The holding tank of my 1997 Catalina 28 Mark II is permeated and smells bad. None of the hoses smells, and there is no bad odor in the head. We put only liquids in the toilet, no solids or even TP, but the previous owner may have done differently. Is there anything I can do to reduce the odor, like soak the holding tank for a month or all winter in vinegar & water or something else? I have put run lots of fresh water through it repeatedly for the past two summers, put the chemical treatments in it all the time, but nothing works. It is impossible to remove the tank without cutting it into little pieces, and then replacement would be daunting.
holding tank odor
- Thread starter Marianne14937
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Marianne, have you tried washing the outside with
bleach and treating the inside like a badly neglected swimming pool. Chlorine has a way of destroying organic material of all discriptions. protect yourself of course and remove anything that you wouldn't clean with bleach at home.
bleach and treating the inside like a badly neglected swimming pool. Chlorine has a way of destroying organic material of all discriptions. protect yourself of course and remove anything that you wouldn't clean with bleach at home.
It's probably not the tank
Marianne, I have a 1996 Catalina 28 MKII & went thru the same problem. I even replaced the holding tank (It's actually easy) but found it wasn't the problem & put the original back in. Apparantly the polyethlene tanks do not permeate. What I did find however is a small leak in the macerater pump. The liquid leaked out under the pump assy so you couldn't see it...but you sure could smell it. They sell rebuild kits at the major discount houses & it is not difficult to do. If you remove the four screws holding down the pump & lift it up you'll probably see the telltale stain under the lower end of the assy. Since the pump is below the top of the tank, liquid will lay in the pump as the holding tank fills up and aggravate the problem. In order to alleviate this somewhat I took the added measure of replacing the hose between the tank & the pump with PVC pipe which is also not permeable. At the end closest to the pump I installed a PVC ball valve which I keep closed until I am ready to pump out. This keeps the effleunt out of the macerator pump when it is not in use & so far seems to have eliminated the odors completely. Buy lots of rubber gloves & good luck!
Marianne, I have a 1996 Catalina 28 MKII & went thru the same problem. I even replaced the holding tank (It's actually easy) but found it wasn't the problem & put the original back in. Apparantly the polyethlene tanks do not permeate. What I did find however is a small leak in the macerater pump. The liquid leaked out under the pump assy so you couldn't see it...but you sure could smell it. They sell rebuild kits at the major discount houses & it is not difficult to do. If you remove the four screws holding down the pump & lift it up you'll probably see the telltale stain under the lower end of the assy. Since the pump is below the top of the tank, liquid will lay in the pump as the holding tank fills up and aggravate the problem. In order to alleviate this somewhat I took the added measure of replacing the hose between the tank & the pump with PVC pipe which is also not permeable. At the end closest to the pump I installed a PVC ball valve which I keep closed until I am ready to pump out. This keeps the effleunt out of the macerator pump when it is not in use & so far seems to have eliminated the odors completely. Buy lots of rubber gloves & good luck!
holding tank oder
agree, may not be holding tank. same problem last year, and i replaced all the hoses, still same problem. could get smell out and had a hard time with pump outs. this suggested a leak was evedent, but undetectable. it ended up that the hand pump for the discharge, off a y setup, had a bad gasket. this caused the oder and poor pump outs. replaced the whole hand pump and everything works great with no oders. we even had a holding tank filter, witch i no longer need. dutchess
agree, may not be holding tank. same problem last year, and i replaced all the hoses, still same problem. could get smell out and had a hard time with pump outs. this suggested a leak was evedent, but undetectable. it ended up that the hand pump for the discharge, off a y setup, had a bad gasket. this caused the oder and poor pump outs. replaced the whole hand pump and everything works great with no oders. we even had a holding tank filter, witch i no longer need. dutchess
Vent & chemically treat it.
Marianne: The older Catalina's usually had the holding tanks vented thru a stanchion. If this is the case on yours, then I would suggest the you vent it with a thru hull fitting to ensure that you are getting a proper volume of fresh air into your tank. Depending on the type of chemicals you are using, it can also cause a problem with improper treatment of the waste. Odorlos is an excellent treatment for this purpose. Before you do anything else I would suggest using this treatment and then move on with the vent if that is a problem. Be sure to check for any possible leaks. If you have a Jabsco, check the pump and entire toilet for cracks. These toilets are not worth repairing and it is a good time to get a good unit if this is the problem. When you leave your boat flush the toilet with fresh water. There is always a chance that you are sucking up critters in your raw water intake and they are dying in your raw water intake line. These critters are also trapped in the intake line and the rim of the bowl too (that is another problem). You just need to work on it and you will find the problem, but the tank is probably the last thing to worry about.
