Help - Secondary Mascerator and tank dumping to the ocean not working

[SVFreedom]

The secondary macerator is working but the tank is not dumping through the through hull, I assume a blockage.
Through hull is open, macerator is working
We are in the Bahamas so access is extremely limited.
Any suggestions to unclog the hose from the tank to the secondary macerator?
I put in some toilet treatment (The granules we always use) in hopes it will liquify whatever is in there, I assume paper?
The main macerator on the head is working so, strange we would have a blockage.

Could it also be the vacuum line from the tank to the outside air?

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

The more likely problem isn’t a blockage but rather the macerator isn’t pumping. It may make noise when energized but that doesn’t confirm the pump working.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

The more likely problem isn’t a blockage but rather the macerator isn’t pumping.

Or even worse ................ the stem of the thru-hull valve may have snapped and the valve is sitting in the closed position.

Do some crude measurements on how far a straightened coat hanger hanger should penetrate the thru-hull from the outside of the hull.

We are in the Bahamas so access is extremely limited.

If it stops well short of what you expect, the valve ball is still in the closed position. Shouldn't be too much of a problem in those lovely warm Bahamian waters.

Could it also be the vacuum line from the tank to the outside air?

Does the tank (if it's plastic) look like the top is pressed in ? Maybe disconnect the vent hose and see if you get a vacuum pulling air in when the thru-hull macerator pump runs ?

BTW, it's 50° F here and raining like hell. For a free air ticket to your location and room and board when I get there, I would be more than pleased to assist you to solve the problem free gratis.

 

[SVFreedom]

Or even worse ................ the stem of the thru-hull valve may have snapped and the valve is sitting in the closed position.

Do some crude measurements on how far a straightened coat hanger hanger should penetrate the thru-hull from the outside of the hull.

If it stops well short of what you expect, the valve ball is still in the closed position. Shouldn't be too much of a problem in those lovely warm Bahamian waters.

Does the tank (if it's plastic) look like the top is pressed in ? Maybe disconnect the vent hose and see if you get a vacuum pulling air in when the thru-hull macerator pump runs ?

BTW, it's 50° F here and raining like hell. For a free air ticket to your location and room and board when I get there, I would be more than pleased to assist you to solve the problem free gratis.

Thanks, Brand new through hulls this year, unlikely they are broke, diving it the next couple of days will not work, we have been seeing 46kt & 49kt winds over the past few days while at anchor so the bay is a bit choppy today...
Tank does not expand or suck in thankfully
The macerator is making noise, not sure how to check if it is actually pumping.
I added some enzymes and waited a couple of hours, tried again, I do get air coming out the bottom now but not like I am used to. We have been getting wicked storms, could be I am just not hearing it properly but doubt it..

 

[danooxnard]

Sounds like the macerater impeller may be bad. The motor may be turning and making noise but the impeller is worn out.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

I added some enzymes and waited a couple of hours, tried again, I do get air coming out the bottom now but not like I am used to.

Could you please elaborate on this ? Not clear where you are seeing the air and where the air is coming from.

 

[SVFreedom]

Could you please elaborate on this ? Not clear where you are seeing the air and where the air is coming from.

WHen you are dumping the tanks, after the tank is empty, the macerator still pushes air out, you can hear the air bubbling on the hull and how I know it is empty, my gauge is not working.

 

[SVFreedom]

Sounds like the macerater impeller may be bad. The motor may be turning and making noise but the impeller is worn out.

I have a spare, terrible job to do though... LOL

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

Sounds like the macerater impeller may be bad. The motor may be turning and making noise but the impeller is worn out.

I'm afraid this is getting closer to the cause of the problem. How old is the macerator in question ?

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

I have a spare, terrible job to do though... LOL

Oh !

We carry a spare pump just for the possible eventuality of this disaster. Bully for us.

The reason I mention this is that this "emergency pump" is identical to our manual bilge pump. Any chance you can remove your hand bilge pump and and adapt it to your sewage tank pump out fitting assuming you have the hoses and can make a deck adapter with electrical tape. At least you'll get a chance to pump sea water through the holding tank to clean it out. This is assuming that you are stuck at anchor for who knows how long. If things calm down soon, try to head for a pump out station to at least get things cleaned out before you start on the replacement.

