Hi, I’m in the process of purchasing a 1984 34fts Hunter. However every time I ask above a Hunter people in marinas and boat yard tell me to stay away for Hunter Why? Can this boat sail to the British Virgin Islands? How reliable are these boats in long passage/ off shore? Your input will be very much appreciated
- Status
Lots of discussion here
There is a pile of discussion regarding this in the archives. Read through all of that in addition to what folks will say here and you won't know what to think... We have an H34, so I read up on all the same stuff. It seems to be the general consesus that these are great coastal cruisers (some will disagree but whatever) and fine for the occasional runs in the ocean in fine weather (again coastal cruising). That being said, if you wait for weather windows and pick the right route, the Caribbean should be no problem as long as it is not a problem for you. I had a world cruiser (in a hand-built 45 foot Herreshoff design who was a boat builder in his previous life) looking over our H34 and he said "oh yeah, that is fine for going to the Caribbean - you will see a whole lot of boats less sturdy than that going down there." You will read accounts of folks going transaltanic in the H34 and sailing offshore in really high winds and huge seas, but they are probably also great sailors. The difference in the bluewater boats from the coastal cruisers is do you run back to shore when bad weather is on the way, or do you stick it out and just keep going. I will choose to run back to shore, so a coastal cruiser is great. If you put yourself in a situation where that is not an option like on a transatlantic passage or something, maybe the H34 is not right boat - get some full deep keeled heavy boat that is no fun to sail in light air on weekends. I haven't taken mine offshore, so take this advise for what it is worth. However, I think it seems like a good summary of the "Hunters are terrible offshore" debate. Check the archives as well - lots of good info and opinions in there.
There is a pile of discussion regarding this in the archives. Read through all of that in addition to what folks will say here and you won't know what to think... We have an H34, so I read up on all the same stuff. It seems to be the general consesus that these are great coastal cruisers (some will disagree but whatever) and fine for the occasional runs in the ocean in fine weather (again coastal cruising). That being said, if you wait for weather windows and pick the right route, the Caribbean should be no problem as long as it is not a problem for you. I had a world cruiser (in a hand-built 45 foot Herreshoff design who was a boat builder in his previous life) looking over our H34 and he said "oh yeah, that is fine for going to the Caribbean - you will see a whole lot of boats less sturdy than that going down there." You will read accounts of folks going transaltanic in the H34 and sailing offshore in really high winds and huge seas, but they are probably also great sailors. The difference in the bluewater boats from the coastal cruisers is do you run back to shore when bad weather is on the way, or do you stick it out and just keep going. I will choose to run back to shore, so a coastal cruiser is great. If you put yourself in a situation where that is not an option like on a transatlantic passage or something, maybe the H34 is not right boat - get some full deep keeled heavy boat that is no fun to sail in light air on weekends. I haven't taken mine offshore, so take this advise for what it is worth. However, I think it seems like a good summary of the "Hunters are terrible offshore" debate. Check the archives as well - lots of good info and opinions in there.
BVI <> Blue water
If there is land within a day's sail, it's not blue water. Reason, as Jared pointed out, in blue water, you can't run and hide from bad weather. A non-blue water boat such as a Hunter, may very well handle the bad weather, but it will definately be a much more uncomfortable ride then a blue water boat. Personaly, I buy things for the MOST intended use and sailing in light air is a much higher priority then rough conditions for me. Others require the best comfort (physical and mental) possible and therefore will never buy a Hunter. You will have to decide what is best for your intended use and what you want out of a boat. I know my Hunter isn't designed to be a blue water boat, but I think she can handle it and I do plan on taking her across the Atlantic some day and at least part of the Pacific.
If there is land within a day's sail, it's not blue water. Reason, as Jared pointed out, in blue water, you can't run and hide from bad weather. A non-blue water boat such as a Hunter, may very well handle the bad weather, but it will definately be a much more uncomfortable ride then a blue water boat. Personaly, I buy things for the MOST intended use and sailing in light air is a much higher priority then rough conditions for me. Others require the best comfort (physical and mental) possible and therefore will never buy a Hunter. You will have to decide what is best for your intended use and what you want out of a boat. I know my Hunter isn't designed to be a blue water boat, but I think she can handle it and I do plan on taking her across the Atlantic some day and at least part of the Pacific.
