I'm new and trying to learn and I'd like a brain check. I'm on the Chesapeake Bay. I have a new h260, with only one reef line in the main sail. (This winter I'll have another installed.) But with the strong fall winds, we usually have a 2 to 3 foot chop and we've sailed several times with only the jib sail, and sometimes only a partial jib. Sailing with only a reefed main usually is ok, but the gusts try to knock us over. Even with the sail max'ed leeward, we've seen a 35 degree heel. (My wife doen't like me up on the bow with the boat bouncing around.) Sailing with just the jib, the "weather helm" is sometimes an understatement. My thinking is that the jib, being on the bow... and the rudder at the sterm, are fighting each other? Now, if I get a second reef line in the main and sail with a major reef in the main plus the jib (or partial jib), will the use of the main sail help to equalize the current "weather helm" I'm feeling?
- Status
Consider two reefs.
Frank: You may even want to consider two reef points. A good sailmaker should be able to help you with this. When you have a fractional rig the major power is in your Main Sail. The best way to reef down is it have a small/partial jib for steerage and a reefed main for your drive.
Frank: You may even want to consider two reef points. A good sailmaker should be able to help you with this. When you have a fractional rig the major power is in your Main Sail. The best way to reef down is it have a small/partial jib for steerage and a reefed main for your drive.
Weather Helm
Hi Frank, Weather helm is created by two forces. The main by itself, being aft of the mast, will try to rotate the boat into the wind creating weather helm. The jib by itself, being forward of the mast, will try to rotate the boat away from the wind, creating lee helm. The idea is to use your reefing/furling mechanisms together with the sheets to have the helm in balance with preferably a small amount of weather helm. The second force creating the weather helm is the impact of the degree of heel on the so-called "wetted surface" of the boat. When your mast is upright, water flows around the symmetrical hull shape with little impact on weather helm. As you heel over, the wetted surface of the hull is no longer symmetrical and the force of the water flowing over the assymetrical hull shape creates weather helm. Also the farther over you heel, the less effective the rudder becomes because of its angle of contact with the water. I'm surpised you have weather helm with only a jib up. While adding a double reefed main should help balance the helm in most situations, having more sail area up will add to the degree of heel and as you add sail aft of the mast will also add to the weather helm. I know this isn't what you wanted to hear, but I hope this helps. Gary Wyngarden S/V Shibumi H335
Hi Frank, Weather helm is created by two forces. The main by itself, being aft of the mast, will try to rotate the boat into the wind creating weather helm. The jib by itself, being forward of the mast, will try to rotate the boat away from the wind, creating lee helm. The idea is to use your reefing/furling mechanisms together with the sheets to have the helm in balance with preferably a small amount of weather helm. The second force creating the weather helm is the impact of the degree of heel on the so-called "wetted surface" of the boat. When your mast is upright, water flows around the symmetrical hull shape with little impact on weather helm. As you heel over, the wetted surface of the hull is no longer symmetrical and the force of the water flowing over the assymetrical hull shape creates weather helm. Also the farther over you heel, the less effective the rudder becomes because of its angle of contact with the water. I'm surpised you have weather helm with only a jib up. While adding a double reefed main should help balance the helm in most situations, having more sail area up will add to the degree of heel and as you add sail aft of the mast will also add to the weather helm. I know this isn't what you wanted to hear, but I hope this helps. Gary Wyngarden S/V Shibumi H335
what about the traveler?
Do you know how to sail without the tiller by just setting the sails? If you pull in the jib and let out the main the boat will fall off the wind and if you pull in the main and let out the jib the boat will head up into the wind.
Do you know how to sail without the tiller by just setting the sails? If you pull in the jib and let out the main the boat will fall off the wind and if you pull in the main and let out the jib the boat will head up into the wind.
Second a Second Reef
Steve's suggestion about a second reef is a good one for the strong winds you're talking about. Not only will it help to get the boat back up on it's feet where it can be controlled easier, it'll help protect the sails from getting blown out. As the sails develop increased draft from overloading the sail cloth they will cause more weather helm and the boat won't point as well making a bad situation worse. Ask the sailmaker if he'd recommend any additional telltails on the jib or the main. My OEM main didn't have any and my new one does and they're really helpful. They don't cost much and they help with sail trim. It was mentioned that your wife doesn't like to see you on the bow under nasty conditions so it appears you don't have a roller furler for the jib (?). A roller furler would be another good addition so the jib can be controled from the cockpit. To supplement the cunningham, a backstay a backstay adjuster would be another good investment to control headstay sag and jib and mainsail sail shape. Flatter sails will reduce healing. Looks like you're getting good utilization out of your investment by going out in these tough conditions - keep up the good work!