 

[SVFreedom]

I'm afraid this is getting closer to the cause of the problem. How old is the macerator in question ?

Probably 3 or 4 years but we cruise 6-8 months a year in the Bahamas so it gets used.

 

[SVFreedom]

Oh !

We carry a spare pump just for the possible eventuality of this disaster. Bully for us.

The reason I mention this is that this "emergency pump" is identical to our manual bilge pump. Any chance you can remove your hand bilge pump and and adapt it to your sewage tank pump out fitting assuming you have the hoses and can make a deck adapter with electrical tape. At least you'll get a chance to pump sea water through the holding tank to clean it out. This is assuming that you are stuck at anchor for who knows how long. If things calm down soon, try to head for a pump out station to at least get things cleaned out before you start on the replacement.

Maybe two or three pump stations in all of the Bahamas, lol
On my list this year was to build an external pump for if this happens but looks like I am season too late.. LOL
Ill try again in a day or so when I can hear things better (And see if it is actually dumping outside), if it is not, Ill close off the valves to the tank and swap the pump, least favorite boat chores is dealing with the sanitation system.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

WHen you are dumping the tanks, after the tank is empty, the macerator still pushes air out, you can hear the air bubbling on the hull and how I know it is empty, my gauge is not working.

Ah good. Back to the pump again. You don't want to remove the pump if the pump is not the problem.

Probably 3 or 4 years but we cruise 6-8 months a year in the Bahamas so it gets used.

Not an old pump. I'd say that "not" using the pump is usually what causes it to seize. We know it's not seized (no breaker failure).

How do you know for sure the pump is not discharging if you still get the air bubbles when the tank is empty ? Maybe I missed something as the list of posts gets longer. Is the tank poly and you can see the level or ........................... ?

Really going out on a limb here but maybe all the rocking and rolling over the last few days has dislodged crud fom teh bottom of the tank and laid it down over the outlet to the hose which supplies the macerator pump.

least favorite boat chores is dealing with the sanitation system.

I know what you mean. I much prefer sitting at the top of the mast.

 

[SVFreedom]

Ah good. Back to the pump again. You don't want to remove the pump if the pump is not the problem.
Agree


Not an old pump. I'd say that "not" using the pump is usually what causes it to seize. We know it's not seized (no breaker failure).

Agree
How do you know for sure the pump is not discharging if you still get the air bubbles when the tank is empty ? Maybe I missed something as the list of posts gets longer. Is the tank poly and you can see the level or ........................... ?
I may not have heard it when I dumped it, the seas and wind was blowing, try again in two days with some stuff in there and see what happens.

Poly tank but cant see levels, it is tightly packed in. I could open a cap (Maybe) but risk damaging it, so, I hesitate

Really going out on a limb here but maybe all the rocking and rolling over the last few days has dislodged crud fom teh bottom of the tank and laid it down over the outlet to the hose which supplies the macerator pump.
Potentially but we have been sailing big seas this season, actually blew the Auto Pilot clutch from the huge weather helms

I know what you mean. I much prefer sitting at the top of the mast.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

Poly tank but cant see levels, it is tightly packed in. I could open a cap (Maybe) but risk damaging it, so, I hesitate.

I know what you mean. Mine is openly exposed and it's still a bugger to determine even from brand new. A focused flashlight through the tank top, in the dark, and maybe you can imagine you can see the level sloshing around, if you've had a few drinks. Other than that, hopeless.

Out of curiosity, what is the "cap you could open" to check the level ?

Anyways, I think it's time to invest in an externally mounted level sensor which will eliminate future problems with sensing the tank level.

At this point, I think it worth the wait until you can do some underwater observations for air discharge from the thru-hull and make a little more sense in calmer waters.

Please keep us updated and who knows, some new idea may drop down out of the sky

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

One last MAYBE and I do mean maybe.

With the holding tank known to contain some liquid (maybe 1/4 full), and perhaps in somewhat calmer water, have someone turn on the thu-hull macerator while you're holding your hand over the holding tank vent. See if you can feel a slight vacuum forming after a minute or so.

