headsail furler problem

[John]

I have a Schaeffer headsail furler which appears, from their web site, to be the CF-700 model. Over a period of time, it was becoming increasingly difficult to unfurl the sail, and when I took the furler apart the lower drum was pretty stiff, so I replaced it with a new one. Before I was able to try it out, I had the mast pulled and all the standing rigging replaced. Today I went to reinstall the line on the furler, in preparation to reinstalling the head sail. However, I found that the furler wouldn't turn, with or withotu the line on the lower drum. This was before the sail was installed. I looked up the mast and it doesn't appear that the halyard is wrapped round the furler, but I'll be sure on that tomorrow.

So my suspicion is that something is wrong at the top end of this furler. Tomorrow I'm planning to go up the mast to see if I can figure out what it is.

I'm thinking that maybe whatever the problem is is what was also causing it to be very stiff in unfurling the sail before. Or maybe when I reinstalled the head stay I did something wrong. In any case, does anybody have any suggestions as to what I should be looking for?

Thanks.

 

[Stu Jackson]

...I had the mast pulled and all the standing rigging replaced. Today I went to reinstall the line on the furler, in preparation to reinstalling the head sail.

Have you considered going back to the guys who installed it and telling them they might have made an error?

 

[sailingdog]

It may also be that you had a halyard wrap previously and the top of the furler is damaged. You really need to get a look at what is going on at the halyard swivel. However, if that is the case and these guys didn't spot it when they were replacing the forestay, I'd have serious doubts about the quality of their work.

 

[John]

They rebuilt the head stay, but I installed it onto the mast, so I think it's questionable who would be at fault. If the top swivel is damaged, how can I tell, other than that it just doesn't swivel?

 

[John]

follow-up

I couldn't see anything wrong from the top of the mast. To tell the truth, I never really paid much attention to exactly how a roller furler functions, but from what I can see, the entire foil turns, right? In the case of this model, the furler sits on a drum on the bottom and rotates around this. I was able to disconnect the foil from this drum, but the foil still won't turn beyond a quarter turn in either direction. I squirted som PB Blaster into it and will check tomorrow, but I doubt it will help.

Are all furlers more or less constructed the same? Is there some sort of assembly with bearings at the bottom of the foil? I am a total newbie when it comes to this, so I'm not even sure that I'm using the right terminology. I'm attaching two photos so you can see what I'm talking about. It's this part, just above the threaded rod which screws into the top of the turnbuckle that seems to be stuck.

 

[rpwillia]

Couple of questions

John, Most furlers are the same. Normally most of the assembly rotates around the forestay. I suspect your problem is most likely at the bottom. If the top had a problem it could help cause the jam, but since it is more lightly loaded I would think that is highly unlikely. Also the mechanical part on the headstay is much simpler and probably pretty hard to get the install wrong. I would read the manual with particular emphasis to the lower portion. It could be as simple as where you are clamping the lower drum or a piece (like a cotter pin) is out of place. Ray

 

[Ron20324]

Maybe a kink in the forestay rubbing on the inside of the foil?

 

[John]

how it developed

The furler was getting progressively stiffer and stiffer over several months. I talked with Schaeffer and they suggested that the lower drum needed replacing. I ordered a new one, but before I installed it I had to pull the mast, at which time I also replaced all the standing rigging. It's possible that something was done wrong in reinstalling the head stay, but my suspicion is that whatever is wrong is related to the earlier problem. In other words, the cause of the earlier problem just got worse.

In the photo, as you see, the part that links the foil to the lower drum is removed, yet the foil still won't rotate. The drum itself rotates freely. From what I can see in the owner's manual, there are no bearings inside the foil at the bottom. I'm thinking what I might have to do is remove the headstay at the bottom and slide the foil all the way off to see if there is some sort of obstruction or kink. Does that sound right?

 

[Stu Jackson]

John, hope things are getting better for you, but

try this: http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,4767.0.html

Ray knows his stuff and keeps his boat in pristine shape.

Is your halyard restrainer working properly?

 

[higgs]

Have hyou carefully inspected the foil along the its length? If it is bent or dented it may not be able to rotate around the forestay.

 

[sailingdog]

Unfortunately, yes, it does sound like you're going to have to slide the foil off to find out what is going on. If the foil is corroding on the inside, which can happen, it could be causing the binding...but more likely it is something to do with the headstay.

In the photo, as you see, the part that links the foil to the lower drum is removed, yet the foil still won't rotate. The drum itself rotates freely. From what I can see in the owner's manual, there are no bearings inside the foil at the bottom. I'm thinking what I might have to do is remove the headstay at the bottom and slide the foil all the way off to see if there is some sort of obstruction or kink. Does that sound right?

 

[Capt. Kermie]

Funny, from the pictures it does not even remotely resemble a Schaefer Snapfurl CF700. I just installed a brand new one last spring. For starters, the top swivel piece works completely and totaly independent of the rest of the system, it is definitely beyond any shadow of any doubt not affecting the the operation of the drum while there is no sail connected. You should be able to lower the swivel down to the drum via the jib halyard and spin it around a thousand times without the drum moving so much as a hair. They work independantly of each other. The 25' of PVC foil should be connected to the drum as it is supposed to turn with the drum around the forestay while the forestay remains steadfast. There are bearings in both the bottom and top plate of the drum so that it can spin freely, check to see that all dirt and crud is washed out of the bearings or else that could be what is locking up the drum. Have you got the furling line wrapped around the drum? Is it wrapped around the drum enough times to ravel or unravel the sail? The sail is not going to wrap around the foil if the furling line isn't spinning the the drum. You must start out by winding the furling line around the drum enough times to compensate for the length of the sail foot so that when you pull on the furling line it wraps the sail. When you disconnect the foil from the drum can you spin the foil around the forestay? Can you spin the drum? If you can spin these two components independantly of each other then neither one is the problem. If you can spin the top swivel by itself it is also not the problem. Sometimes when the sail is attached and raised the halyard tends to wrap around the sail and stop everyting from turning this can happen without the sail too if the swivel does not turn independantly from the foil and drum. It takes a halyard restrainer to hold the halyard and swivel still so that they do not wrap around the sail or foil. Try spinning each component seperately to see if they are funtioning, if so attache the drum and foil and turn it agin to make sure those two pices connected spin together. Then see that the top swivel turns by itself, if so hoist the halyard and swivel and test the system without the sail, it should function unless the halyard starts wrapping around the foil and stops it in which case you need a halyard restrainer. Something just doesn't sound right, if you are doing the process correctly you should be able to trouble shoot the problem easily.

 

[John]

Kermie is right; it's not the 700. I talked with Schaeffer this morning and it's the 2100. The problem was that the stop pin screw was missing, allowing the foil to drop down too far. Part of the reason I misidentified the model was that it is not on the furler so I tried to figure it out myself. Now, looking at the schematic for the 2100 vs. the 700 I can see where the problem lies. Schaeffer, by the way, was very helpful when I talked with them.

 

[Barnacle Bill]

Glad to read you found your problem, but just for informational purposes, usually when a furler fails to properly unfurl or furl the problem is halyard wrap. This is when the angle of the halyard to the upper swivel from the mast is so wide that the halyard wraps around the forestay jamming it all up. To prevent this one installs a halyard retainer near the top of the mast. The jib halyard then threads through this retainer so that it chokes the angle of the halyard down to a tighter angle so that it cannot wrap around the forestay. It is a simple fix and can be done from a bos'n chair.
If that is not the problem, then look aloft to see that the swivel is not being interfered with from some other halyards, such as a spinnaker halyard which might get in the way as she heads downward from the masthead. Carry on.