I have just purchased a 1993 Hunter Vision 32 that has a leaking holding tank. Has anybody ever removed one of these ? The hold opening is too small to remove the tank. They must have built the boat around the tank. Thanks
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Hi, Richard
Did you buy the Mexican-documented V32? Sounded like a nice boat. In any event, there are two holding tank locations. One under the shower seat and one under the swim step between the two aft transom lockers. I had the latter and found I could not remove it without cutting it up. I wasted LOTS of time first. You need the correct tool. Trying a saber saw did not work. The aluminum is too thin and it just bounces around. I wound up with a mini-circular saw with a carbide blade that had it out in no time. Another idea is a panel-ripper or cutter from an auto-body shop. As to the replacement: that was a real problem. I finally went with two six-gallon plastic tanks that were siamesed at the fittings for both intake, outlet and vent. It isn't a great option because you add the possibility of more places to clog. Worked OK tho. Another idea is to see if RONCO has one to fit under the starboard portion of the aft berth. You would have to re-route the vent. Deck evacuation fitting probably OK. You should add a Y-valve too, since most of your sailing will be well out. Also consider an electric bellows discharge pump to replace the manual one. Sealand or Whale. That should set you up fine. Good luck! Rick D.
Did you buy the Mexican-documented V32? Sounded like a nice boat. In any event, there are two holding tank locations. One under the shower seat and one under the swim step between the two aft transom lockers. I had the latter and found I could not remove it without cutting it up. I wasted LOTS of time first. You need the correct tool. Trying a saber saw did not work. The aluminum is too thin and it just bounces around. I wound up with a mini-circular saw with a carbide blade that had it out in no time. Another idea is a panel-ripper or cutter from an auto-body shop. As to the replacement: that was a real problem. I finally went with two six-gallon plastic tanks that were siamesed at the fittings for both intake, outlet and vent. It isn't a great option because you add the possibility of more places to clog. Worked OK tho. Another idea is to see if RONCO has one to fit under the starboard portion of the aft berth. You would have to re-route the vent. Deck evacuation fitting probably OK. You should add a Y-valve too, since most of your sailing will be well out. Also consider an electric bellows discharge pump to replace the manual one. Sealand or Whale. That should set you up fine. Good luck! Rick D.
WELD THE TANK
Hi Richard, I have a suggestion that should work very well for you. I didn't even think of it before. If you are able to get the tank turned upward and blocked up high, near the large opening you can have a welder, gas weld the leak. Gas welding aluminum is a science that aircraft builders are familiar with like myself. Most aluminum tanks of any kind during world war 2 were gas welded. Just find a certified welder and he should be able to weld it for you. Be sure and find someone who can gas weld aluminum. Larry Howell
Hi Richard, I have a suggestion that should work very well for you. I didn't even think of it before. If you are able to get the tank turned upward and blocked up high, near the large opening you can have a welder, gas weld the leak. Gas welding aluminum is a science that aircraft builders are familiar with like myself. Most aluminum tanks of any kind during world war 2 were gas welded. Just find a certified welder and he should be able to weld it for you. Be sure and find someone who can gas weld aluminum. Larry Howell
WELDING ALUMINUM TANKS
To follow up on my suggestion to weld the aluminum tank. If it is leaking around a fitting or where the fitting goes in or comes out, that would be an easy repair. If there is a hole developing in the bottom or a side for example, a good welder can take another piece of aluminum cut to the proper size and center it over the bad area and weld around the perimeter of it. This would extend the life of the tank for many years. I have a 1991 Hunter 30 and the openings in the rear of my boat are large enough to do the welding that I am talking about. As a matter of fact two years ago I had a leak in one of my hoses. I was able to go down in the area with the tank, cut the hose shorter and reclamp it. I am 6'2" and weighed at the time about 225. If I can get in there almost anyone else should be able to. Larry Howell