Another question?
On the Latitude 38 web site there was a post about a guy that cruised is 34 in the areas you want to go. This link gets you to a post then follow that link: http://www.sailboatowners.com/forums/pviewall.tpl?&fno=2&uid=F&sku=2005278230918.71 One thought is the boat won't take you places by itself - you'll have to make all the decisions and do the sailing. So, in a sense, isn't the question really about your ability to sail yoursef there?
On the Latitude 38 web site there was a post about a guy that cruised is 34 in the areas you want to go. This link gets you to a post then follow that link: http://www.sailboatowners.com/forums/pviewall.tpl?&fno=2&uid=F&sku=2005278230918.71 One thought is the boat won't take you places by itself - you'll have to make all the decisions and do the sailing. So, in a sense, isn't the question really about your ability to sail yoursef there?
I've done what you want to do, with the boat
you're asking about. The boat is just fine IF you set it up for it's intended use. It's all about you. The advice here is good. I would only disagree with Franklin's equating comfort as the criterion to qualify a blue water boat. I don't think any small boat is comfortable when the going gets tough. And any boat on the sea under 300' long is small. I think the H34 is very stable at sea but it needs help. A vertical stainless steel grab rail at the entrance of the main cabin is #1. That was the first thing we did when we arrived in San Francisco from Puget Sound. Fifty foot seas for three days tend to make the need apparent. And THAT was after I spent two years outfitting her. As you research outfitting any boat for sea, notice in photos of similar cruising boats that are 'out there' that a grab rail is installed. OK, that said, this forum is not the place to tell you how to equip a boat for the sea. Lots of books on the shelf will do a much better job of that. But check the archives and also scope out my web site.
What else? Oh, with this boat, NEVER store it in the Caribbean! The Pardeys never store their boat. Sailboats are a living, breathing thing. They need to be kept active. If you have to leave the boat for a return home, put someone aboard to keep her functioning. I learned that one the hard way. You'll see on my web site. Hell, on the H34, just the cockpit drains alone will wipe out the interior. Stored in the tropics, vegetation will plug the drains and the rains or a hurricane will then flood the interior. (Antigua) Keep someone aboard whom you trust. Again, the platform (H34) is doable. The initial cost is favorable and leaves room in the budget for outfitting. All you have to do is spend wisely. Have fun too.
you're asking about. The boat is just fine IF you set it up for it's intended use. It's all about you. The advice here is good. I would only disagree with Franklin's equating comfort as the criterion to qualify a blue water boat. I don't think any small boat is comfortable when the going gets tough. And any boat on the sea under 300' long is small. I think the H34 is very stable at sea but it needs help. A vertical stainless steel grab rail at the entrance of the main cabin is #1. That was the first thing we did when we arrived in San Francisco from Puget Sound. Fifty foot seas for three days tend to make the need apparent. And THAT was after I spent two years outfitting her. As you research outfitting any boat for sea, notice in photos of similar cruising boats that are 'out there' that a grab rail is installed. OK, that said, this forum is not the place to tell you how to equip a boat for the sea. Lots of books on the shelf will do a much better job of that. But check the archives and also scope out my web site.
What else? Oh, with this boat, NEVER store it in the Caribbean! The Pardeys never store their boat. Sailboats are a living, breathing thing. They need to be kept active. If you have to leave the boat for a return home, put someone aboard to keep her functioning. I learned that one the hard way. You'll see on my web site. Hell, on the H34, just the cockpit drains alone will wipe out the interior. Stored in the tropics, vegetation will plug the drains and the rains or a hurricane will then flood the interior. (Antigua) Keep someone aboard whom you trust. Again, the platform (H34) is doable. The initial cost is favorable and leaves room in the budget for outfitting. All you have to do is spend wisely. Have fun too.Fine for BVI but................