Steve's suggestion about a second reef is a good one for the strong winds you're talking about. Not only will it help to get the boat back up on it's feet where it can be controlled easier, it'll help protect the sails from getting blown out. As the sails develop increased draft from overloading the sail cloth they will cause more weather helm and the boat won't point as well making a bad situation worse. Ask the sailmaker if he'd recommend any additional telltails on the jib or the main. My OEM main didn't have any and my new one does and they're really helpful. They don't cost much and they help with sail trim. It was mentioned that your wife doesn't like to see you on the bow under nasty conditions so it appears you don't have a roller furler for the jib (?). A roller furler would be another good addition so the jib can be controled from the cockpit. To supplement the cunningham, a backstay a backstay adjuster would be another good investment to control headstay sag and jib and mainsail sail shape. Flatter sails will reduce healing. Looks like you're getting good utilization out of your investment by going out in these tough conditions - keep up the good work!
Been there
This was our first season on the Chesapeake with our H26 and we went through the exact same thing, so I can tell you what I've learned over the course of the season. I understand how your wife feels about you up on the cabin top trying to reef in the Chesapeake Chop. In a way, it's as challenging for the worried spectator as the person actually doing it. Two things help this situation: wear a PFD up there, and make sure your wife knows how to pick you up if she ends up alone in the boat. She'll feel a lot better. If they're saying 10 knots, we know by now to be ready for more. So we set up our reef before we leave the dock or trailer so we don't have to mess with it out on the water. If the wind turns out to be lighter, it's much easier to shake one out that to put one in. We have paid the round-up price a few times because reefing seemed like more trouble than it was worth. This winter we're installing single-line reefing so we can reef the main from the cockpit. Well worth $150 to avoid going up there in the chop. If it doesn't seem quite heavy enough to reef but the thought is starting to cross my mind (as happens so often on the Bay!), I take an interim step by easing the boom vang and tightening the topping lift until the top of the main twists off to leeward. This de-powers the top of the sail while maintaining drive in the lower part of the sail and keeps the main's effort down close to the boat. (This assumes your new H260 has no traveler, like my '96 H26.) In a big gust when sailing close-hauled, I ease my main AND turn up a little. Assuming a constant boat speed, an increase in wind speed (the gust) causes the apparent wind angle to move aft. This opens the angle of attack on the sale and puts more pressure on the leech of the main, which pushes the boat over even with the main eased. (I have plenty of first-hand experience with this!) Combine the big roach of the main with a barely effective rudder (due to the increased angle of heel from the gust) and you have so much power so far behind the mast that the boat spins into the wind. If I don't change something during the gust, in essence I go from nicely close-hauled to a beam reach with the main sheeted on the centerline--a configuration guaranteed to push the boat over. So I turn up to maintain the same angle between mainsail and wind during a gust. Sometimes one or the other, easing the main or turning up, is enough. In the big gusts, I do both. If I get a blast while on an apparent-wind beam reach, I ease the main and turn down a little rather than up. This momentarily puts me on a broad reach or even a run, and pushes the boat forward instead of over. This turn down is a small correction; the apparent wind has already moved aft, so it doesn't take much. I am very careful of how far down I turn so I don't jibe the boat. Easing the main at the same time keeps me out of accidental jibe territory. Re weather helm with jib alone, I can't picture that. Are you sure you don't mean lee helm? Regardless, the boat will always be more balanced with both sails in the appropriate amount for the conditions. As suggested earlier, practice steering the boat with your sails (in good weather). It's a valuable exercise.
