If it were your choice

Bill Jones · Apr 26, 2011

I would put no more than a 6hp outboard on a 23.5, more is just overkill. A bimini is a great idea (I suggest Ameriseam; premade for 23.5's). I would go with a tiller tamer rather than an autopilot. Too much energy required for an autopilot.

I love my 23.5, but realize it is not a 35 foot boat. Upgrades on larger boats are expected and increase the value. IMHO, on smaller boats the value is not impacted at all, perhaps even diminished.

kloudie1 · Apr 26, 2011

Long motoring is REALLY a lot more comfortable with an autopilot.. If the engine has a charging coil, there won't be a problem.. In my part of the world, a bimini is a mandatory piece of gear for trips unless ya want to get fried.. Sounds like the engine thing is covered, again providing ya have a charging coil.. (or carry a little gasoline generator for batt recharge http://www.harborfreight.com/800-rated-watts-900-max-watts-portable-generator-66619.html on sale now for about $90.) The 9.9 (or go to a 7.5 or 6) four stroke would burn about half as much gasoline as your two stroke.. so if ya want to carry less gasoline on board, going that way is a good thing.. I have noticed that the total weight of engine/gas stays about the same since the 4 stroke engine will be a lot heavier, but you get to carry a lot less gasoline.. No answers here, just notes for you to consider. Have fun !

FourPoints · Apr 26, 2011

bad_com_pany said:
Am waging the sides on boat upgrades here 1993 23.5h
what would you do ?

a. new 9.9 fourstroke outboard / presently 9.9 twostroke
or
b.stern rail seats with new bimini / presently no bimini
or
c. tiller auto pilot,new bimini, / again no bimini

planning week long trip this summer and due to river system will be
under motor power min of 8hrs per day.

You REALLY dont need a 9.9 hp on a 23.5'... I have a 8 hp on my 27' and it does fine in everything but big waves (but i am looking to upgrade to a 9.9)... What make / model is your 9.9?

I would say trade for a smaller lighter engine and get the bimini.

soling42 · Apr 26, 2011

I'm with FP and K1, With the money saved by not going with the altogether too heavy 9hp, buy the 4stroke 6hp w/alternator AND a good bimini AND shop for a used tiller pilot. You'll be glad you did. 8hrs at the helm is insane w/o an AP of some sort. My AP was one of the best things I've added, gets a serious amount of use and I get where I'm going in a good frame of mind. Don't fool yourself a Bimini isn't an option on long days at the helm, it's a necessity.

If it's broiling and dead calm while I'm in transit I'll also rig up a shade tarp to keep the interior cool. It'll give the crew more stamina and help with evening heat trapped inside the boat too.

Happy shopping and have a safe trip. Mike

Juice6576 · Apr 26, 2011

Our first boat was a 93 23.5 followed by a 96 H26. Upgrades I made to my 26 would be the same for a 23.5:
Yamaha 8 HP High thrust outboard...significantly improved close quarters boat handling on my 26. We installed a CDI roller furler and Harken lazy jacks. FInally a Raymarine ST1000 Tiller Pilot. It was the key to single handing and improved boat handling. I also installed a GARMIN GPS Fishfinder with the transducer glued to the bottom of the hull with RTV. Those changes made the 26 feel more like a big boat, but the sail handling upgrades did make it tougher to rig and de-rig the boat when trailering.

Benny17441 · Apr 26, 2011

Less HP to push against river currents may limit scheduling trips to the timing of favorable flow. You do not mention the reason why you are considering getting a new 4 stroke engine. Is it because....? a) Lack of reliability, b) High fuel + oil consumption, c) problems with new ethanol gas mix d) noise reduction e) environmental concers or f) just got tired of mixing oil and want to sport something flashier on the transom. Other than for (a) or (c) I would not consider a premature repowering. The Bimini is a must for any extended sailing and the autopilot would be a great convenience if you sail solo. Hands down my choice would be the nicest Bimini top I could find. I would not consider stern rail seats unless you were replacing the rail. Inboard mounted stern seats do not add any cockpit space and just make a person sit higher which may interfere with a low mounted Bimini top to allow clearance of the boom in a 23' boat..

charles baird · Apr 26, 2011

With the currents, tides and big boat traffic on the river I would go for the 4 stroke.Cushions should be fine for sitting purposes & since you were considering stern rail seats that means you will not be alone, so you will be relieved on the wheel when needed. All us Northeners enjoy the little sun we get, so a hat & sunblock should be all you need !!!

Rick Webb · Apr 26, 2011

Stern Rail Seats and a Bimmini Without a Doubt

A 6HP motor is more than adequate for a 23.5. An 8HP would be fine and anything more would be a waste. I could see going with an 8 to get the two vs single cylinder. More horsepower will not help with currents and only make a marginal difference with wind or waves not worth the extra weight or cost.

BrianW · Apr 27, 2011

Just a thought... if you get a bimini and want to get stern rail seats later, keep in mind the bimini frame mounting system needs to be compatible with stern rail seats. My H26's (without stern rail seats) bimini frame currently is mounted on the top of the cockpit coamings, and might interfere with the future stern rail seat location. BrianW

kloudie1 · Apr 27, 2011

Tillerpilot will keep nose pointed to the same magnetic heading.. You have to look at course over ground (COG) on GPS and adjust the heading for currents and leeway.. Or ya can correct using visual references.

