Hello to all Cherubini 33 owners 1979-1982 Looking to buy one as soon as I sell my Hunter 25 and have questions, please help. (1)- the stove/oven combo. What's the story on the kerosene fuel, is it ok or does it smell when you cook? I thought alcohol was the fuel for these stoves. (2)-What is the real horsepower on the Yanmar? I hear 13hp some say 15 some 16. (3)- Is the boom really adjustable in height,so you don't get wacked? Will the main go that high? (4)- How is sail adjustment on the toe rail versus installing an inner track? (5)- The Exhaust port for the engine on the 1981 model is close to the water line or even below. Is this ok? I thought it had to be 3" above to avoid backflow. (6)- Teak and holley floor.What makes it look great and gives it lasting protection without slipping? (7) Insulation Icebox. Is it ok or can you get to it to reinsulate? Also where does it drain? (8)- Any other problems I should be looking for during my hunt for one of these vessels.Please Reply ******************************************************* I would like to thank all the folks who made this site possible. It is the best way to solve problems and bring owners of the same type of boat closer together. Thanks Dave
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Ernie Tetrault
Here's my two cents
I own a 1979 H33. When I bought the boat it came with a pressurized alcohol stove. I changed that to a propane, two burner stove top with broiler unit rather than a full oven. I've got no complaints! The 79 is outfitted with a 2QM15 Yanmar which is rated at 15 hp. I'm not sure I understand what you're saying about the boom. Like many boats, the boom is raise-able when not sailing, but I don't know of any boat that allows for the boom to be raised while under sail. (could be wrong) I've had no problems with the sail being sheeted from the rail, although I can see where an inner track might be nice. My exhaust port is just barely above the waterline, and I've had no problems. As for the cabion sole, I just varnished it and I'm not completely satisfied with my results. It's not bad, just not as great as I had envisioned it. You definately want to protect it with something! The ice box is about as good (or bad) as most other ice boxes I've dealt with. Generally, three blocks last us two to three days. The ice box drains into the bilge. Can't really think of anything specific to the 33 to watch out for. The surveyor found moisture under my mast step, and in the rudder. I fixed the rudder and hope to get at the mast step in the fall. Overall, it's a great boat and I'm sure you'll love it!!
I own a 1979 H33. When I bought the boat it came with a pressurized alcohol stove. I changed that to a propane, two burner stove top with broiler unit rather than a full oven. I've got no complaints! The 79 is outfitted with a 2QM15 Yanmar which is rated at 15 hp. I'm not sure I understand what you're saying about the boom. Like many boats, the boom is raise-able when not sailing, but I don't know of any boat that allows for the boom to be raised while under sail. (could be wrong) I've had no problems with the sail being sheeted from the rail, although I can see where an inner track might be nice. My exhaust port is just barely above the waterline, and I've had no problems. As for the cabion sole, I just varnished it and I'm not completely satisfied with my results. It's not bad, just not as great as I had envisioned it. You definately want to protect it with something! The ice box is about as good (or bad) as most other ice boxes I've dealt with. Generally, three blocks last us two to three days. The ice box drains into the bilge. Can't really think of anything specific to the 33 to watch out for. The surveyor found moisture under my mast step, and in the rudder. I fixed the rudder and hope to get at the mast step in the fall. Overall, it's a great boat and I'm sure you'll love it!!