This was our first season on the Chesapeake with our H26 and we went through the exact same thing, so I can tell you what I've learned over the course of the season. I understand how your wife feels about you up on the cabin top trying to reef in the Chesapeake Chop. In a way, it's as challenging for the worried spectator as the person actually doing it. Two things help this situation: wear a PFD up there, and make sure your wife knows how to pick you up if she ends up alone in the boat. She'll feel a lot better. If they're saying 10 knots, we know by now to be ready for more. So we set up our reef before we leave the dock or trailer so we don't have to mess with it out on the water. If the wind turns out to be lighter, it's much easier to shake one out that to put one in. We have paid the round-up price a few times because reefing seemed like more trouble than it was worth. This winter we're installing single-line reefing so we can reef the main from the cockpit. Well worth $150 to avoid going up there in the chop. If it doesn't seem quite heavy enough to reef but the thought is starting to cross my mind (as happens so often on the Bay!), I take an interim step by easing the boom vang and tightening the topping lift until the top of the main twists off to leeward. This de-powers the top of the sail while maintaining drive in the lower part of the sail and keeps the main's effort down close to the boat. (This assumes your new H260 has no traveler, like my '96 H26.) In a big gust when sailing close-hauled, I ease my main AND turn up a little. Assuming a constant boat speed, an increase in wind speed (the gust) causes the apparent wind angle to move aft. This opens the angle of attack on the sale and puts more pressure on the leech of the main, which pushes the boat over even with the main eased. (I have plenty of first-hand experience with this!) Combine the big roach of the main with a barely effective rudder (due to the increased angle of heel from the gust) and you have so much power so far behind the mast that the boat spins into the wind. If I don't change something during the gust, in essence I go from nicely close-hauled to a beam reach with the main sheeted on the centerline--a configuration guaranteed to push the boat over. So I turn up to maintain the same angle between mainsail and wind during a gust. Sometimes one or the other, easing the main or turning up, is enough. In the big gusts, I do both. If I get a blast while on an apparent-wind beam reach, I ease the main and turn down a little rather than up. This momentarily puts me on a broad reach or even a run, and pushes the boat forward instead of over. This turn down is a small correction; the apparent wind has already moved aft, so it doesn't take much. I am very careful of how far down I turn so I don't jibe the boat. Easing the main at the same time keeps me out of accidental jibe territory. Re weather helm with jib alone, I can't picture that. Are you sure you don't mean lee helm? Regardless, the boat will always be more balanced with both sails in the appropriate amount for the conditions. As suggested earlier, practice steering the boat with your sails (in good weather). It's a valuable exercise.
actually I was talking about three total.
John N: I was actually recommending that Frank add two additional reef points. The second one would be for above 20kts and the next one would take care of above 25-30kts. I am not that familiar with the 260's but it is usually better to have some main sail up rather than trying to make it with just a furled jib. The sailmaker can give him better advice on this than me. I just know that I wish I had a third reef point once or twice a year (probably should not be out there but what the hell).
John N: I was actually recommending that Frank add two additional reef points. The second one would be for above 20kts and the next one would take care of above 25-30kts. I am not that familiar with the 260's but it is usually better to have some main sail up rather than trying to make it with just a furled jib. The sailmaker can give him better advice on this than me. I just know that I wish I had a third reef point once or twice a year (probably should not be out there but what the hell).
Reefing the main
H260's come from the factory with 1 reef point at approx 50%. This is where most boats have their 2nd reef point. Some owners have added a new 1st below the factory one. As to jiffy reefing, rigged to reef with a single line from the cockpit. you still have to go forward to the mast to "hook" the sail. Has anyone found a way to accomplish that without having to leave the cockpit.? The halyard can be eased to a pre-marked point, reefing lines to secure the extra sail can be tied from the cockpit. But the hook?
H260's come from the factory with 1 reef point at approx 50%. This is where most boats have their 2nd reef point. Some owners have added a new 1st below the factory one. As to jiffy reefing, rigged to reef with a single line from the cockpit. you still have to go forward to the mast to "hook" the sail. Has anyone found a way to accomplish that without having to leave the cockpit.? The halyard can be eased to a pre-marked point, reefing lines to secure the extra sail can be tied from the cockpit. But the hook?
Here is a thought on single line reefing...
...from the cockpit. Imagine the exising in boom reefing line was made longer, and instead of terminating at the cleat on the boom, a turning block was installed to allow the line to go up along the luff of the main to the forward reef point. A block is attached to the existing reefing loop on the sail. The reefing line is fed through the block and led back down the luff of the main to the base of the mast and then led back to the cockpit through a few more blocks. Pulling on the reefing line would pull on the forward and aft reefing points, drawing the sail to the boom. Fair winds... Tom
...from the cockpit. Imagine the exising in boom reefing line was made longer, and instead of terminating at the cleat on the boom, a turning block was installed to allow the line to go up along the luff of the main to the forward reef point. A block is attached to the existing reefing loop on the sail. The reefing line is fed through the block and led back down the luff of the main to the base of the mast and then led back to the cockpit through a few more blocks. Pulling on the reefing line would pull on the forward and aft reefing points, drawing the sail to the boom. Fair winds... Tom
Tom -- luff -> foot?