To follow up on my suggestion to weld the aluminum tank. If it is leaking around a fitting or where the fitting goes in or comes out, that would be an easy repair. If there is a hole developing in the bottom or a side for example, a good welder can take another piece of aluminum cut to the proper size and center it over the bad area and weld around the perimeter of it. This would extend the life of the tank for many years. I have a 1991 Hunter 30 and the openings in the rear of my boat are large enough to do the welding that I am talking about. As a matter of fact two years ago I had a leak in one of my hoses. I was able to go down in the area with the tank, cut the hose shorter and reclamp it. I am 6'2" and weighed at the time about 225. If I can get in there almost anyone else should be able to. Larry Howell
Not worth the effort to weld it
Unfortunately aluminum holding tanks have a very short life-span--only about 10 years from the first time it's actually used. Urine is SO corrosive that salt and chlorine and benign in comparison to it. Typically, it'll eat through a weld at a seam or a fitting within 2-5 years...and eventually will turn the sheet metal into a collander. So once you see the first leak, you'll save yourself a lot of wasted effort if you just bite the bullet and replace it then, 'cuz the first leak is only the FIRST leak...it's a losing battle. A tank that's been coated inside with epoxy or other barrier lasts a little longer, but the longest I've ever seen ANY metal waste holding tank last is 10-12 years. Stainless steel is no less vulnerable, especially at the welds, although it may take urine a little longer to eat through the sheet metal, but only because steel is thicker than aluminum. And, btw...it doesn't matter how religious you are about pumping and rinsing, nor is there anything that can be added to the tank to "neutralize" the corrosive effects of urine. Metal is just a bad choice for waste holding. Builders and others used it in the late '70s and '80s (and a very few still do) in the mistaken belief that it's less permeable than plastic, and therefore will help to prevent odors. By the mid-'90s almost all builders, including Hunter had seen the error in that thinking and had switched to plastic. So don't waste your time and effort welding it...replace it with a good quality plastic tank.
Unfortunately aluminum holding tanks have a very short life-span--only about 10 years from the first time it's actually used. Urine is SO corrosive that salt and chlorine and benign in comparison to it. Typically, it'll eat through a weld at a seam or a fitting within 2-5 years...and eventually will turn the sheet metal into a collander. So once you see the first leak, you'll save yourself a lot of wasted effort if you just bite the bullet and replace it then, 'cuz the first leak is only the FIRST leak...it's a losing battle. A tank that's been coated inside with epoxy or other barrier lasts a little longer, but the longest I've ever seen ANY metal waste holding tank last is 10-12 years. Stainless steel is no less vulnerable, especially at the welds, although it may take urine a little longer to eat through the sheet metal, but only because steel is thicker than aluminum. And, btw...it doesn't matter how religious you are about pumping and rinsing, nor is there anything that can be added to the tank to "neutralize" the corrosive effects of urine. Metal is just a bad choice for waste holding. Builders and others used it in the late '70s and '80s (and a very few still do) in the mistaken belief that it's less permeable than plastic, and therefore will help to prevent odors. By the mid-'90s almost all builders, including Hunter had seen the error in that thinking and had switched to plastic. So don't waste your time and effort welding it...replace it with a good quality plastic tank.