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Ken Palmer
My 1981 H33
I bought my 1981 H33 about 4 years ago. It has been a solid boat needing little repair for being 20 years old. Here are my answers to your 8 questions. (1) I have the original pressurized alcohol stove with oven. I have rebuilt the burners, and use the stove with caution. While pre-heating the burner, I keep a pot of water on the burner. This prevents and tall flames from getting too high. I will keep what I have because I cruise once a year, and cannot justify installing a propane stove with proper ventilation. (2) My Yanmar label is a 2GM. I was told that this is a 15 HP engine without the heat exchanger. It works well, but is underpowered for this size boat. Some folks have gone to a 3-blade prop which will help. Here on Lake Ontario I do fine with the 2-blade prop. No tides or heavy currents to negotiate. (3) Yes, the boom can be raised on the mast. This gives you extra headroom when docked. I cannot leave it up because my main sail is cut so that it is at the top of the mast when the boom is a couple inches from the bottom of its track on the mast. (4) If you are only day-sailing or cruising, you don't need an inner track for jib sheets. I race Liberty, and wanted to point better, so installed tracks and got the performance I needed to start placing in our races. If you do install tracks, get back to me and I will give you the details. (5) No problem with the exhaust port. It is above water, and I have never had a problem with backflow. (6) My floor is as delivered (I think). We clean it with Murphy's Oil Soap. Every other year or so I put some lemon oil down on the sole and also the rest of the interior woodwork. (6) This insulation on the ice-box is OK, but could be improved if you want to really dig into a mess. My drain (drains into the bilge), has a bad leak in the hose. Every year I try to tear apart the boat to fix the hose, and end up going sailing instead. I think they built the boat around the ice-box drain. It runs under the fiberglass (plastic) flooring under the galley sink area. I lifted the wooden flooring there and cut a large inspection hole, only to find that the hose crosses under the ice-box bottom and up through a hole in the fiberglass to the bottom of the ice-box. There was a post earlier in the year where somebody was able to remove the wooden wall between the ice-box and under the sink, exposing insulation an the bottom the the box. Maybe that will be a future project for me. For now, I just plug the drain hole and pump out the water from any melted ice. (8) I had water in my rudder this spring. I removed the rudder and attempted a repair with minor success. I think I may have to pull it again this fall and do a proper job on it. Make sure you dig a hole under the rudder if you ever have to drop it. The stuffing box is a pain in the butt! It is difficult to get to and work on. If you have a chance, have it replaced with a dripless box made by PCI (I think). Check the link below to visit my website. You will find several photos of Liberty and other stuff. Good luck. Ken Palmer, S/V Liberty
I bought my 1981 H33 about 4 years ago. It has been a solid boat needing little repair for being 20 years old. Here are my answers to your 8 questions. (1) I have the original pressurized alcohol stove with oven. I have rebuilt the burners, and use the stove with caution. While pre-heating the burner, I keep a pot of water on the burner. This prevents and tall flames from getting too high. I will keep what I have because I cruise once a year, and cannot justify installing a propane stove with proper ventilation. (2) My Yanmar label is a 2GM. I was told that this is a 15 HP engine without the heat exchanger. It works well, but is underpowered for this size boat. Some folks have gone to a 3-blade prop which will help. Here on Lake Ontario I do fine with the 2-blade prop. No tides or heavy currents to negotiate. (3) Yes, the boom can be raised on the mast. This gives you extra headroom when docked. I cannot leave it up because my main sail is cut so that it is at the top of the mast when the boom is a couple inches from the bottom of its track on the mast. (4) If you are only day-sailing or cruising, you don't need an inner track for jib sheets. I race Liberty, and wanted to point better, so installed tracks and got the performance I needed to start placing in our races. If you do install tracks, get back to me and I will give you the details. (5) No problem with the exhaust port. It is above water, and I have never had a problem with backflow. (6) My floor is as delivered (I think). We clean it with Murphy's Oil Soap. Every other year or so I put some lemon oil down on the sole and also the rest of the interior woodwork. (6) This insulation on the ice-box is OK, but could be improved if you want to really dig into a mess. My drain (drains into the bilge), has a bad leak in the hose. Every year I try to tear apart the boat to fix the hose, and end up going sailing instead. I think they built the boat around the ice-box drain. It runs under the fiberglass (plastic) flooring under the galley sink area. I lifted the wooden flooring there and cut a large inspection hole, only to find that the hose crosses under the ice-box bottom and up through a hole in the fiberglass to the bottom of the ice-box. There was a post earlier in the year where somebody was able to remove the wooden wall between the ice-box and under the sink, exposing insulation an the bottom the the box. Maybe that will be a future project for me. For now, I just plug the drain hole and pump out the water from any melted ice. (8) I had water in my rudder this spring. I removed the rudder and attempted a repair with minor success. I think I may have to pull it again this fall and do a proper job on it. Make sure you dig a hole under the rudder if you ever have to drop it. The stuffing box is a pain in the butt! It is difficult to get to and work on. If you have a chance, have it replaced with a dripless box made by PCI (I think). Check the link below to visit my website. You will find several photos of Liberty and other stuff. Good luck. Ken Palmer, S/V Liberty
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Ed Schenck
A couple of observations.
I think the Cherubini's tracked each other in terms of outfitting from year to year, your H33 and my H37C. For example I am pretty certain that all 1979's used kerosene stoves. And there was a thread recently where a kerosene stove owner was very satisfied with that stove. I have not used mine so cannot comment. Look in the archives and the Cherubini forum for info also. There's a thread there right now regarding the H37C icebox drain. Pretty sure that the H33 was done the same way. Some of us prefer dripless packing to the other options. Haven't touched my stuffing box in two seasons. The most often discussed topics on the early H37C's is state of the holding tank(most leaked) and the location of the traveler. The traveler was later moved to the cabin top but I don't think they ever did that with the H33(link below). Several owners have moved the traveler so that they could have a full dodger/bimini enclosure.