Tom, I think you mean "foot of the main", not "luff of the main" in your last post. My boat doesn't have any built in reefing lines or anything and I want to set one up: I'll put a padeye on the side of the boom directly below the fore-most reefing point (near the mast). I'll put cheek blocks on the boom directly below each of the other reefing points. I'll then run a line from the padeye, up through an eye in the end of a cunningham hook in the foremost reef point, zig it down to the next cheek block, zag it back up to the cunningham hook in the next reefing point, etc., until I get to the end. I'll have a cleat at the end of the boom to hold it in place. I think that with this set-up I can reef and not even worry about hooking on the rams-horn -- as long as all of the hooks and blocks and lines are strong enough. (I'll still move the outhaul connection, though.) Thoughts?
Tom, I think you mean "foot of the main", not "luff of the main" in your last post. My boat doesn't have any built in reefing lines or anything and I want to set one up: I'll put a padeye on the side of the boom directly below the fore-most reefing point (near the mast). I'll put cheek blocks on the boom directly below each of the other reefing points. I'll then run a line from the padeye, up through an eye in the end of a cunningham hook in the foremost reef point, zig it down to the next cheek block, zag it back up to the cunningham hook in the next reefing point, etc., until I get to the end. I'll have a cleat at the end of the boom to hold it in place. I think that with this set-up I can reef and not even worry about hooking on the rams-horn -- as long as all of the hooks and blocks and lines are strong enough. (I'll still move the outhaul connection, though.) Thoughts?
You CAN get weather helm under jib alone
I never used to think it was possible until it happened to me while single-handing a Catalina 30 in heavy air. I was close reaching under just partially roller-furled jib because it was faster than motoring and I didn't want to leave the cockpit to raise the main. An unusually strong gust heeled the boat until the lee rail and windows were under, then rounded it up violently. Thinking about it afterwards, I rememebered that the force in a sail can be resolved into a lateral component (causing heel) and a forward component (the driving force creating boatspeed). In this case, the lateral component of the gust heeled the boat hard over. The forward driving component was now located way out to leeward of the keel. The rig was being pushed forward, but the hull could not accelerate as quickly, so the driving force pushed the bow of the boat around to windward instead. The problem is worse with modern fin-keeled production boats because there isn't much lateral area under water to resist this turning motion. Full-keeled boats do not have this problem, which is probably why it isn't discussed much in the "traditional" sailing literature. I think it's great that you are practicing how to handle your boat in heavy air. It will make you a better and more confident sailor. Keep it up! Peter H23 "Raven"
I never used to think it was possible until it happened to me while single-handing a Catalina 30 in heavy air. I was close reaching under just partially roller-furled jib because it was faster than motoring and I didn't want to leave the cockpit to raise the main. An unusually strong gust heeled the boat until the lee rail and windows were under, then rounded it up violently. Thinking about it afterwards, I rememebered that the force in a sail can be resolved into a lateral component (causing heel) and a forward component (the driving force creating boatspeed). In this case, the lateral component of the gust heeled the boat hard over. The forward driving component was now located way out to leeward of the keel. The rig was being pushed forward, but the hull could not accelerate as quickly, so the driving force pushed the bow of the boat around to windward instead. The problem is worse with modern fin-keeled production boats because there isn't much lateral area under water to resist this turning motion. Full-keeled boats do not have this problem, which is probably why it isn't discussed much in the "traditional" sailing literature. I think it's great that you are practicing how to handle your boat in heavy air. It will make you a better and more confident sailor. Keep it up! Peter H23 "Raven"
Reefing systems