LAST SUGGESTION-WHAT I WOULD DO
If the head mistress doesn't like welding, I would then fiberglass over the tank. I would use the tank as a male plug which means leaving the aluminum tank inside of the new made fiberglass tank and letting the urine make it disappear. This could also be done inside of the boat in steps of course. First I would look at the nipples sticking out of the tank (if no nipples make some). If I could fiberglass onto those and the hoses still slip over them for clamping I would leave them. If not I would remove them find some kind of fiberglass or pvc tubing that was small enough to have layers of glass cloth lain and wrapped ontop of it and lapped onto the sides of the tank and still get the rubber hoses over it. I would then glue or epoxy them in place so I could glass from the sides of the tank onto the new nipples. I would start with roughing up the aluminum with sandpaper, steelwool, steelbrush, whatever was easiest and that would do an adequate job, clean the roughed up aluminum off before fiberglassing. I like epoxy resins for longevity and strength, usually more expensive to purchase. I would probably glass the bottom of the tank first. If you use bidirectional cloth be sure to lay the direction of strands on and over square corners at a 45 degree angle to have the best success at keeping it laying down flat on the aluminum. If you lay it down and lap over a corner at 90 degrees-that means strands of glass fibers bending straight over the edge. When this is done, depending on the size of the strands (cloth weight)it wants to raise up or not lay down against the aluminum or whatever right on the corner or each side of the exact orner that is. Anyway lay on several layers of fiberglass cloth (one at a time and wetted out with resin of course) on the bottom of the tank lapping as far down the sides towards the top as possible. If you can go within an inch of the top edge that would be great. Peelply the first 4 to 6 inches from the top edge of the glass job you just did or in this case the bottom edge which in reality is the top of the tank aiming down, remember the bottom is up or on top right now. Once this has cured, peel off the peelply, or rough sand the first 4 to 6" if you did not have any peelply (which takes the place of sanding). Turn the tank top side up now, apply the same number of plies of cloth and resin to the top of the tank overlapping the 4 to 6 inches of the already glassed bottom area. During the tank glassing, you needed to be applying layers of glass onto the nipples sticking out that your hoses will attach to. Put as many layers on the nipples as required to make it the correct diameter and structurally strong enough to support clamping pressures. This tank will last forever I would think, urine should not effect the epoxy resins. If it will then use polyester or vinylester resins. If you are planning on keeping your boat long term, bite the bullet and take the time to do it right. If your not keeping the boat and don't care about the future owner, weld it, if you want a bunch of plastic tanks hosed together then do that. I give up, hands are in the air !!
Larry Howell
If the head mistress doesn't like welding, I would then fiberglass over the tank. I would use the tank as a male plug which means leaving the aluminum tank inside of the new made fiberglass tank and letting the urine make it disappear. This could also be done inside of the boat in steps of course. First I would look at the nipples sticking out of the tank (if no nipples make some). If I could fiberglass onto those and the hoses still slip over them for clamping I would leave them. If not I would remove them find some kind of fiberglass or pvc tubing that was small enough to have layers of glass cloth lain and wrapped ontop of it and lapped onto the sides of the tank and still get the rubber hoses over it. I would then glue or epoxy them in place so I could glass from the sides of the tank onto the new nipples. I would start with roughing up the aluminum with sandpaper, steelwool, steelbrush, whatever was easiest and that would do an adequate job, clean the roughed up aluminum off before fiberglassing. I like epoxy resins for longevity and strength, usually more expensive to purchase. I would probably glass the bottom of the tank first. If you use bidirectional cloth be sure to lay the direction of strands on and over square corners at a 45 degree angle to have the best success at keeping it laying down flat on the aluminum. If you lay it down and lap over a corner at 90 degrees-that means strands of glass fibers bending straight over the edge. When this is done, depending on the size of the strands (cloth weight)it wants to raise up or not lay down against the aluminum or whatever right on the corner or each side of the exact orner that is. Anyway lay on several layers of fiberglass cloth (one at a time and wetted out with resin of course) on the bottom of the tank lapping as far down the sides towards the top as possible. If you can go within an inch of the top edge that would be great. Peelply the first 4 to 6 inches from the top edge of the glass job you just did or in this case the bottom edge which in reality is the top of the tank aiming down, remember the bottom is up or on top right now. Once this has cured, peel off the peelply, or rough sand the first 4 to 6" if you did not have any peelply (which takes the place of sanding). Turn the tank top side up now, apply the same number of plies of cloth and resin to the top of the tank overlapping the 4 to 6 inches of the already glassed bottom area. During the tank glassing, you needed to be applying layers of glass onto the nipples sticking out that your hoses will attach to. Put as many layers on the nipples as required to make it the correct diameter and structurally strong enough to support clamping pressures. This tank will last forever I would think, urine should not effect the epoxy resins. If it will then use polyester or vinylester resins. If you are planning on keeping your boat long term, bite the bullet and take the time to do it right. If your not keeping the boat and don't care about the future owner, weld it, if you want a bunch of plastic tanks hosed together then do that. I give up, hands are in the air !!
Larry HowellOh dear, noooo!!
