Okay folks, I need a little advise here. Last weekend, on a family sailing trip we managed to produce a serious leak in the head plumbing. I believe it was due to over pressure and fill of the tank. It made for a pretty unpleasant end to the trip and lots of cleaning .My wife used the phrase "piss on fire" to describe the smell. After we pumped out most of the tank and got the mess cleaned up the leak stopped. (I was suprised to find out that we only have a 14gal holding tank on our '89 L37) My question is this: is it likely in an overfill situation for the vent to blow? Or could we have cracked the tank or blown some other fitting?? I am going down to the boat this weekend to try to find and fix the problem (while bathing in sewage of course..)..
- Status
- Not open for further replies.
Obvious that you need to check all your hoses...
Stephen: It is obvious that you need to check all your plumbing, hoses, fitting etc. What I will tell you is the fact that we have overfilled our tank on occasion. What would normally happen is the liquids would be pumped out the vent. The solids tend to stay on the bottom of the tank. IF, I say IF you had a plugged vent hose, you can probably figure out what could/would happen. There is no place for the "STUFF" to go and the pressure could cause a break in a hose/fitting etc. As far as you cleanup goes, I would suggest a LOT of soap and water with some bleach to disenfect. Be sure to flush out the liner with a lot of water. If you have removable floor board, I would remove them too. Good luck, let us know what you find (don't need details <g>).
Stephen: It is obvious that you need to check all your plumbing, hoses, fitting etc. What I will tell you is the fact that we have overfilled our tank on occasion. What would normally happen is the liquids would be pumped out the vent. The solids tend to stay on the bottom of the tank. IF, I say IF you had a plugged vent hose, you can probably figure out what could/would happen. There is no place for the "STUFF" to go and the pressure could cause a break in a hose/fitting etc. As far as you cleanup goes, I would suggest a LOT of soap and water with some bleach to disenfect. Be sure to flush out the liner with a lot of water. If you have removable floor board, I would remove them too. Good luck, let us know what you find (don't need details <g>).
P
Peggie Hall/Head Mistress
Does the tank have an inspection port?
When tanks are overfilled, especially if the vent is blocked, they will leak out the inspection port. That you were only able to pump out "most of the tank" is a pretty good indication that your vent IS blocked. Don't try to pump out your tank again until you're sure the vent is open--an onboard macerator isn't strong enough to crack a tank, but a pumpout can....check at the thru-hull first...that's where 99% of vent blockages occur. Clean up the mess with plenty of detergent and water. Do NOT use bleach...it won't get rid of the odor permanently. Stop by a WM or B/US and pick up a bottle of Raritan K.O. holding tank treatmnet and a trigger sprayer. K.O. is a live bacteria product...the bacteria in it "eat" the odor-causing spores. After you've gotten the mess cleaned up and the area thoroughly rinsed and reasonably dry again...LIBERALLY spray K.O. everywhere, making sure to get under and behind anything. Don't rinse, just let it dry...leaving all the hatches and lockers open so that plenty of fresh air can circulate for 24 hours. Even put a fan in the boat to increase fresh air circulation. If that doesn't get rid of all the odor, you haven't found all the spill yet. To prevent future problems, read the articles in the Head Mistress forum reference library. And as soon as I find the time to dust it off, the following (which was a reply to someone on another site) will be added to library: A tank cannot BE emptied under vacuum. Unless air can be pulled in through the vent to replace the waste (or anything else in ANY container) being pulled out, a vacuum is created in which nothing more can be removed--but in which the suction CAN crack the tank. A blocked vent also prevents the air displaced by incoming contents from escaping, which results in a pressurized tank. This can have disastrous consequences--anything from blown out fittings to a cracked tank to a sewage geyser when the pumpout fitting cap is removed to a backup in the toilet. Follow these "rules" to prevent the above problems: 1. check your vent through-hull regularly...blast it out with a hose every time you wash the boat; 2. Never turn pumpout operation over to a dockhand and walk away. Stay there and watch to make certain that the tank is being completely pumped out. Terminate pumpout/dumping at sea immediately if waste stops flowing before the tank is empty. Do not try to pump out or dump the tank again until the vent has been cleared. 3 Stop flushing and cease using the toilet when you feel any backpressure or see any waste backing up into the toilet. 4. The vent is NOT an overflow. Only air should ever pass through it. Accidents do happen, though, and they can result in a clogged vent. Cease using the toilet immediately if you see waste coming out the vent and and get to a pumpout as soon as possible so that waste doesn't have time to dry and harden in the vent hose. Flush it out VERY thoroughly with clean water to remove any bits of waste in it. To prevent overflows out the vent, install a gauge and pay attention to it.