I added a dual line reefing system to my H240. It's very simple. On my 240 I added swivel clam cleats for the jib sheets so the jam cleats supplied with the boat are not used. I added 1 line to pull down the reefing cringle at the clew. The line was attached at the mast base, up through a steel ring at the cringle (attached to the reefing point with a shackle), down through a turning block on the mast support (port side) and then to the jam cleat. The reefing line at the leech runs through blocks on the other side of the mast base (starboard) and on the other mast support, and then to the other jam cleat. 2 lines to pull and cost me 3 blocks and some line. It works very well and reefing can be done entirely from the cockpit. Tony
I added a dual line reefing system to my H240. It's very simple. On my 240 I added swivel clam cleats for the jib sheets so the jam cleats supplied with the boat are not used. I added 1 line to pull down the reefing cringle at the clew. The line was attached at the mast base, up through a steel ring at the cringle (attached to the reefing point with a shackle), down through a turning block on the mast support (port side) and then to the jam cleat. The reefing line at the leech runs through blocks on the other side of the mast base (starboard) and on the other mast support, and then to the other jam cleat. 2 lines to pull and cost me 3 blocks and some line. It works very well and reefing can be done entirely from the cockpit. Tony
Tony:
You wrote "...pull down the reefing cringle at the clew." Do you mean "...pull down the reefing cringle at the tack."? (e.g near luff/mast)
You wrote "...pull down the reefing cringle at the clew." Do you mean "...pull down the reefing cringle at the tack."? (e.g near luff/mast)
See Reefing in photo forum
Hi, I made a diagram of the single line reefing Idea. It is posted in the photo forum. Fair winds, Tom
Hi, I made a diagram of the single line reefing Idea. It is posted in the photo forum. Fair winds, Tom
Re: Tom's Reefing illustration
That has some similarities to how I was planning to do it. I like the idea of running it to the mast and then aft. My only concern would be the block flapping in the breeze at the cringle that's near the mast. It might cause undue wear on the sail -- especially in strong winds. Also need to figure out how to accommodate sails with two or three sets of reefing points. The line to reef at the aft-most cringle seems to run through the cringle, making it difficult to shift it to a different set of reefing points. However, if you configured it with a block like the other one, you could simply detach it and move it to a different cringle. How did you propose to connect the block to the cringle? I was thinking of using a simple cunningham hook instead of a block. (West Marine, p. 957, #163816, $5.99). It has an eye in the lower end that looks like it would work adequately as a "block". I supposed one could attach a small block to it if the friction of the eye on the reefing line was found to be too great.
That has some similarities to how I was planning to do it. I like the idea of running it to the mast and then aft. My only concern would be the block flapping in the breeze at the cringle that's near the mast. It might cause undue wear on the sail -- especially in strong winds. Also need to figure out how to accommodate sails with two or three sets of reefing points. The line to reef at the aft-most cringle seems to run through the cringle, making it difficult to shift it to a different set of reefing points. However, if you configured it with a block like the other one, you could simply detach it and move it to a different cringle. How did you propose to connect the block to the cringle? I was thinking of using a simple cunningham hook instead of a block. (West Marine, p. 957, #163816, $5.99). It has an eye in the lower end that looks like it would work adequately as a "block". I supposed one could attach a small block to it if the friction of the eye on the reefing line was found to be too great.
Good ideas for single line reefing, but...
it might also be a good idea to tie off the tack and clew cringles with short pieces of line after you have reefed. That way, if the reef line fails (e.g. by chafing inside the boom) you don't end up with an uncontrollable mainsail in the worst possible wind/sea conditions. Peter H23 "Raven"
it might also be a good idea to tie off the tack and clew cringles with short pieces of line after you have reefed. That way, if the reef line fails (e.g. by chafing inside the boom) you don't end up with an uncontrollable mainsail in the worst possible wind/sea conditions. Peter H23 "Raven"
Doug T.
Yes I did mean "...pull down the reefing cringle at the tack." Thanks for correcting my inaccuracy. Tony
Yes I did mean "...pull down the reefing cringle at the tack." Thanks for correcting my inaccuracy. Tony
Reply to Doug T...