Glassing over the outside of an aluminum tank will only result in a corroded mess inside the fiberglass (because inside of the tank will continue to corrode) and waste-soaked rotten fiberglass due to hairline cracks in the epoxy caused by expansion and contraction--which, btw, is the reason fiberglass isn't recommended for waste holding either. Besides, by the time you do all that you describe, you'll have more time and effort--not to mention expense--in it than it takes to just replace the damn thing with a good quality poly tank--which is the ONLY material now recommended for waste AND water holding. Ronco Plastics (their catalog is on their website at the link I provided in my previous reply) makes top quality tanks and has more than 400 shapes and sizes. Anyone who can't find a replacement tank from them isn't trying.
Glassing over the outside of an aluminum tank will only result in a corroded mess inside the fiberglass (because inside of the tank will continue to corrode) and waste-soaked rotten fiberglass due to hairline cracks in the epoxy caused by expansion and contraction--which, btw, is the reason fiberglass isn't recommended for waste holding either. Besides, by the time you do all that you describe, you'll have more time and effort--not to mention expense--in it than it takes to just replace the damn thing with a good quality poly tank--which is the ONLY material now recommended for waste AND water holding. Ronco Plastics (their catalog is on their website at the link I provided in my previous reply) makes top quality tanks and has more than 400 shapes and sizes. Anyone who can't find a replacement tank from them isn't trying.
LOTS OF PEOPLE IN TROUBLE IF YOUR RIGHT
There are millions of underground septic system holding tanks made from fiberglass. I guess all of those people who have had them for 20 years or more will be disappointed to find that they are no good. The manufacturers of those tanks seem now to be in a precarious situation also. Especially since that industry is growing at a rapid rate. I assumed that the urine would eat away the aluminum as suggested and that there would be no expansion and contraction. I am not so sure that a thin wall corroded by urine aluminum tank would posess quite the power to craze the multilayered new glass tank. If so then do not sand or rough up the aluminum before glassing. Maybe wax it then glass over it. If one were worried about expansion and contraction then lightly glue a 1/4" thick layer of urethane foam on the outside of the tank and then fiberglass over it instead. Then the expansion and contraction can just simply crush the foam, instead of damaging the new fiberglass tank. I am not trying to be hard headed here. I am saying there are more than one way to do things. This way may not be your way but it is a way. Besides I like fiberglassing! There are also millions of fiberglass fuel cells that hold thousands of gallons in a single tank buried all over the United States also, I hope we are not going to find that those are no good also. If so that will cost billions of dollars to replace. I would not hesitate to use a fiberglass tank for a waste tank. It would last forever almost. At least as long as we will live. As far as stuff inside of the completely sealed fiberglass tank--who cares it is waste or corroding aluminum which has been there corroding all along, why not let it corrode completely? I guess the point would be to have the same single holding tank without multiple little tanks all hooked together. I would take the single tank, I do not like the idea of multiple tanks hooked together with multiple opportunities to leak and cause me problems. I would guess the path one would take, will be determined by his or her skill level, time available, and money available. Have fun as we know times a waste-ing Larry Howell
There are millions of underground septic system holding tanks made from fiberglass. I guess all of those people who have had them for 20 years or more will be disappointed to find that they are no good. The manufacturers of those tanks seem now to be in a precarious situation also. Especially since that industry is growing at a rapid rate. I assumed that the urine would eat away the aluminum as suggested and that there would be no expansion and contraction. I am not so sure that a thin wall corroded by urine aluminum tank would posess quite the power to craze the multilayered new glass tank. If so then do not sand or rough up the aluminum before glassing. Maybe wax it then glass over it. If one were worried about expansion and contraction then lightly glue a 1/4" thick layer of urethane foam on the outside of the tank and then fiberglass over it instead. Then the expansion and contraction can just simply crush the foam, instead of damaging the new fiberglass tank. I am not trying to be hard headed here. I am saying there are more than one way to do things. This way may not be your way but it is a way. Besides I like fiberglassing!