I have a few recommendations. Forget using a jib over 125% since this design is tender. Raise the height of the companion way access opening since the cabin gets wet after the water gets 3 inches deep. Consider improving the scupper design so the cockpit will drain after it takes a wave. The rudder design is weak and marginal. If your vessel has the original rudder it may be on borrowed time. The metal frame is weak and welds are prone to failure. Although the boat is tougher than many sailors are going off shore in an h34 requires a ratio of balls and brains that is different than mine. It has been done by others. Personally I'd choose a boat a bit heavier for that enviroment because winds are frequently of 20 and the h34 seems to like 12.
I have a few recommendations. Forget using a jib over 125% since this design is tender. Raise the height of the companion way access opening since the cabin gets wet after the water gets 3 inches deep. Consider improving the scupper design so the cockpit will drain after it takes a wave. The rudder design is weak and marginal. If your vessel has the original rudder it may be on borrowed time. The metal frame is weak and welds are prone to failure. Although the boat is tougher than many sailors are going off shore in an h34 requires a ratio of balls and brains that is different than mine. It has been done by others. Personally I'd choose a boat a bit heavier for that enviroment because winds are frequently of 20 and the h34 seems to like 12.
Actually Fred
I'm aware of Darryl's history of posts here but I think some of his comments are reasonable. The 34 is a big-rigged boat which excels in light air so a small headsail is sensible plan in anticipation of heavier air, especially if you're also going to carry an offwind sail. We just switched from a 155 to a 110 that we happened to have and we love the wider envelope of wind conditions we can really sail in. His comment about fashioning a higher bridgedeck is also a good one. It's a good safety concern and a removeable fixture could be easily made so you have the best of both worlds. Improving scupper capacity is never a bad thing and I'm even looking at overhauling mine. He has obviously had rudder issues with his previous boat but I'll disagree with his assessment that it's indicative of a systemic problem. There isn't an epidemic of Foss Foam failures, especially when you consider how many manufacturers use them. I won't comment on his personal balls/brains admission
I'm aware of Darryl's history of posts here but I think some of his comments are reasonable. The 34 is a big-rigged boat which excels in light air so a small headsail is sensible plan in anticipation of heavier air, especially if you're also going to carry an offwind sail. We just switched from a 155 to a 110 that we happened to have and we love the wider envelope of wind conditions we can really sail in. His comment about fashioning a higher bridgedeck is also a good one. It's a good safety concern and a removeable fixture could be easily made so you have the best of both worlds. Improving scupper capacity is never a bad thing and I'm even looking at overhauling mine. He has obviously had rudder issues with his previous boat but I'll disagree with his assessment that it's indicative of a systemic problem. There isn't an epidemic of Foss Foam failures, especially when you consider how many manufacturers use them. I won't comment on his personal balls/brains admission
Rick, all I asked (oops)RC was, if he knew Daryl.
