambers inflated, it was not possible for either subject to float facedown; the PFDs rolled them to a faceup position within seconds. According to TSO-C13e, which specifies that the PFD must right a wearer who is in a facedown position, the buoyant force needed to meet the TSO is determined with both chambers inflated. During the demonstration, when the subjects first attempted to pull the inflation handles one at a time, the investigator found that one chamber on the Eastern Aero Marine PFD failed to inflate when the handle was pulled. Examination revealed that the threaded cylinder for that chamber was not screwed securely into its housing. When the investigator properly seated the cylinder and then pulled the inflation handle, the chamber inflated. Following these demonstrations, another Hawaii air tour operator voluntarily examined 13 PFD vests that had been recently retired from service after about 1 year of use. 27 Each PFD had 2 inflation cylinders, and the operator reported that 18 of the 26 cylinders were loose in their housings.
 

caguy

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Sep 22, 2006
4,004
Catalina, Luger C-27, Adventure 30 Marina del Rey
We got boarded by the CG last weekend.

They were very nice and courteous. They were also amazingly young. They all looked to be in their early twenties. My wife made me stop asking the cute young lady to frisk me. The only annoyance was that their boat kept bumping us hard while they boarded. One of the young ladies piloting their boat was getting within inches of ripping my motor off. I must have looked concerned because he told her to back off. They wrote us up because the throwable's tag was missing, and therefore no longer serviceable. They also wrote us up for 11 year old flares. He said that there will be no fines. He indicated that they are not an enforcement organization but are there to educate. He said to buy the two items and save the receipt for a letter we would need to answer in about two weeks. Frank
 
E

Ed Wolfe

PFD test

As an instructor for U.S.P.S and a private boat club, I hand out several types of PFD during the class. I then tell them the boat is sinking ,put on the PFD.You would be supprised whats happens . The inflatable rearly gets put on , the type 1 gets on but not correctly ,but the ski vest gets on and correctly.My point, wear it. You don't have time when it counts . Also I have not had problems with boardings (4 times this year, Iam on the water nearly every day) One thing to remember , have a photo ID it will save you a lot of trouble . Try this test with your crew next time . Happy sailing
 

Jim

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May 21, 2007
775
Catalina 36 MK II NJ
Ross,

it has to do with wave periods. It the time between waves. The longer the period the better the ride. 20 MPH is every afternoon wind on the bay were we sail. If it is blowing from the North or South the fetch is longer and the wave build up nicely. This all depend on conditions. There is still a world of difference between inside and outside. I'll take 30 mph inside over 25 outside. You know your safer inside. You know you can get help when you need inside. Why don't you plan to come up this summer. Sail up north to say New York and then motor back. Maybe is you wait you can catch a wind out of the north to blow you back.
 
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