There are also millions of fiberglass fuel cells that hold thousands of gallons in a single tank buried all over the United States also, I hope we are not going to find that those are no good also. If so that will cost billions of dollars to replace. I would not hesitate to use a fiberglass tank for a waste tank. It would last forever almost. At least as long as we will live. As far as stuff inside of the completely sealed fiberglass tank--who cares it is waste or corroding aluminum which has been there corroding all along, why not let it corrode completely? I guess the point would be to have the same single holding tank without multiple little tanks all hooked together. I would take the single tank, I do not like the idea of multiple tanks hooked together with multiple opportunities to leak and cause me problems. I would guess the path one would take, will be determined by his or her skill level, time available, and money available. Have fun as we know times a waste-ing Larry HowellBig difference, Larry
Septic tanks and fuel cells on land aren't likely to be subject to flexing and shocks...tanks on boats are...and problems with fiberglass tanks on boats, especially older boats, are not uncommon. Rotomolded poly has been the recommended material for holding tanks on boats for at least 10 years. That's not just my opinion...I'm only the messenger.
Septic tanks and fuel cells on land aren't likely to be subject to flexing and shocks...tanks on boats are...and problems with fiberglass tanks on boats, especially older boats, are not uncommon. Rotomolded poly has been the recommended material for holding tanks on boats for at least 10 years. That's not just my opinion...I'm only the messenger.
Septic Tank/Holding Tank Apples and Oranges
Comparing septic tanks to holding tanks is like comparing apples to oranges. Septic tank systems are designed to leak. A properly designed septic tank system MUST be installed in a soil with a certain permeability range - not more than and not less than a certain amount (permeability range depends on the code requirements for your area). A septic tank system has a leach field where excess liquid leaches out into the soil. It doesn't matter one iota if the septic tank is permeable. Wells are required to be no closer than a certain distance - depending on the county code this can be 100 to 200 feet - to prevent contamintion from the septic system. On the other hand, on a boat, you don't want ANY leaching (at least I don't), and preferably no gas permeability, either. On a boat it matters one hell of a lot if the holding tank is permeable. Don't try to compare a septic tank system to a holding tank system - they're two completely different animals.
Comparing septic tanks to holding tanks is like comparing apples to oranges. Septic tank systems are designed to leak. A properly designed septic tank system MUST be installed in a soil with a certain permeability range - not more than and not less than a certain amount (permeability range depends on the code requirements for your area). A septic tank system has a leach field where excess liquid leaches out into the soil. It doesn't matter one iota if the septic tank is permeable. Wells are required to be no closer than a certain distance - depending on the county code this can be 100 to 200 feet - to prevent contamintion from the septic system. On the other hand, on a boat, you don't want ANY leaching (at least I don't), and preferably no gas permeability, either. On a boat it matters one hell of a lot if the holding tank is permeable. Don't try to compare a septic tank system to a holding tank system - they're two completely different animals.
NEW SEPTIC SYSTEMS AS OF 20 YEARS AGO
The new type of septic systems do not leak! They are required to not leak! They are called aerobic systems. They are set up like mini city systems. They consist of airpumps, for assisting fast growing bacteria for solids consumption. Clear water rises, moves to the next no leak tank area, then it in most cases is run through a chlorinating area into the last no leak tank and then is pumped with a water pump out through a water sprinkler system that waters the surface of your yard. It is claimed that you can drink the exiting water. I wouldn't but who knows? When I first installed mine 20 years ago, the county where I live wanted regular lateral line type system, but reluctantly accepted this aerobic type. Now this county will not allow the old lateral line type, one can only install the aerobic type. Must be better I guess!!! Anyway a regular septic system is also a no leak tank system. The tanks hold the solids and liquids of course, bacteria works naturally to break down and consume the solids, the liquid rises to the top and exits to a secondary tank and then when it fills to a certain level the clear liquid exits out what is known as lateral lines that are placed in a series, certain number of running feet, of lines according to the absorption rate of the soil in the area that it is placed. The liquids do not leak through the walls of the tank as was implied before. The point that was apparently missed by all is that fiberglass impregnated with epoxy resins will not be affected by human waste, or corroding aluminum. If the fiberglass tank is built correctly it will be as strong if not stronger than a plastic tank. Remember that resins are a form of plastic, but in this case just reinforced with the fiberglass, kevlar, carbon fibre, boron or whatever your choice of cloths may be. There are the same comparisons not apples to oranges. If one knows the facts then the comparison can be made. You have to know what you are talking about to make any comparisons on any subject, this just happens to be a subject that I know a lot about. My company has made many products in years past from composite products including hi tech carbon fibre wing spars for aircraft. As was pointed out in the beginning, the opening was too small in the persons boat to get the large tank out of the boat for repair or replacement. I gave a couple of ideas for repairing the exhisting tank while it remained in the boat, so the person would not have to take the time to cut it out of the boat, then be able to retain his exhisting storage capacity and spend less than one hundred dollars for the fix. If someone wants to look around and find multiple plastic tanks that will fit through a small opening for installation and all of the lines and fittings to attach them together that is just fine and dandy, let them get after it. What is wrong with an optional way of doing things without the attacks??? Larry Howell