Hi Doug, The luff side reef point on my 260 has a loop sewn to the sail instead of the typical grommet. It would be easy to attach a small block to the loop. Tony offers a good suggestion for attaching to the typical cringle setup: tie with a line through the cringle to a ring on the other side. Chafe protection could be added in a couple of ways. Make an inverted pocket from sail cloth or sunbrella; or hold off using tape backed foam insulation stuck to the side of the block. Two reefing points are possible, one on each side. The third becomes a challenge. No matter what reefing scheme, you are going to have a lot of line hanging around with three reefs. Having to move reefing lines to different positions is not desirable, in my opinion. Scooting forward to the mast to hook the luff and pull down the leech side with the reefing line is bad enough -- and I can do this sitting down with an arm wrapped around the mast. Having to detach and reattach a reef line to a point that is probably pretty high up the sail that is flailing about is going to be very challenging on a small boat bouncing around in the waves. Having said all this, I find the Hunter supplied reefing system a pretty good compromise between simplicity and functionality. I'll keep it rigged the same. I do however plan to add another reef point about midway between the foot and the existing reef point. There are many times when I don't want the full sail up, but the one supplied reef point reduces sail too much. To solve the dilemma of how to run the control for the second reef point I plan on the following: Remove the topping lift and use a rigid vang for boom support. Use the through boom topping lift line for the outhaul Use the current through boom outhaul for the second reef line. Anyone have suggestions or see any problems with this scheme? Fair winds... Tom
Hi Doug, The luff side reef point on my 260 has a loop sewn to the sail instead of the typical grommet. It would be easy to attach a small block to the loop. Tony offers a good suggestion for attaching to the typical cringle setup: tie with a line through the cringle to a ring on the other side. Chafe protection could be added in a couple of ways. Make an inverted pocket from sail cloth or sunbrella; or hold off using tape backed foam insulation stuck to the side of the block. Two reefing points are possible, one on each side. The third becomes a challenge. No matter what reefing scheme, you are going to have a lot of line hanging around with three reefs. Having to move reefing lines to different positions is not desirable, in my opinion. Scooting forward to the mast to hook the luff and pull down the leech side with the reefing line is bad enough -- and I can do this sitting down with an arm wrapped around the mast. Having to detach and reattach a reef line to a point that is probably pretty high up the sail that is flailing about is going to be very challenging on a small boat bouncing around in the waves. Having said all this, I find the Hunter supplied reefing system a pretty good compromise between simplicity and functionality. I'll keep it rigged the same. I do however plan to add another reef point about midway between the foot and the existing reef point. There are many times when I don't want the full sail up, but the one supplied reef point reduces sail too much. To solve the dilemma of how to run the control for the second reef point I plan on the following: Remove the topping lift and use a rigid vang for boom support. Use the through boom topping lift line for the outhaul Use the current through boom outhaul for the second reef line. Anyone have suggestions or see any problems with this scheme? Fair winds... Tom
Handling a third reef
This has been an interesting thread. I was particularly impressed by Susan Hopkin's insightful post. Susan, if this is your first season with the H26 you have learned a lot indeed! I have just one small comment: on a lighter vessel like the H26 it is probably OK to spill some wind by tightening the topping lift. On larger vessels the topping lift is usually not designed to take the full load of the boom with a lot of wind pressure on the main. A similar effect can be achieved, however, by just tightening the foot and the luff (to flatten the sail and pull the draft forward) releasing the boomvang and the main sheet (the mainsheet can be released without letting the boom move outwards by pulling the traveler across the midline; thereby "putting more spring in the mainsheet"). Now, when a gust hits the boom will automatically rise up and open the leech, allowing the upper part of the main to spill the wind. I also agree with Peter Sua's comments that weather helm can be caused by a genoa alone through excessive heeling. In fact, on our Hunter 43 the genoa is usually the first to go in high winds in order to be replaced by our staysail (flown on an inner stay counterbalanced by running backstays) which creates very little heeling moment (by virtue of it's nice blade shape) and will do a good job balancing a single or double reefed mainsail. Above 30 knots (unless it is just a few gusts) we usually start preparing the 3rd reef. Because several posters commented on the difficulty of putting the third reef in during heavy weather as well as the impracticality of keeping such a deep reef always pre-rigged (because of the long, flopping reef lines) let me describe the essence of our own approach which, though far from perfect, has served us well on our travels (travails?) with Rivendel II. The biggest trick is not to leave port without making a few essential preparations when the forecast is such that the use of a third reef