I never said Daryls opinions were invalid. Look at the bottom of my first post. I talk about the H34 being easy to flood. But, I didn't talk about the drain functionality at sea. Only once in the years at sea with our boat and at home in flat water has a wave (freak) splashed into the cockpit. About 5-10 gallons was deposited on the floor. The scuppers drained it in about 30 seconds. The open companion-way didn't allow a drop below. As far as raising the bridge deck; not good on this boat. Again, the hull is tall and buoyant and speedy so waves don't enter the cockpit like old style low free-board boats. If Daryl took his off-shore he might have found out. And keeping the companion-way clear at sea is a good thing. I traverse that path many times an hour and I have a gimpy leg. Now if you can come up with a practical, workable improvement of the drains, I'm all eyes and ears. Not that I'd do the change, we're on flat water now. And the boat is not stored. And I've written here many times that the H34 is tender. The rig is very tall, thusly it has a huge engine and is tender if not driven in a seaman like manor. But even double reefed with the 150 genny rolled up to the size of a postage stamp, I'll sail circles around Tyana 37s and 50 foot ketches flying a full suit because they are 'stiff'. I've done it. And I'm sorry for Daryl and his rudder. Mine's the original. And I would never comment on a mans',,,'equipment'. I don't know him. (except for his posts here)
I never said Daryls opinions were invalid. Look at the bottom of my first post. I talk about the H34 being easy to flood. But, I didn't talk about the drain functionality at sea. Only once in the years at sea with our boat and at home in flat water has a wave (freak) splashed into the cockpit. About 5-10 gallons was deposited on the floor. The scuppers drained it in about 30 seconds. The open companion-way didn't allow a drop below. As far as raising the bridge deck; not good on this boat. Again, the hull is tall and buoyant and speedy so waves don't enter the cockpit like old style low free-board boats. If Daryl took his off-shore he might have found out. And keeping the companion-way clear at sea is a good thing. I traverse that path many times an hour and I have a gimpy leg. Now if you can come up with a practical, workable improvement of the drains, I'm all eyes and ears. Not that I'd do the change, we're on flat water now. And the boat is not stored. And I've written here many times that the H34 is tender. The rig is very tall, thusly it has a huge engine and is tender if not driven in a seaman like manor. But even double reefed with the 150 genny rolled up to the size of a postage stamp, I'll sail circles around Tyana 37s and 50 foot ketches flying a full suit because they are 'stiff'. I've done it. And I'm sorry for Daryl and his rudder. Mine's the original. And I would never comment on a mans',,,'equipment'. I don't know him. (except for his posts here)
you all scare me a bit
i just bought a hunter 31 and yet to really sail her. I bought mine to sail all around bahamas and carb. i looked at a 34 with the thinking that bigger was better for these trips but one wise man told me there is always a weather pattern that you wish you had even bigger, don't buy what you can afford but buy what you'll use. so back to the 30, easier to slip in and out when in tight places, travel on predictable weather paterns. I heard not to much bad about Hunter but overall grade was given high marks for the price. hey who am I?
i just bought a hunter 31 and yet to really sail her. I bought mine to sail all around bahamas and carb. i looked at a 34 with the thinking that bigger was better for these trips but one wise man told me there is always a weather pattern that you wish you had even bigger, don't buy what you can afford but buy what you'll use. so back to the 30, easier to slip in and out when in tight places, travel on predictable weather paterns. I heard not to much bad about Hunter but overall grade was given high marks for the price. hey who am I?
Rudder Followup
I'm curious if any owners of mid 1980 Hunters have seen what is inside their rudder. I was unable to pull up photos which were put in the archives years ago. Hunter's design had very little metal inside and they intentionally crushed the stainless tube before doing a very crude weld job and adding a very thin frame. I've seen inside many rudders from vessels of similiar and was unimpreesed by the Hunter design. I doubt all the fault is with Foam who made them although their fiberglass workmanship was marginal on the two rudders they made for me. I have to look in my scrap metal pile for the original post and frame so I can post a photo here. I think if Fred saw how mine failed he would be less eager to go off shore again with the original rudder. (what's another grand when you have $80k+ invested? grin) I will say the original failure on my vessel was due to delamination cause by water intrusion and frost during winter storage. The second failure was very clearly cause by a bad design and poor workmanship
I'm curious if any owners of mid 1980 Hunters have seen what is inside their rudder. I was unable to pull up photos which were put in the archives years ago. Hunter's design had very little metal inside and they intentionally crushed the stainless tube before doing a very crude weld job and adding a very thin frame. I've seen inside many rudders from vessels of similiar and was unimpreesed by the Hunter design. I doubt all the fault is with Foam who made them although their fiberglass workmanship was marginal on the two rudders they made for me. I have to look in my scrap metal pile for the original post and frame so I can post a photo here. I think if Fred saw how mine failed he would be less eager to go off shore again with the original rudder. (what's another grand when you have $80k+ invested? grin) I will say the original failure on my vessel was due to delamination cause by water intrusion and frost during winter storage. The second failure was very clearly cause by a bad design and poor workmanship
Gee Fred
Here I thought your post was just a wink and a nod to some of Darryl's past posts trumpeting Hunter shortcomings. Just making introductions maybe? I still stand by my points some of which certainly appear to be in agreement with your own. Although it's fortunate that the high topsides of the 34 have kept you from being seriously pooped I'll still disagree that relying on that feature alone is a not a good idea in true offshore work. Most bridgedecks/scuppers will handle 5 to 10 gallons without fuss but that's quite a bit different than a cockpit filling wave. Yup, increasing capacity of the scuppers would require larger diameter hoses and significant glasswork at either end (cockpit and thru-hull) but that couldn't be too tall an order for a man of your obvious skills could it? If you'll agree that a green wave COULD climb in and fill the cockpit in the course of true blue water work (even if it hasn't happened to you) then I'll reassert that increasing scupper capacity and measures to keep it from getting below are worth considering. Fair winds.