The new type of septic systems do not leak! They are required to not leak! They are called aerobic systems. They are set up like mini city systems. They consist of airpumps, for assisting fast growing bacteria for solids consumption. Clear water rises, moves to the next no leak tank area, then it in most cases is run through a chlorinating area into the last no leak tank and then is pumped with a water pump out through a water sprinkler system that waters the surface of your yard. It is claimed that you can drink the exiting water. I wouldn't but who knows? When I first installed mine 20 years ago, the county where I live wanted regular lateral line type system, but reluctantly accepted this aerobic type. Now this county will not allow the old lateral line type, one can only install the aerobic type. Must be better I guess!!! Anyway a regular septic system is also a no leak tank system. The tanks hold the solids and liquids of course, bacteria works naturally to break down and consume the solids, the liquid rises to the top and exits to a secondary tank and then when it fills to a certain level the clear liquid exits out what is known as lateral lines that are placed in a series, certain number of running feet, of lines according to the absorption rate of the soil in the area that it is placed. The liquids do not leak through the walls of the tank as was implied before. The point that was apparently missed by all is that fiberglass impregnated with epoxy resins will not be affected by human waste, or corroding aluminum. If the fiberglass tank is built correctly it will be as strong if not stronger than a plastic tank. Remember that resins are a form of plastic, but in this case just reinforced with the fiberglass, kevlar, carbon fibre, boron or whatever your choice of cloths may be. There are the same comparisons not apples to oranges. If one knows the facts then the comparison can be made. You have to know what you are talking about to make any comparisons on any subject, this just happens to be a subject that I know a lot about. My company has made many products in years past from composite products including hi tech carbon fibre wing spars for aircraft. As was pointed out in the beginning, the opening was too small in the persons boat to get the large tank out of the boat for repair or replacement. I gave a couple of ideas for repairing the exhisting tank while it remained in the boat, so the person would not have to take the time to cut it out of the boat, then be able to retain his exhisting storage capacity and spend less than one hundred dollars for the fix. If someone wants to look around and find multiple plastic tanks that will fit through a small opening for installation and all of the lines and fittings to attach them together that is just fine and dandy, let them get after it. What is wrong with an optional way of doing things without the attacks??? Larry Howell
Septic is anaerobic by definition, Larry
The type of aerobic system you describe isn't a septic tank, it's a small treatment system, capable of recycling waste water. Even better than the type you describe are those that rely solely on filtration and plant life--no chlorinator. Where water for non-potable use--grounds watering, car washing, even toilet flushing, is in short supply, that type of system is gaining favor in office parks, golf courses etc where large amounts of waste water would otherwise just be lost. One of the first businesses to install one was Ben & Jerry's Ice Cream in VT (NH?)...it's all enclosed and absolutely beautiful...looks like a tropical rainforest in a greenhouse. A septic tank, otoh, is an anaerobic system that simply collects and stores waste, and drains off liquids into the soil. A boat holding tank is neither a septic tank nor a treatment system...it's just a storage tank, but subject to a LOT of stresses that systems on land are not. Boats take a terrible beating, and they flex...just coming about hard flexes every inch of a boat. Because of those stresses, fiberglass is problematic everywhere on a boat...blisters, cracks and crazes in gelcoat, delamination, are just a few of the problems. Stanchions, hardware and thru-hulls require re-bedding and re-sealing periodically to prevent not only water leaks, but water intrusion into the fiberglass. The archives here are filled with assorted fiberglass problems. Fiberglass tanks are subject to the same problems as the rest of the boat--tank fittings are no different than any other thru-hull, neither is epoxy or gelcoat any different in a tank than anywhere else on a boat. Poly tanks, otoh, are more shock resistant, more flexible (within limits!), and non-corrosive. That doesn't mean that poly is the best material for ALL applications, aboard and ashore...only that it's the best tank material for boats. As for glassing over a failing metal tank...metal doesn't dissolve, it disintegrates into rusty chunks and "slices" that would clog the plumbing and destroy a macerator. And with this, I have spoken my piece on this subject unless someone else has a question.