I think the Cherubini's tracked each other in terms of outfitting from year to year, your H33 and my H37C. For example I am pretty certain that all 1979's used kerosene stoves. And there was a thread recently where a kerosene stove owner was very satisfied with that stove. I have not used mine so cannot comment. Look in the archives and the Cherubini forum for info also. There's a thread there right now regarding the H37C icebox drain. Pretty sure that the H33 was done the same way. Some of us prefer dripless packing to the other options. Haven't touched my stuffing box in two seasons. The most often discussed topics on the early H37C's is state of the holding tank(most leaked) and the location of the traveler. The traveler was later moved to the cabin top but I don't think they ever did that with the H33(link below). Several owners have moved the traveler so that they could have a full dodger/bimini enclosure.
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Terry Arnold
Selected H33 answers
Some thoughts on several of your questions: Q.(2)-What is the real horsepower on the Yanmar? I hear 13hp some say 15 some 16 I believe that the earlier H33s all had 2qm and later had 2gm. I believe this is so for the 2qm but at least, Bay Horse, a 79 H33 which has been repowered with a 2gm which has a max one hour hp rating of 15 and a continuous rating of 13. As a practical matter, what Yanmar essentially says is that you can run it all day long at load at about 3400 rpm and at max rpm of 3600 for short periods. Bay Horse cruises very well at about 2900 rpm. Q.(3)- Is the boom really adjustable in height,so you don't get wacked? Will the main go that high? At least on Bay Horse, there is certainly a slide for the gooseneck with a downhaul attached, allowing some boom height adjustment. Your physical limit raising the boom is of course when the headboard (or battens with a full batten big roach main) begin to impinge on the backstay or topping lift. At any rate, the boom is high enough for a prudent sailor, but at its highest, too low to guarantee that it will never crack the unwary. Q.(5)- The Exhaust port for the engine on the 1981 model is close to the water line or even below. Is this ok? I thought it had to be 3" above to avoid backflow I believe the 81 is just like mine, which is near the transom on starboard side. I think that this is a good location, probably less exhaust on the helmsman than an exhaust through the transom, and the transom certainly stays cleaner. At any rate, even at hull speed when the exhaust is at the surface or slightly submerged, it is still in a low pressure area of the flow around the hull. Also, Bayhorse has a siphon break where the exhaust rises up to just under the afterdeck before plunging to the exhaust throughhull. Q.(6)- Teak and holley floor.What makes it look great and gives it lasting protection without slipping? One of the best features of the H33 is that it has handholds and close quarters of a seaboat. Thus, in a seaway, a sailor canl always have his hands on a handhold down below, not depending on any particular traction with the sole. I keep high gloss spar varnish on mine. Q.7) Insulation Icebox. Is it ok or can you get to it to reinsulate? Also where does it drain? Insulation not anything to write home about. You can get to it to reinsulate, not a fun job. I have done this and improved it certainly though I can't vouch just how much. The drain goes out the bottom, into a ribbed white hose about two feet long and discharges in the space between the pan liner and the hull. From there, it enters the bilge. I have a few photos of the icebox uncovered and the insulating that I did in refitting Bayhorse and will post them to the photo forum. Q.8)- Any other problems I should be looking for during my hunt for one of these vessels.Please Reply I'm biased of course but the longer I own Bayhorse, the more certain I am that it is an unusally well designed boat, constructed probably above average for a production boat. There's a lot of information in the archives for the H33. You can learn a lot about the boat by searching the archives with poster names of Tim Schaaf and Sam Lust. Good luck. If you find a boat that surveys well, get it.