Be careful and don't implode the tank. If you've got enough bodies, maybe someone can watch the tank top for deformation and sound the alarm if you get a vacuum as well as what you feel.

 

[SVFreedom]

Poly tank but cant see levels, it is tightly packed in. I could open a cap (Maybe) but risk damaging it, so, I hesitate.

I know what you mean. Mine is openly exposed and it's still a bugger to determine even from brand new. A focused flashlight through the tank top, in the dark, and maybe you can imagine you can see the level sloshing around, if you've had a few drinks. Other than that, hopeless.

View attachment 225421

Out of curiosity, what is the "cap you could open" to check the level ?

Anyways, I think it's time to invest in an externally mounted level sensor which will eliminate future problems with sensing the tank level.

At this point, I think it worth the wait until you can do some underwater observations for air discharge from the thru-hull and make a little more sense in calmer waters.

Please keep us updated and who knows, some new idea may drop down out of the sky

That is beautiful, you can see the sides.
I do have an externally mounted gauge, need to install it, never makes
The cap is a screw open, I assume an inspection cap. It is glued in with something, very tough to open.
no judgement on the picture, I know it needs to be cleaned, its been a year or more.. I usually do it annually, this year we were having too much fun...

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

I do have an externally mounted gauge, need to install it, never makes

I find those things never read too accurately when still in their original packaging .

The cap is a screw open, I assume an inspection cap. It is glued in with something, very tough to open.

Most likely pipe dope for sealing the threads. If it's the same junk Hunter used on my holding tank back in 1998, it eventually turns into a hardened powder which is very difficult to remove on small threaded fittings. A stick of dynamite may be required on larger diameter fittings.

no judgement on the picture, I know it needs to be cleaned, its been a year or more..

No problems I can see with the cleanliness of the exterior of the holding tank. I've seen pictures of holding tanks on this site which I would venture to say are dirtier on the outside than the inside.

If you're completely bored with nothing better to do, try the vacuum idea when the weather softens a bit and let us know.

I remember a number of years ago when two of us were stuck for three days in a bay up our northern coast with no way to get anywhere as the condition were so rough. Didn't know if we still had the dinghy half the time. Thought I'd die of either boredom or knife wounds at the end of three days. But that too came to pass.

At least I knew the head worked. Very small consolation, however.

 

[SVFreedom]

I find those things never read too accurately when still in their original packaging .



Most likely pipe dope for sealing the threads. If it's the same junk Hunter used on my holding tank back in 1998, it eventually turns into a hardened powder which is very difficult to remove on small threaded fittings. A stick of dynamite may be required on larger diameter fittings.



No problems I can see with the cleanliness of the exterior of the holding tank. I've seen pictures of holding tanks on this site which I would venture to say are dirtier on the outside than the inside.

If you're completely bored with nothing better to do, try the vacuum idea when the weather softens a bit and let us know.

I remember a number of years ago when two of us were stuck for three days in a bay up our northern coast with no way to get anywhere as the condition were so rough. Didn't know if we still had the dinghy half the time. Thought I'd die of either boredom or knife wounds at the end of three days. But that too came to pass.

At least I knew the head worked. Very small consolation, however.

LOL. I dont mind being stuck on the boat, we are married 33 years and actually like one another. Starlink also helps for communications

Been in the Bahamas 5 months this year, barely a rain day, a week of this is fine, the islands need it.
Tomorrow it starts to clear up, the next day winds turn easy and back to normal, hopefully no more 59kt winds...
Since we have been here for a few days, I will need to check for sharks, they hide underneath and dont like surprises.

Ill try to dump the system again in two days to see what happens, Ill also open the inspection port (Or try), more afraid if the port breaks off)

Thanks for walking through it all, when your out here, sometimes an extra set of eyes helps.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

Ill also open the inspection port (Or try), more afraid if the port breaks off)

Maybe hold off on that 'til you're back home with lots of supply backup. Actually, there's really no need to remove other than to look inside and possible cleanup of crud.

IF you get so bored you find yourself just HAVING to remove the plug, try heating the plug and tank, near the plug, with a hair dryer until both are hot to the touch. Attack it gently and it may unscrew a lot easier than when cold.

Good luck .