before the next sun-up is a distinct possibility. On Rivendel we often pre-rig the 2nd and 3rd reef if we expect heavy weather, while skipping the first reef altogether (and switching the lines of the first reef to the third reef). The reason is simple (but may not apply to some or most other boats): our mains'l is getting a little baggy! Nonetheless, without a reef in we can stretch both the foot (using the outhaul) and the luff (using the main halyard) far enough to flatten the sail sufficiently to perform well up to 20 knots, or so, and even handle occasional gusts up to 25 by pinching (heading up beyond the optimum forward drive point). Going to a first reef in building winds makes often little sense for us as the foot can no longer be stretched as efficiently and the smaller but more baggy sail shape causes nearly as much heeling as the unreefed but carefully flattened main. Both the second and third reefs, however, create beautifully flat sail shapes, while the second reef balances very well with the staysail, often allowing the helmsman to simply let go of the wheel to carry ou a brief task, even without the windvane being engaged... Whenever we do not pre-rig the third reef with reef lines we loop thin but strong messenger lines through the 2nd and 3rd reef cringles or rings (one messenger line on the leech and one on the luff). When we unexpectedly need the third reef (while the 2nd is already in) we duct tape the ends of the first reef lines to the messenger lines and pull the reef lines through. The leech line then simply ties off below the boom whereas I put a loose buntline hitch in the luff line and "send it up" (it will slide up over its own standing end when gently pulled and make a secure knot around the 3rd reef luff ring). Now we are ready to pull in the 3rd reef. Have fun! Flying Dutchman
This has been an interesting thread. I was particularly impressed by Susan Hopkin's insightful post. Susan, if this is your first season with the H26 you have learned a lot indeed! I have just one small comment: on a lighter vessel like the H26 it is probably OK to spill some wind by tightening the topping lift. On larger vessels the topping lift is usually not designed to take the full load of the boom with a lot of wind pressure on the main. A similar effect can be achieved, however, by just tightening the foot and the luff (to flatten the sail and pull the draft forward) releasing the boomvang and the main sheet (the mainsheet can be released without letting the boom move outwards by pulling the traveler across the midline; thereby "putting more spring in the mainsheet"). Now, when a gust hits the boom will automatically rise up and open the leech, allowing the upper part of the main to spill the wind. I also agree with Peter Sua's comments that weather helm can be caused by a genoa alone through excessive heeling. In fact, on our Hunter 43 the genoa is usually the first to go in high winds in order to be replaced by our staysail (flown on an inner stay counterbalanced by running backstays) which creates very little heeling moment (by virtue of it's nice blade shape) and will do a good job balancing a single or double reefed mainsail. Above 30 knots (unless it is just a few gusts) we usually start preparing the 3rd reef. Because several posters commented on the difficulty of putting the third reef in during heavy weather as well as the impracticality of keeping such a deep reef always pre-rigged (because of the long, flopping reef lines) let me describe the essence of our own approach which, though far from perfect, has served us well on our travels (travails?) with Rivendel II. The biggest trick is not to leave port without making a few essential preparations when the forecast is such that the use of a third reef before the next sun-up is a distinct possibility. On Rivendel we often pre-rig the 2nd and 3rd reef if we expect heavy weather, while skipping the first reef altogether (and switching the lines of the first reef to the third reef). The reason is simple (but may not apply to some or most other boats): our mains'l is getting a little baggy! Nonetheless, without a reef in we can stretch both the foot (using the outhaul) and the luff (using the main halyard) far enough to flatten the sail sufficiently to perform well up to 20 knots, or so, and even handle occasional gusts up to 25 by pinching (heading up beyond the optimum forward drive point). Going to a first reef in building winds makes often little sense for us as the foot can no longer be stretched as efficiently and the smaller but more baggy sail shape causes nearly as much heeling as the unreefed but carefully flattened main. Both the second and third reefs, however, create beautifully flat sail shapes, while the second reef balances very well with the staysail, often allowing the helmsman to simply let go of the wheel to carry ou a brief task, even without the windvane being engaged... Whenever we do not pre-rig the third reef with reef lines we loop thin but strong messenger lines through the 2nd and 3rd reef cringles or rings (one messenger line on the leech and one on the luff). When we unexpectedly need the third reef (while the 2nd is already in) we duct tape the ends of the first reef lines to the messenger lines and pull the reef lines through. The leech line then simply ties off below the boom whereas I put a loose buntline hitch in the luff line and "send it up" (it will slide up over its own standing end when gently pulled and make a secure knot around the 3rd reef luff ring). Now we are ready to pull in the 3rd reef. Have fun! Flying Dutchman
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