Some thoughts on several of your questions: Q.(2)-What is the real horsepower on the Yanmar? I hear 13hp some say 15 some 16 I believe that the earlier H33s all had 2qm and later had 2gm. I believe this is so for the 2qm but at least, Bay Horse, a 79 H33 which has been repowered with a 2gm which has a max one hour hp rating of 15 and a continuous rating of 13. As a practical matter, what Yanmar essentially says is that you can run it all day long at load at about 3400 rpm and at max rpm of 3600 for short periods. Bay Horse cruises very well at about 2900 rpm. Q.(3)- Is the boom really adjustable in height,so you don't get wacked? Will the main go that high? At least on Bay Horse, there is certainly a slide for the gooseneck with a downhaul attached, allowing some boom height adjustment. Your physical limit raising the boom is of course when the headboard (or battens with a full batten big roach main) begin to impinge on the backstay or topping lift. At any rate, the boom is high enough for a prudent sailor, but at its highest, too low to guarantee that it will never crack the unwary. Q.(5)- The Exhaust port for the engine on the 1981 model is close to the water line or even below. Is this ok? I thought it had to be 3" above to avoid backflow I believe the 81 is just like mine, which is near the transom on starboard side. I think that this is a good location, probably less exhaust on the helmsman than an exhaust through the transom, and the transom certainly stays cleaner. At any rate, even at hull speed when the exhaust is at the surface or slightly submerged, it is still in a low pressure area of the flow around the hull. Also, Bayhorse has a siphon break where the exhaust rises up to just under the afterdeck before plunging to the exhaust throughhull. Q.(6)- Teak and holley floor.What makes it look great and gives it lasting protection without slipping? One of the best features of the H33 is that it has handholds and close quarters of a seaboat. Thus, in a seaway, a sailor canl always have his hands on a handhold down below, not depending on any particular traction with the sole. I keep high gloss spar varnish on mine. Q.7) Insulation Icebox. Is it ok or can you get to it to reinsulate? Also where does it drain? Insulation not anything to write home about. You can get to it to reinsulate, not a fun job. I have done this and improved it certainly though I can't vouch just how much. The drain goes out the bottom, into a ribbed white hose about two feet long and discharges in the space between the pan liner and the hull. From there, it enters the bilge. I have a few photos of the icebox uncovered and the insulating that I did in refitting Bayhorse and will post them to the photo forum. Q.8)- Any other problems I should be looking for during my hunt for one of these vessels.Please Reply I'm biased of course but the longer I own Bayhorse, the more certain I am that it is an unusally well designed boat, constructed probably above average for a production boat. There's a lot of information in the archives for the H33. You can learn a lot about the boat by searching the archives with poster names of Tim Schaaf and Sam Lust. Good luck. If you find a boat that surveys well, get it.
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Terry Arnold
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Terry Arnold
Icebox insulation link, take two
Phil, I gave a bad link in a response just now, but I couldn't figure out how to change the link so here is another try,.
Phil, I gave a bad link in a response just now, but I couldn't figure out how to change the link so here is another try,.
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Ken Palmer
Terry, what handholds?
In you last post you mentioned handholds on the cabin. The only thing in my 1981 H33 that I would call handholds are stips of teak(?), horizontally mounted up midway on port and starboard sides. When I think of "handholds", I vision the type used on the cabin top, but mounted hanging from the ceiling in the cabin. If that is what you have, were they added by you or another owner? Ken Palmer, S/V Liberty
In you last post you mentioned handholds on the cabin. The only thing in my 1981 H33 that I would call handholds are stips of teak(?), horizontally mounted up midway on port and starboard sides. When I think of "handholds", I vision the type used on the cabin top, but mounted hanging from the ceiling in the cabin. If that is what you have, were they added by you or another owner? Ken Palmer, S/V Liberty
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Terry Arnold
79 H33 handholds
Ken, As I remember, these are the handholds on my H33. 1. A good stout one at top of ladder on port side. 2. Two very good ones cut into inboard side of hanging cabinet over galley sink. 3. four well positioned handholds cut into pilot berth bulwark on starboard side of cabin. 4. Running handhold strips of teak just below portlights port and starboard side of cabin. these strips are set out from cabin wall to give space for gripping though marginal for thick fingers. (I suppose these are the teak strips you mention) 5. The mast support column is located very well for grabbing, especially with the table out of the way. All in all, I can move around below always holding on to something secure if necessary. Since I'm 63, its usually necessary, or at least prudent. By the way, I wonder if the leeboard on the port settee with piano hinge and thumbolt locks are unique to the H33? Do any of the other Cherubini designs have a factory installed leeboard? Do other Hunters have them?