Rick Webb · Apr 27, 2011

You Boat Your Choice

Look at the weight difference in going to the four stroke 9.9.

The stern rail seats make the cockpit seem much larger and arer really the best seat in the house. It may be different up there but the bimmini makes a HUGE difference when the sun is at it's most intense.

soling42 · Apr 27, 2011

Unlike a powerboat, more HP doesn't equate to better performance(only added weight). My old 240 had a Honda 4stroke 8hp that was a tank and made the boat list to stbd dramatically. Hull speed is all any motor will be limited to in your displacement hull and a nice 6-7hp w/elec start and an alt should be a nice balance between too much dead weight and enough power imho.

Everybody loves a bro-in-law who is a boat parts dealer

Balance is the key.
Mike

FourPoints · Apr 27, 2011

soling42 said:
Unlike a powerboat, more HP doesn't equate to better performance(only added weight). My old 240 had a Honda 4stroke 8hp that was a tank and made the boat list to stbd dramatically. Hull speed is all any motor will be limited to in your displacement hull and a nice 6-7hp w/elec start and an alt should be a nice balance between too much dead weight and enough power imho.

Everybody loves a bro-in-law who is a boat parts dealer Balance is the key.
Mike

Same goes for 4 stroke vs 2 stroke. You get more low end torque from a 4 stroke, but at cruising rpms its really no different. And the 4 stroke weighs 50% more...

Are you sure your current 9.9 doesn't have a charging circuit? My 1990 tohatsu 8hp doesn't have an alternator, but still bleeds a few amps of extra power from the stator back into the batteries for charging. It outputs enough to run all my old incandescent nav lights (now led), the chart plotter, and steaming light when the batteries were flat dead. Wont fast charge anything, but if you motor a lot (I dont) it will keep the batteries charged.

Benny17441 · Apr 27, 2011

The issue about horsepower is an old one. There are no set rules. The difference between two engines, one of lower and another of higher horsepower will mostly be noticed at speeds under hull speed. For those who sail in open waters with mostly fair weather the lower horsepower engine may be all its needed but for those that may frequently have to fight strong currents and wind under restricted navigation parameters the larger horsepower engine may be a necessity.

Juice6576 · Apr 27, 2011

Plug for the Yamaha 8 HP

We went with the Yamaha 8 HP 4-stroke high thrust because it was lighter than the Honda, and only about 20 lbs more than the Tohatsu. We never noticed the weight difference.

On the high torque 8, the prop was larger with a more aggressive pitch, so it bit in and got the boat moving easily. I used to fight getting the boat out of her slip on a windy day, but with the Yamaha, it became a non-issue. On the other hand, the boat reached top speed at lower RPM, and the upper RPM range didn't need to be used as much. Fuel mileage was improved and noise reduced. Can't go wrong.
The Tohatsu control handle was a direct swap, although I found out that the neutral start interlock was never wired up when the boat was delivered. The other plus with the Yamaha was the elctric tilt, no more fumbling for the prop latch.

Our tillerpilot was wired into the Garmin GPSMAP fishfinder, so I could set it to maintain course to the waypoint. It was really nice on long trips to be able to leave the tiller to plot course on a chart or grab a sandwich and drink.

Adding stern rail seats can be tricky. My 23.5 did not have them. In the 93 models, the coamings were not reinforced with the aluminum mounting plates if you didn't specify the stern rail seat option when you ordered the boat, so retrofitting can be tricky. Crazy Dave Condon (my dealer) recommended against it.

sesmith · Apr 27, 2011

FWIW, I wouldn't replace the motor unless I really felt it was needed (it's a sailboat, remember

. I saw you mentioned a lot of motoring this summer, but if your existing motor works fine... Autopilot on a 23.5, I can't really see the need for. We use a Davis tiller tamer, and it was a great add-on, cheap, and does all we need for the boat. We also added a Spinlock tiller extender, and use it all the time. As far as charging, I never connected the charging circuit on my 4 stroke 8 hp Honda into the battery. I use a solar panel to keep the battery up, and replaced the interior light bulbs (and soon will also replace the mast light bulbs) with led replacement bulbs. They use much less power to run. In Fl. a bimini top is a necessity, in NY, not so much. Can you get one that gives you enough room for the boom and still be able to sail without issues?

So, if it were my boat, I'd upgrade the lighting to LED, get a solar charger, and get a tiller tamer and tiller extender. The bimini would be nice, especially if you were cruising the canals, so if you can find one that fits ok, maybe I'd go for that. Another idea we found that would be useful is just a simple cover over part of the cockpit when anchored so you can come out of the cabin in a rain. We're making one for our boat this year. Another useful thing we saw on other peoples boats is a tent like cover for the hatch so you can leave it open in the rain and dew and still let air into the cabin. Easy jacks are nice too. So that's what I'd do, and use the money I saved on the other stuff, for my trip.

C Jones · Apr 28, 2011

The bimini will keep your crew happy and cool. I checked our marina to day and we have a h240 with a 6hp, 3 h23.5s with one 4hp one 5hp and one 6hp. I have a 5hp on my h23.
With that being said we have no currents or tides to contend with.

If it were your choice

.

.

.

.

.

Attachments

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.

.