Inexpensive Autopilot??

[nemosuit]

I was looking at Aubrey Scott's video and noticed he was running a Tiller Tamer. Steering control is something I've been interested in, for a lot of reasons; but the TT device is new to me.

Did some online searching and learned a little more about how the TT works, and I think I like it. As an alternative, one sailor said electronic autopilots aren't very expensive. I did a quick shop-around, and actually the prices weren't all that low.

I've got a bunch of stuff in the shop: actuators, cylinders, motors and the like; and I believe I could make one. I have a hydraulic pump and cylinder from a Mercruiser trim system that might be adapted to the purpose; noodling around about how to interface that with some form of heading sensing indicator...

Meanwhile, thought I'd ask. Any of you folks using an electronic autopilot on your tiller-steered sailboats? For a complete, off-the-shelf unit, what kind of money are we talking, retail? Any thoughts on best bargains or alternatives?

As always, thanks in advance.

VBR,

Pat

 

[JDK]

I use the Raymarine ST2000 on our 26D. We bought the boat with an ST1000 on it, but Raymarine couldn't seem to get the bugs out of it, and traded me up to the 2000, for about $350. We really like the tiller pilot, and would definetly replace it if it quit. We interface it with the Garmin 76Cx, and are very happy with the results.

If you decide to go with a tiller pilot, keep it as far away from the outboard as possible, especially if you have a charging circuit on the outboard. The magnetic field on our 10 amp charge circuit wreaked havoc with the compass on the pilot and we had to move pilot over to the othe side of the stern.

We've tried sailing with the Tiller Tamer, but it isn't good for very long, as it doesn't adjust to any change in wind or waves. It's great to hold a course for a short time while you go change headsails or something. It's also great for keeping the rudder from swinging while we're trailering the boat.

thx
JDK

 

[Robspan]

I have the same autopilot as JDK, and my experience is about the same. Unless you have near perfect conditions, you can't sail with it. But it's great for motoring. Being at the helm when you're motoring in a calm is boring. Also, it's really nice to be able to leave the helm even for just a few minutes to do minor chores, and know that the boat will be on course. I singlehand a lot and I wouldn't be without it.

 

[JDK]

Robspan, I hope I didn't give the wrong impression about the Raymarine. We use it a a lot, even race with it if we both need to be busy and want the course held while we do something. The only time the pilot is not good is when there is a following sea, and then it wallows and overcorrects. It's the Tiller Tamer that we don't use very much.

Sorry if I made that original post confusing. I'll chalk it up to my advancing age...

thx
JDK

 

[flynfol]

If you singlehand or plan to, a tillerpilot is indispensible. As others have said, it doesn't work the greatest in a following sea. It can hold a better course than I usually. Without integrating a gyro, it can't anticipate large waves. I think you would be hard pressed to make one for less than the cost of a used one. The ST2000 has a faster lock to lock and has bearings.....a worthwhile upgrade.

 

[timebandit]

If you want an autopilot spend the money.

I just use a bungee on one side of the tiller and a line on the other because I just could not bring myself to drill a hole in the tiller.

I enjoy setting the sails so the boat just heads up a little and then falls off to the original course, it's sortta of a ballance game.

 

[Robspan]

JDK, that's my bad. I misread your post. My experience with sailing with the autopilot is different from yours. If there's any kind of a sea, mine just can't react quickly enough and it wanders all over the place.

 

[Capt. Kermie]

Although mine is not a tiller style but rather a wheel style I thought I'd chime in anyways. An electronic wheel/Tiller pilot is a toy for your toy boat, kind of like earings & necklace for your boat. You really need to narrow down your exact need and what you want it to do. A mechanical style jury rigged tiller tamer may fill your needs just fine and cost much less. I bought the Raymarine ST4000 MKII+ a few years back and am totally spoilled by it, cost over a thousand dollars but I still love it, wouldn't be without it now. I don't even use all the functions, it is under utilized at the present but I do plan to learn how to harness all the available functions. Fact is, I could have made do with something cheaper and simpler but now I am locked into a love affair with a nice electronic wheel pilot. Really define your needs before jumping in. If it is just for getting your sails up & down while single handing a tamer may fit the bill, if you want to have it all and spoil yourself, spend the bucks on an expensive electronic one.

 

[MrBill_FLL]

I have the tp10, and its been awesome. worth every penny, and I would buy a new one if it broke.

I have not had a problem with engine interference , and I like being on the same side as the AP and the engine. I also mounted mine about 5" shorter than recommended and its been fine. (but I do have a balanced rudder)

I short or single hand a lot, so its a dream when I raise or lower sails, and for going below to get a drink. it won't handle the rough stuff, but I've always been able to shorten sails or find some point where the AP will hold a course long enough to go below. even if thats heaving to.




http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h169/ftldiver2/MACGREGOR/PC160017.jpg

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h169/ftldiver2/MACGREGOR/PC160015.jpg

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h169/ftldiver2/MACGREGOR/Picture020.jpg



- now one thing I also did is add a jam cleat to the underside of the tiller and run a line from side to side and wrap it around the cleat. which is similar function to the tiller tamer, with less bulk.

 

[ffaubert]

I'm with TB.