Here I thought your post was just a wink and a nod to some of Darryl's past posts trumpeting Hunter shortcomings. Just making introductions maybe?
I still stand by my points some of which certainly appear to be in agreement with your own. Although it's fortunate that the high topsides of the 34 have kept you from being seriously pooped I'll still disagree that relying on that feature alone is a not a good idea in true offshore work. Most bridgedecks/scuppers will handle 5 to 10 gallons without fuss but that's quite a bit different than a cockpit filling wave. Yup, increasing capacity of the scuppers would require larger diameter hoses and significant glasswork at either end (cockpit and thru-hull) but that couldn't be too tall an order for a man of your obvious skills could it? If you'll agree that a green wave COULD climb in and fill the cockpit in the course of true blue water work (even if it hasn't happened to you) then I'll reassert that increasing scupper capacity and measures to keep it from getting below are worth considering. Fair winds.
Believe me, I've thought about it.
But even our logo would go away,,and, and, and,,, no that's one modification that would result instead in a new boat.
But even our logo would go away,,and, and, and,,, no that's one modification that would result instead in a new boat.
I've had mine 50 miles off shore on
the way to Maine.. That's is far is I would go but the boat was fine. On the return trip when the weather got bad we did head in at the half way point.."every one was sick". The boat took the pounding alot better than we did. 8' to 12' seas.. We NEVER should have left when we did. Weather window is everthing and something my brother found out the hard way as he took a cab ride home from Wells Maine to Mass. No rudder problems other then the bearing being replaced.
the way to Maine.. That's is far is I would go but the boat was fine. On the return trip when the weather got bad we did head in at the half way point.."every one was sick". The boat took the pounding alot better than we did. 8' to 12' seas.. We NEVER should have left when we did. Weather window is everthing and something my brother found out the hard way as he took a cab ride home from Wells Maine to Mass. No rudder problems other then the bearing being replaced.
Scuppers
We had a 34 for six years and I looked at the small scuppers with concern. You really have to keep an eye on them if your boat is stored outside over winter and there are trees nearby. Leaves will block them in a second. I had thought about running one or two 4 inch Schedule 40 pipes from the bottom back of the cockpit directly to the rear through the lazarette and out the transome. I thought that I could cut the holes and glass them in place and end up with a workman like outcome. We moved on to a P42 instead which really is not a bit better. Two 1 1/4 drains. We keep at least the bottom companionway board (plexiglass) in place when it is a little rough, and all in when it is real rough.
We had a 34 for six years and I looked at the small scuppers with concern. You really have to keep an eye on them if your boat is stored outside over winter and there are trees nearby. Leaves will block them in a second. I had thought about running one or two 4 inch Schedule 40 pipes from the bottom back of the cockpit directly to the rear through the lazarette and out the transome. I thought that I could cut the holes and glass them in place and end up with a workman like outcome. We moved on to a P42 instead which really is not a bit better. Two 1 1/4 drains. We keep at least the bottom companionway board (plexiglass) in place when it is a little rough, and all in when it is real rough.
- Status