I always assumed that the line which holds down the rudder on my 87 H23 was designed to break away if grounded. Now that my son has put it to the test, I realize that maybe that's not the case. A 1/2" line in a very substantial clam cleat ain't going nowhere! The result was minor damage to the transom and a missing lower pintle. (The 1/2" line has been shaved to a 1/4" line.) Should this line break away or is it just to hold down a floating rudder? Is a 1/2" double braided line too large? Am I missing something? (like the obvious).
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rudder,
NOt sure how yours is set up, I sail in very shallow waters and mine kicks up all of the time, the only thing that ever got damaged was the line itself sort of gets torn a little , now I try to keep a spare , the cam cleats should release when you hit something with the rudder, are sure what actually happened, ? So I guess I am saying under normal circumstances there should not be damage to pintle or transom , doubt it this helps you much , good luck MIke Bacome
NOt sure how yours is set up, I sail in very shallow waters and mine kicks up all of the time, the only thing that ever got damaged was the line itself sort of gets torn a little , now I try to keep a spare , the cam cleats should release when you hit something with the rudder, are sure what actually happened, ? So I guess I am saying under normal circumstances there should not be damage to pintle or transom , doubt it this helps you much , good luck MIke Bacome
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Ernie Rogers
My '86 h23 is rigged with 1/4" line...
and slips thru the cam cleat if the rudder hits. Actually, it will sometimes kick up without hitting anything, but after reading of your woes, that's now okay with me!!
and slips thru the cam cleat if the rudder hits. Actually, it will sometimes kick up without hitting anything, but after reading of your woes, that's now okay with me!!
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Ray Bowles
My 95 H26 has a small line cleat on the underside
of the tiller handle to tie off the rudder line. Instead I tighten the large wingnut to hold the rudder in position and then use a rubber bundgee to hold the loop of remaining line tight by hooking the other end of the bundgee to the hole in the forward end of the tiller. There is enough tension in the line and friction at the rudder to keep the rudder down in the worst of weather and it pops up very nicely when it hits something. Ray S/V Speedy
of the tiller handle to tie off the rudder line. Instead I tighten the large wingnut to hold the rudder in position and then use a rubber bundgee to hold the loop of remaining line tight by hooking the other end of the bundgee to the hole in the forward end of the tiller. There is enough tension in the line and friction at the rudder to keep the rudder down in the worst of weather and it pops up very nicely when it hits something. Ray S/V Speedy
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Bill L
tiller on h23
My tiller break away line gets tested once or twice a year. I use 1/4" braided line. In my case it is usually a submerged stump that we hit. I sail on Lake Onalaska in Western Wisconsin which was formed behind lock and dam no. 7 on the Mississippi. The corps of engineers left a lot of stuff when they cleared the area for the lake. As a result the ice moves the waterlogged submerged stumps around over the winter in hopes of nailing even expeirienced sailors in the summer. Fortunately the house foundations that were also left behind don't move around. You just have to remember where they are. BTW the DNR does not allow these to be marked with hazard buoyes. Why?? In my case the braid rips and the tiller comes up. Then I replace the braided line before I sail again. I have never had any other damage to the boat and I can tell you that the tiller has hit hard and come up fast using this method. (probably a house foundation) I suspect that in your situation, the 1/2 line is too strong. Thanks for your post because all of us will learn. Good Luck and happy sailing. Bill bleathen@aol.com
My tiller break away line gets tested once or twice a year. I use 1/4" braided line. In my case it is usually a submerged stump that we hit. I sail on Lake Onalaska in Western Wisconsin which was formed behind lock and dam no. 7 on the Mississippi. The corps of engineers left a lot of stuff when they cleared the area for the lake. As a result the ice moves the waterlogged submerged stumps around over the winter in hopes of nailing even expeirienced sailors in the summer. Fortunately the house foundations that were also left behind don't move around. You just have to remember where they are. BTW the DNR does not allow these to be marked with hazard buoyes. Why?? In my case the braid rips and the tiller comes up. Then I replace the braided line before I sail again. I have never had any other damage to the boat and I can tell you that the tiller has hit hard and come up fast using this method. (probably a house foundation) I suspect that in your situation, the 1/2 line is too strong. Thanks for your post because all of us will learn. Good Luck and happy sailing. Bill bleathen@aol.com
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Kevin Keen
1/2 inch line on rudder is way too much
David: I have 1/4 inch line on my (Foss) breakaway rudder for a 1985 H23. 1/2 inch is WAY TOO MUCH. I checked the H23 manual page for the "rudder mechanism" and no indication of line diameter is given. Neither is any indication given on the standing rigging manual page. But I am happy with 1/4 inch. And yes, as others have commented, after a day's sailing there has been some slippage and the rudder line (it's called a pendant) needs to be tightened. Given your experience, I won't complain again! Note that with the wing keel H23, the bottom of the rudder is below the wing. As you most unfortunately discovered, it is essential that it swings away to prevent damage.