Marianne: The older Catalina's usually had the holding tanks vented thru a stanchion. If this is the case on yours, then I would suggest the you vent it with a thru hull fitting to ensure that you are getting a proper volume of fresh air into your tank. Depending on the type of chemicals you are using, it can also cause a problem with improper treatment of the waste. Odorlos is an excellent treatment for this purpose. Before you do anything else I would suggest using this treatment and then move on with the vent if that is a problem. Be sure to check for any possible leaks. If you have a Jabsco, check the pump and entire toilet for cracks. These toilets are not worth repairing and it is a good time to get a good unit if this is the problem. When you leave your boat flush the toilet with fresh water. There is always a chance that you are sucking up critters in your raw water intake and they are dying in your raw water intake line. These critters are also trapped in the intake line and the rim of the bowl too (that is another problem). You just need to work on it and you will find the problem, but the tank is probably the last thing to worry about.
Your tank has not permeated...
Ronco Plastics supplies tanks to Catalina...I know their quality, and their tank walls are too thick to permeate. Alex seems to have the most likely explanation for your odor...although I'm not sure why he replaced hose with hard pipe AND put a shutoff valve in the line to the macerator...'cuz the valve will keep waste from standing in the line to macerator in addition to closing off the flow of waste from the tank service the macerator or replace the impeller. Duchess, you could have saved yourselves a lot of work and money if you'd tested your hoses for permeation before you decided to replace 'em. Y'all might want to check out the link below...it could save you a lot more "headaches" AND $$!
Ronco Plastics supplies tanks to Catalina...I know their quality, and their tank walls are too thick to permeate. Alex seems to have the most likely explanation for your odor...although I'm not sure why he replaced hose with hard pipe AND put a shutoff valve in the line to the macerator...'cuz the valve will keep waste from standing in the line to macerator in addition to closing off the flow of waste from the tank service the macerator or replace the impeller. Duchess, you could have saved yourselves a lot of work and money if you'd tested your hoses for permeation before you decided to replace 'em. Y'all might want to check out the link below...it could save you a lot more "headaches" AND $$!
One more thing...
Unless it's leaking, the holding tank is rarely if ever the source of odor INSIDE the boat...'cuz odor from inside the tank has only one place to go: out the tank vent. So trying to get rid of odor INSIDE the boat by pumping out, rinsing out and/or treating the tank contents is just chasing your tail. I get a lot of calls every year from people who've replaced their entire sanitation system trying to get rid of what they thought was "head" or holding tank odor, when all they really needed to do was clean their bilges and sumps...'cuz a wet dirty bilge or sump is a primordial soup that can make a whole boat smell like a swamp or even a sewer. So try cleaning your bilges and sumps----really CLEAN 'em, and thoroughly flush ALL the dirty water out for a change instead of just dumping in more bilge cleaner and/or bleach, sloshing it around a bit and calling it done. If nothing else, getting rid of bilge and sump odor will make it easier to pinpoint the source of any other odors.
Unless it's leaking, the holding tank is rarely if ever the source of odor INSIDE the boat...'cuz odor from inside the tank has only one place to go: out the tank vent. So trying to get rid of odor INSIDE the boat by pumping out, rinsing out and/or treating the tank contents is just chasing your tail. I get a lot of calls every year from people who've replaced their entire sanitation system trying to get rid of what they thought was "head" or holding tank odor, when all they really needed to do was clean their bilges and sumps...'cuz a wet dirty bilge or sump is a primordial soup that can make a whole boat smell like a swamp or even a sewer. So try cleaning your bilges and sumps----really CLEAN 'em, and thoroughly flush ALL the dirty water out for a change instead of just dumping in more bilge cleaner and/or bleach, sloshing it around a bit and calling it done. If nothing else, getting rid of bilge and sump odor will make it easier to pinpoint the source of any other odors.
replacement of holding tank
How did you replace the holding tank? Actually, how did you get the old one out? I would like to look for a possible leak underneath.
How did you replace the holding tank? Actually, how did you get the old one out? I would like to look for a possible leak underneath.
Bleach?
I was told never to put anything with any amount of bleach down the head as it causes a phosphorous effect and starts to smell like rotten eggs when it interacts with the other chemicals. Yeah? Nay?
I was told never to put anything with any amount of bleach down the head as it causes a phosphorous effect and starts to smell like rotten eggs when it interacts with the other chemicals. Yeah? Nay?
