Hull construction

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Feb 6, 1998
11,759
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
Rob

Rob, PM me and I'll tell you the builder. Any time you mention these sort of things in a public forum the you know what hits the fan! My intent is not to hijack this thread but rather keep it about pros and cons of core vs. solid rather than a builder bashing event which it would turn into...
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,759
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
CS-40

From what I know there were perhaps two or maybe three boats built from the Tony Castro designed CS 40 mold that were launched between 1999 thriugh 2001. These boats were not however built by the original CS Yachts and should be very carefully compared with the original CS 40's. CS Yachts closed the doors & stopped production in 1992. Not much is really known about these last few boats...? While most of the earlier boats were designed by Raymond Wall (of Camper Nicholson fame), such as the 36T, the later designs like the 36 Merlin and CS-40 were Tony Castro designed. The Castro's are distinctly different, generally faster and lighter in build and displacement but were still built like brick Sh!t houses...
 
Dec 2, 1999
15,184
Hunter Vision-36 Rio Vista, CA.
Thru hull in a cored deck?

I have had 3 Hunters and they all have had solid glassed hulls. Typically this is the entire "hull". I would agree that a "cored Hull" is not the best idea. The Hunters have cored decks (they were plywood) in the older models. I see no reason why someone would want to put a "Thru hull" fitting in the deck area. If it happens to be a fastener that is drilled thru the inner and outter skin it is usually best to over drill the hole and fill it with epoxy, then drill the epoxy filled hole with the proper sized drill. If the fitting does leak, this would prevent moisture from getting into the deck coring material. Hunter has typically put aluminum backing plates in areas where deck hardware will be fitted. This areas can be drilled and tapped and the hardware can be caulked and mounted in these areas without much worry for leaking. We had S.S handrails which replaced the teak rails on our '85 Hunter 31. The holes where all over-drilled and epoxy filled prior to mounting the s.s. rails. They have never had a problem in over 10 years.
 
Dec 2, 1999
15,184
Hunter Vision-36 Rio Vista, CA.
Thru hull in a cored deck?

I have had 3 Hunters and they all have had solid glassed hulls. Typically this is the entire "hull". I would agree that a "cored Hull" is not the best idea. The Hunters have cored decks (they were plywood) in the older models. I see no reason why someone would want to put a "Thru hull" fitting in the deck area. If it happens to be a fastener that is drilled thru the inner and outter skin it is usually best to over drill the hole and fill it with epoxy, then drill the epoxy filled hole with the proper sized drill. If the fitting does leak, this would prevent moisture from getting into the deck coring material. Hunter has typically put aluminum backing plates in areas where deck hardware will be fitted. This areas can be drilled and tapped and the hardware can be caulked and mounted in these areas without much worry for leaking. We had S.S handrails which replaced the teak rails on our '85 Hunter 31. The holes where all over-drilled and epoxy filled prior to mounting the s.s. rails. They have never had a problem in over 10 years.
 
Sep 19, 2006
643
SCHOCK santana27' lake pleasant,az
usualy the older boats are solid

and heavier. production cored boats are lighter but they dont hold up as long or as well to hard sailing. my santana 27 is solid (no core) it scales in at 5000# without a motor, its 40 yrs old and solid as a rock. it was built to race and i wouldnt trade it for a production cored hull due to life span, i plan on keeping mine for a long time
 
Sep 19, 2006
643
SCHOCK santana27' lake pleasant,az
usualy the older boats are solid

and heavier. production cored boats are lighter but they dont hold up as long or as well to hard sailing. my santana 27 is solid (no core) it scales in at 5000# without a motor, its 40 yrs old and solid as a rock. it was built to race and i wouldnt trade it for a production cored hull due to life span, i plan on keeping mine for a long time
 

John

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Jun 3, 2006
803
Catalina 36mkII Alameda CA
corecell

Apparantly this is 1" corecell in the hull. Anybody know anything about this material for a hull core?
 

John

.
Jun 3, 2006
803
Catalina 36mkII Alameda CA
corecell

Apparantly this is 1" corecell in the hull. Anybody know anything about this material for a hull core?
 
D

David

Cored Hulls

Hunter and Sabre are two sailboat manufacturers that produce cored hulls. Sea Ray, one of the largest powerboat manufacturers, builds cored hulls.
 