David: I have 1/4 inch line on my (Foss) breakaway rudder for a 1985 H23. 1/2 inch is WAY TOO MUCH. I checked the H23 manual page for the "rudder mechanism" and no indication of line diameter is given. Neither is any indication given on the standing rigging manual page. But I am happy with 1/4 inch. And yes, as others have commented, after a day's sailing there has been some slippage and the rudder line (it's called a pendant) needs to be tightened. Given your experience, I won't complain again! Note that with the wing keel H23, the bottom of the rudder is below the wing. As you most unfortunately discovered, it is essential that it swings away to prevent damage.
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David Knowles
Thanks. . .
Thanks for all the replies. I guess the conclusion is to get a smaller line. By the way, I meant to say "cam", not "clam" cleat. It's large and the 1/2" line looked at home in there. The first four machine shops I tried couldn't make the pintle because they didn't have a break to bend 3/16" stainless. The fifth quoted $290. At that point I just wanted to go sailing.
Thanks for all the replies. I guess the conclusion is to get a smaller line. By the way, I meant to say "cam", not "clam" cleat. It's large and the 1/2" line looked at home in there. The first four machine shops I tried couldn't make the pintle because they didn't have a break to bend 3/16" stainless. The fifth quoted $290. At that point I just wanted to go sailing.
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Jim Maroldo
H23 Rudder retracting
I have always felt that 1/4" line is too small for this purpose, David. I sure am sorry to hear that your 23 was damaged; I never really thought about it, but I guess the transom on the 23 is pretty substantial! I've always been afraid the 'glass would crack before the pintle broke. Ours makes a big 'BANG' every time she pops up. We have a Harken 1/2" cam cleat on the rudder housing, and use 3/8" line. We pop the rudder at least a dozen times each season, and so far, so good! As has already been stated, the line gets chewed up after awhile, but I left the line extra long, so I can pull it through the padeye at the top of the rudder 2 or 3 times before it all must be replaced. By then, it's December, and we can't sail in ol' Barney anyway. Smooth Sailing... Jim s/v 'Lil Wass Ett
I have always felt that 1/4" line is too small for this purpose, David. I sure am sorry to hear that your 23 was damaged; I never really thought about it, but I guess the transom on the 23 is pretty substantial! I've always been afraid the 'glass would crack before the pintle broke. Ours makes a big 'BANG' every time she pops up. We have a Harken 1/2" cam cleat on the rudder housing, and use 3/8" line. We pop the rudder at least a dozen times each season, and so far, so good! As has already been stated, the line gets chewed up after awhile, but I left the line extra long, so I can pull it through the padeye at the top of the rudder 2 or 3 times before it all must be replaced. By then, it's December, and we can't sail in ol' Barney anyway. Smooth Sailing... Jim s/v 'Lil Wass Ett
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