The type of aerobic system you describe isn't a septic tank, it's a small treatment system, capable of recycling waste water. Even better than the type you describe are those that rely solely on filtration and plant life--no chlorinator. Where water for non-potable use--grounds watering, car washing, even toilet flushing, is in short supply, that type of system is gaining favor in office parks, golf courses etc where large amounts of waste water would otherwise just be lost. One of the first businesses to install one was Ben & Jerry's Ice Cream in VT (NH?)...it's all enclosed and absolutely beautiful...looks like a tropical rainforest in a greenhouse. A septic tank, otoh, is an anaerobic system that simply collects and stores waste, and drains off liquids into the soil. A boat holding tank is neither a septic tank nor a treatment system...it's just a storage tank, but subject to a LOT of stresses that systems on land are not. Boats take a terrible beating, and they flex...just coming about hard flexes every inch of a boat. Because of those stresses, fiberglass is problematic everywhere on a boat...blisters, cracks and crazes in gelcoat, delamination, are just a few of the problems. Stanchions, hardware and thru-hulls require re-bedding and re-sealing periodically to prevent not only water leaks, but water intrusion into the fiberglass. The archives here are filled with assorted fiberglass problems. Fiberglass tanks are subject to the same problems as the rest of the boat--tank fittings are no different than any other thru-hull, neither is epoxy or gelcoat any different in a tank than anywhere else on a boat. Poly tanks, otoh, are more shock resistant, more flexible (within limits!), and non-corrosive. That doesn't mean that poly is the best material for ALL applications, aboard and ashore...only that it's the best tank material for boats. As for glassing over a failing metal tank...metal doesn't dissolve, it disintegrates into rusty chunks and "slices" that would clog the plumbing and destroy a macerator. And with this, I have spoken my piece on this subject unless someone else has a question.
Peggy Hall: Thank you
All I can say is that, Peggy, you are the best. If you EVER get to Santa Barbara, please let me buy you lunch, dinner, and a couple of bottles of wine. Even when I don't agree 100% with what you say, you make such a great argument that I learn from even trying to disagree. You don't get enough thanks for always providing well-reasoned information, based on reality and experience.
All I can say is that, Peggy, you are the best. If you EVER get to Santa Barbara, please let me buy you lunch, dinner, and a couple of bottles of wine. Even when I don't agree 100% with what you say, you make such a great argument that I learn from even trying to disagree. You don't get enough thanks for always providing well-reasoned information, based on reality and experience.
Are you coming to Pacific Sail Expo next month?
If so, I just might take you up on that offer--and thank you for the kind words! I'm arriving late Thursday afternoon and will be at the show Friday and Saturday. I'm scheduled to give two seminars--one at 10:30 am on Friday, the other at 4:30 pm on Saturday. The rest of the time I'll be in what they call the "authors' corner" selling copies of my book. I'd love to see some of you "left coasters" at my seminars...better yet, get together for lunch or dinner while I'm there!
If so, I just might take you up on that offer--and thank you for the kind words! I'm arriving late Thursday afternoon and will be at the show Friday and Saturday. I'm scheduled to give two seminars--one at 10:30 am on Friday, the other at 4:30 pm on Saturday. The rest of the time I'll be in what they call the "authors' corner" selling copies of my book. I'd love to see some of you "left coasters" at my seminars...better yet, get together for lunch or dinner while I'm there!
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