D

David

Cored Hulls

Hunter and Sabre are two sailboat manufacturers that produce cored hulls. Sea Ray, one of the largest powerboat manufacturers, builds cored hulls.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
Alameda John , Try this link.

http://www.atlcomposites.com/pdf/cores_core-cell.pdf
 

Ross

.
Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
Alameda John , Try this link.

http://www.atlcomposites.com/pdf/cores_core-cell.pdf
 

John

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Jun 3, 2006
803
Catalina 36mkII Alameda CA
my impression

So, my impression is that unless there is some other strong reason, for the "average" boat buyer it's best to stick to solid core hulls. Would people agree?
 

John

.
Jun 3, 2006
803
Catalina 36mkII Alameda CA
my impression

So, my impression is that unless there is some other strong reason, for the "average" boat buyer it's best to stick to solid core hulls. Would people agree?
 
Oct 2, 2006
1,517
Jboat J24 commack
Which builders

Which boat with a failed core is build buy a yard with an ABS OR Lloyds certification to work with cored materials I would bet not many as it cost a lot of money to work to the correct standards Tommays
 
Oct 2, 2006
1,517
Jboat J24 commack
Which builders

Which boat with a failed core is build buy a yard with an ABS OR Lloyds certification to work with cored materials I would bet not many as it cost a lot of money to work to the correct standards Tommays
 

RichH

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Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
John ---- all depends on the lay-up sequence and timing.

There can be major problems with cored hulls that arise in the lay-up techniques at the boat yard. Cored hulls are stronger and lighter weight BUT such hulls must be continually layed-up in ONE single step or there will eventually be problems. Polyester, etc. resin once its partly cured doesnt have the bond strength to the next successive lay-up as when one layer is quickly added on top of one another as in a 'continuous process'. Todays 'top drawer' boats are made in one step (the workers dont knock off at 5PM and come back early in the next morning and begin again where they left off yesterday). If the lay up is discontinuous then the bond strength between the laminate schedules will be weak; doesnt matter if the hull is solid or cored. Only the 'high end' boats will do a continuous process .... the 'others' havent seemed to have 'caught on' yet. So, a cored boat which takes more time to construct has more potential of individual lay-up layer delamination ... if it wasnt layed up in a single continuous process. Thermal stress is a big deal with cored hulls, especially if the hull is a dark color. The example is Niagara which most surveyors will attest that they usually find delaminations in a dark hulled Niagara - simply because the dark hulls get too hot from the sun. Impact is big too-doo with a cored hull, especially if the bond strength between the successive layers due to discontinuous lay-up is poor, especially if the core is now crushed from the impact. Any cored hull that shows evidence of impact .... to me, makes this a 'walk away from boat'. .... and all this is 'besides' the water absorption issues. A good cored hull is lighter, stronger and longer lasting than a solid hull; but, there are traps that one should be aware of.
 

RichH

.
Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
John ---- all depends on the lay-up sequence and timing.

There can be major problems with cored hulls that arise in the lay-up techniques at the boat yard. Cored hulls are stronger and lighter weight BUT such hulls must be continually layed-up in ONE single step or there will eventually be problems. Polyester, etc. resin once its partly cured doesnt have the bond strength to the next successive lay-up as when one layer is quickly added on top of one another as in a 'continuous process'. Todays 'top drawer' boats are made in one step (the workers dont knock off at 5PM and come back early in the next morning and begin again where they left off yesterday). If the lay up is discontinuous then the bond strength between the laminate schedules will be weak; doesnt matter if the hull is solid or cored. Only the 'high end' boats will do a continuous process .... the 'others' havent seemed to have 'caught on' yet. So, a cored boat which takes more time to construct has more potential of individual lay-up layer delamination ... if it wasnt layed up in a single continuous process. Thermal stress is a big deal with cored hulls, especially if the hull is a dark color. The example is Niagara which most surveyors will attest that they usually find delaminations in a dark hulled Niagara - simply because the dark hulls get too hot from the sun. Impact is big too-doo with a cored hull, especially if the bond strength between the successive layers due to discontinuous lay-up is poor, especially if the core is now crushed from the impact. Any cored hull that shows evidence of impact .... to me, makes this a 'walk away from boat'. .... and all this is 'besides' the water absorption issues. A good cored hull is lighter, stronger and longer lasting than a solid hull; but, there are traps that one should be aware of.
 
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