Take a line at least 1-1/2 times the width of the cockpit. Fasten a short piece of bungee to one end (your choice of knot, but reef knots are bad here). Fasten the non-bungee end to the cleat aft of the jib/genny winch, take an open clovehitch around the tiller and fasten the bungee end to the cleat on the opposite side of the cockpit.

Set your course and take the slack out on the non-bungee side of the cockpit.

It'll hold that course until you change it, no batteries to wear down, no wet electronics. It's called "Tying down the tiller". Been done for centuries, still works today.

The aside is that it will not follow a GPS course, shift with the wind or tell you when you're about to hit a rock but if all you need to do is nick below to get a quick cup of Joe or a fizzy (and, of course, you've checked your horizon), this is really hard to beat. Also works well if you want to sit in the cockpit and enjoy the scenery without having your leg draped over the tiller.

Holding a tiller while cruising gets old fast. Racing,... now that's different entirely.

(Sorry, had "Tying down the wheel" before. I don't think they used wheels a few centuries ago but, as usual, I could be wrong).

 

[MrBill_FLL]

the problem I had with the line over the tiller (or the bungy ) is when motoring, it doesn't hold a course for long.

harder to raise sails if its going to veer off the wind...

 

[nemosuit]

Wow! Thanks guys! Answered all my questions and then some. :dance:

As far as my intended use goes: At first, I'm going to be sailing Kumukahi manually, to get the feel. A lot of back-and-forth inside the Hilo Breakwater, and maybe in protected areas like Kawaihae, before I get more adventurous.

Once I get wired to the boat, I'll probably do some coastal jaunts to secluded dive sites on the Leeward (Kailua Kona) side of the island.

I'm thinking in any of those situations, it's probably best (more educational) for me to sail by hand AMAP; and I'll probably rig something like a Tamer or the bungie rig to facilitate short tasks. Good tips there, thanks!

But some day I'd like to try to sail the boat inter-island: and we're talking about a lot of time sitting at the tiller. I think I'd probably petrify in that position!

So...I'm thinking about a good autopilot, and your insight has been invaluable. If it costs some bucks, it's worth it if it only saves my life once.

Anyway, I'm working tomorrow, so I'll cut this short. Many mahalos to all.

VBR,

Pat

 

[timebandit]

Miller time and the perfect time for the bungee and line tiller control. Not to mention that you can then change direction by just moving from one seat to the other to change headings or with four aboard you can tobagin(?) the boat.

 

[ffaubert]

I just thought of something to make the "poor man's autopilot" easier and better.

There's another discussion on the board about different types of cleats. Why not put a jam cleat (like Ross' picture) on the top or bottom of the tiller?

Then you could just run the line with a piece of bungee (to take out shocks) right across the cockpit and jam it into the cleat on the tiller. Want to move the tiller a bit? Just pop the line and force it back in again.

That would be much easier that slacking off the line, adjusting the tiller and re-cleating the line again.

 

[Mark Major]

I've had some fun with tying off on longer offshore runs, setting the sheets and letting Lesismor sail herself. Cruising a heading all day, or most of it, can be tedious and the sun brutal. I've found that once set to hold a course (usually as timebandit described) I can go below (with handheld GPS) for quite some time to get out of the sun, making course corrections by shifting my weight as needed. The challenge can be not falling asleep or getting lazy about poking my head out on a regular basis to take a look for other craft. One precaution I do take is to rig a trailing line off the stern, or when conditions warrant a jack line, tether and harness, is to rig the line so that if I do fall over it will disrupt the angle of the tiller (for obvious reasons).

 

[caguy]

I found my st100 on craigslist for $100. I also use the Tiller Tamer. You can adjust the drag so you can move the tiller without unlocking it and it will stay put. The tiller tamer I believe was about $25. Probably about the same as a couple of cleats but works much better. I have also picked up tillermasters for $50-$75. I even put a remote wireless switch in it so I could control it from the bow.

 

[Sumner]

.... I also use the Tiller Tamer. You can adjust the drag so you can move the tiller without unlocking it and it will stay put. The tiller tamer I believe was about $25...............

We use one and I like it used as mentioned. Ruth doesn't care for it much. I can see where at some point an autopilot might be in our future, but for now with the two of us not minding the tiller it will probably be down the road a ways.

c ya,

Sum

 

[BrokeNotBroken]

I have been considering the Autohelm ST1000 for some time now. West Marine has them on sale for $399 + an additional $50 off until Wednesday, so $349 + tax. I'm not trying to peddle West Marine but I think the price is good. It's the lowest I've seen on this so far.

 

[flynfol]

The secret I found with the tillerpilot is to trim sails /balance the helm, then engage. Remember the st series do not have end stops on the actuator. If you let it run to the end of the travel, it makes a heck of a racket, and WILL damage the plastic gears inside. I generallly use it while hoisting sails, or going forward. I also use a tillertamer, but that will not hold a good enough heading into the wind for raising sails. Don't "leave" the ship when engaged because "Otto" won't turn around to pick you up....

 

[JDK]

Good point, flynfol. The 1000 I had did just that, and I had to take it apart to un-stick it. The rebuilt 2000 I purchased, though, has rubber grommets on the ends of the thrust rod, and will 'rebound' if you take it too far either in or out. Not sure if that is factory now, or was added at the shop when this one was refurbished, but it makes a ton of difference.

Simply from personal experience, I'd opt for the 2000 if there was any way I could afford it.

JDK