Removing the holding tank
Presuming your setup is the same as mine. You have to remove the holding tank while the boat is on the hard. First, disconnect the hose between the macerator pump and the tank (you might find it easier to cut the hose as you'll probably want to replace it anyway..It is the one most likely to permeate). Remove the wood brace at the aft end of the tank by removing the four screws. Next remove the four screws in the thru hull valve allowing the valve assembly to come off. Then remove the four screws holding down the macerator pump and slide it & the attached hoses aft. Remove the vent hose from the tank. Now you can slide the tank aft & up, then out. That's it..Should not take a full hour to do the whole thing.
Presuming your setup is the same as mine. You have to remove the holding tank while the boat is on the hard. First, disconnect the hose between the macerator pump and the tank (you might find it easier to cut the hose as you'll probably want to replace it anyway..It is the one most likely to permeate). Remove the wood brace at the aft end of the tank by removing the four screws. Next remove the four screws in the thru hull valve allowing the valve assembly to come off. Then remove the four screws holding down the macerator pump and slide it & the attached hoses aft. Remove the vent hose from the tank. Now you can slide the tank aft & up, then out. That's it..Should not take a full hour to do the whole thing.
Valve
It was probably overkill but as waste was standing in the macerator pump and the hose connecting it to the tank (both of which were below the top of the tank)it seemed like a good idea to add the hard pipe & valve so this situation could be avoided. The old hose had also permeated. Now, waste is kept from the macerator pump & short piece of connecting flexible hose until I am ready to pump out. Then I open the valve to pump out via pump or deck fitting. As a side benefit this does allow service to the macerator pump without having to empty the tank.
It was probably overkill but as waste was standing in the macerator pump and the hose connecting it to the tank (both of which were below the top of the tank)it seemed like a good idea to add the hard pipe & valve so this situation could be avoided. The old hose had also permeated. Now, waste is kept from the macerator pump & short piece of connecting flexible hose until I am ready to pump out. Then I open the valve to pump out via pump or deck fitting. As a side benefit this does allow service to the macerator pump without having to empty the tank.
Bob, I have no idea who told you that
but please ask that person to explain how adding sodium hypochorite to the holding tank can create a "phosphorous effect" and what that means. The only source of phosphorus that might exist would come from some detergents. If that person has found a means to make phosphorus he/she could become wealthy with this technology. "Rotten eggs" smell comes from hydrogen sulfide. Burning phosphorus smells like matches.
but please ask that person to explain how adding sodium hypochorite to the holding tank can create a "phosphorous effect" and what that means. The only source of phosphorus that might exist would come from some detergents. If that person has found a means to make phosphorus he/she could become wealthy with this technology. "Rotten eggs" smell comes from hydrogen sulfide. Burning phosphorus smells like matches.
Bleach definitely a no-no...
But not for the reasons Bob described. Bleach/chlorine is highly destructive to the rubber parts in toilets and also breaks hose resistance to odor permeation. So will household bowl cleaners, Pine Sol, Lysol and all other household chemical cleaning products, along with any petroleum products. Urine has a high ammonia content...and everyone know that cholorine and ammonia create a lethal gas. White vinegar is recomended to dissolve/prevent sea water mineral buildup...what many people don't know is that any bleach or product containing bleach combined with vinegar will produce a gas that's even more lethal than the ammonium chloride gas created when chlorine and ammonia are combined. Any "rotten egg" odor is hydrogen sulfide and/or sulfer dioxide, which are created when any organic material breaks down anaerobically (without oxygen) and can occur in a wet dity bilge or sump or a holding tank that's inadequately ventilated. For more detailed information on this subject, check out the link below.
But not for the reasons Bob described. Bleach/chlorine is highly destructive to the rubber parts in toilets and also breaks hose resistance to odor permeation. So will household bowl cleaners, Pine Sol, Lysol and all other household chemical cleaning products, along with any petroleum products. Urine has a high ammonia content...and everyone know that cholorine and ammonia create a lethal gas. White vinegar is recomended to dissolve/prevent sea water mineral buildup...what many people don't know is that any bleach or product containing bleach combined with vinegar will produce a gas that's even more lethal than the ammonium chloride gas created when chlorine and ammonia are combined. Any "rotten egg" odor is hydrogen sulfide and/or sulfer dioxide, which are created when any organic material breaks down anaerobically (without oxygen) and can occur in a wet dity bilge or sump or a holding tank that's inadequately ventilated. For more detailed information on this subject, check out the link below.
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