Ken, As I remember, these are the handholds on my H33. 1. A good stout one at top of ladder on port side. 2. Two very good ones cut into inboard side of hanging cabinet over galley sink. 3. four well positioned handholds cut into pilot berth bulwark on starboard side of cabin. 4. Running handhold strips of teak just below portlights port and starboard side of cabin. these strips are set out from cabin wall to give space for gripping though marginal for thick fingers. (I suppose these are the teak strips you mention) 5. The mast support column is located very well for grabbing, especially with the table out of the way. All in all, I can move around below always holding on to something secure if necessary. Since I'm 63, its usually necessary, or at least prudent. By the way, I wonder if the leeboard on the port settee with piano hinge and thumbolt locks are unique to the H33? Do any of the other Cherubini designs have a factory installed leeboard? Do other Hunters have them?
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Tim Schaaf
handholds
My boat came only with the ones described by Terry, plus one on the port side of the companionway. I have added a bunch of other rails, but mostly for towels and such. I agree with Terry that the boat is very easy to get around. My addition to the comments already made are that the 1980 seemed to have a little better insulation on the ice-box, and that there are modifications that can make quite a wet boat very dry. Without these, it can be boots or bare feet and a wet butt, when in heavy going. If you get this boat, let me know and I will describe what I did.
My boat came only with the ones described by Terry, plus one on the port side of the companionway. I have added a bunch of other rails, but mostly for towels and such. I agree with Terry that the boat is very easy to get around. My addition to the comments already made are that the 1980 seemed to have a little better insulation on the ice-box, and that there are modifications that can make quite a wet boat very dry. Without these, it can be boots or bare feet and a wet butt, when in heavy going. If you get this boat, let me know and I will describe what I did.
Response to Dave's questions.
Just two suggestions and an observation: 1. Genoa track-- forgive me for being ignorant of the fact, but do you mean to tell me they did NOT install genny track on the side deck AT ALL?? This is like not having a traveller (in fact it's EXACTLY like it). If quality sailing is important to you, by all means consider installing one. Keeping the genny clew inboard will mean tighter pointing angles. 2. Boom height. By ALL means sail with the boom as low as possible to the deck. That's what the sliding gooseneck is for. Under the boom at the mast ought to be the outhaul tackle. Bring up the halyard to moderate tension and then cinch the gooseneck down tight against the halyard. Many racing rules including the ridiculous IOR had regulations limiting how low you could fly the boom of the main-- having the foot of the sail down low reduces heel angle and ugly boat motion and improves the draught of air across the deck. (If you're interested in flying a Bimini top or awning all the time, consider a motorboat, which will probably sail better that way!) Observation-- it's nice to hear how many people are essentially satisfied with the 33. This and the 37 are definitely the best of the bunch and stand up even today as very good (and financially sane) choices for boats in this size range. The comments about good design definitely outweigh the quirks (like getting to the stuffing box, etc.) which are only tangential to the overall plan of the design anyway. I have not once seen anyone on this Web presence say that they had anything against the boat itself or that they regretted buying one-- and this ought to be a clue for anyone considering the purchase of one!!! JC 2 Cherubini Art
Just two suggestions and an observation: 1. Genoa track-- forgive me for being ignorant of the fact, but do you mean to tell me they did NOT install genny track on the side deck AT ALL?? This is like not having a traveller (in fact it's EXACTLY like it). If quality sailing is important to you, by all means consider installing one. Keeping the genny clew inboard will mean tighter pointing angles. 2. Boom height. By ALL means sail with the boom as low as possible to the deck. That's what the sliding gooseneck is for. Under the boom at the mast ought to be the outhaul tackle. Bring up the halyard to moderate tension and then cinch the gooseneck down tight against the halyard. Many racing rules including the ridiculous IOR had regulations limiting how low you could fly the boom of the main-- having the foot of the sail down low reduces heel angle and ugly boat motion and improves the draught of air across the deck. (If you're interested in flying a Bimini top or awning all the time, consider a motorboat, which will probably sail better that way!) Observation-- it's nice to hear how many people are essentially satisfied with the 33. This and the 37 are definitely the best of the bunch and stand up even today as very good (and financially sane) choices for boats in this size range. The comments about good design definitely outweigh the quirks (like getting to the stuffing box, etc.) which are only tangential to the overall plan of the design anyway. I have not once seen anyone on this Web presence say that they had anything against the boat itself or that they regretted buying one-- and this ought to be a clue for anyone considering the purchase of one!!! JC 2 Cherubini Art
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JC 2
oops... downhaul
In that last post I said 'outhaul' when I meant 'downhaul'. duhhh! --though they are both in the same area so it might have been confusing-- as to my state of mind, that is. JC 2
In that last post I said 'outhaul' when I meant 'downhaul'. duhhh! --though they are both in the same area so it might have been confusing-- as to my state of mind, that is. JC 2
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