When tanks are overfilled, especially if the vent is blocked, they will leak out the inspection port. That you were only able to pump out "most of the tank" is a pretty good indication that your vent IS blocked. Don't try to pump out your tank again until you're sure the vent is open--an onboard macerator isn't strong enough to crack a tank, but a pumpout can....check at the thru-hull first...that's where 99% of vent blockages occur. Clean up the mess with plenty of detergent and water. Do NOT use bleach...it won't get rid of the odor permanently. Stop by a WM or B/US and pick up a bottle of Raritan K.O. holding tank treatmnet and a trigger sprayer. K.O. is a live bacteria product...the bacteria in it "eat" the odor-causing spores. After you've gotten the mess cleaned up and the area thoroughly rinsed and reasonably dry again...LIBERALLY spray K.O. everywhere, making sure to get under and behind anything. Don't rinse, just let it dry...leaving all the hatches and lockers open so that plenty of fresh air can circulate for 24 hours. Even put a fan in the boat to increase fresh air circulation. If that doesn't get rid of all the odor, you haven't found all the spill yet. To prevent future problems, read the articles in the Head Mistress forum reference library. And as soon as I find the time to dust it off, the following (which was a reply to someone on another site) will be added to library: A tank cannot BE emptied under vacuum. Unless air can be pulled in through the vent to replace the waste (or anything else in ANY container) being pulled out, a vacuum is created in which nothing more can be removed--but in which the suction CAN crack the tank. A blocked vent also prevents the air displaced by incoming contents from escaping, which results in a pressurized tank. This can have disastrous consequences--anything from blown out fittings to a cracked tank to a sewage geyser when the pumpout fitting cap is removed to a backup in the toilet. Follow these "rules" to prevent the above problems: 1. check your vent through-hull regularly...blast it out with a hose every time you wash the boat; 2. Never turn pumpout operation over to a dockhand and walk away. Stay there and watch to make certain that the tank is being completely pumped out. Terminate pumpout/dumping at sea immediately if waste stops flowing before the tank is empty. Do not try to pump out or dump the tank again until the vent has been cleared. 3 Stop flushing and cease using the toilet when you feel any backpressure or see any waste backing up into the toilet. 4. The vent is NOT an overflow. Only air should ever pass through it. Accidents do happen, though, and they can result in a clogged vent. Cease using the toilet immediately if you see waste coming out the vent and and get to a pumpout as soon as possible so that waste doesn't have time to dry and harden in the vent hose. Flush it out VERY thoroughly with clean water to remove any bits of waste in it. To prevent overflows out the vent, install a gauge and pay attention to it.
S
Stephen Dawes
Thanks / Jabsco Y-Valve?
Thanks for the reply Peggie and Steve. Indeed, the vent line was clogged and the tank contents were going nowhere. I replaced the line and fittings ASAP. Now, another question. Our newly installed (<6mo) Jabsco y-valve is seeping at each of the discharge ports. The valve is the type with the rotatable fittings (pn#45490-0000). Is this unusual for this design to leak and could the leak have been caused by the overfill/over-pressure situation? Of course the leak prevented a good vacuum and alas no pumpout.....I would like to replace the value with the same type if possible to avoid having to re-run all the hoses. Any thoughts??...
Thanks for the reply Peggie and Steve. Indeed, the vent line was clogged and the tank contents were going nowhere. I replaced the line and fittings ASAP. Now, another question. Our newly installed (<6mo) Jabsco y-valve is seeping at each of the discharge ports. The valve is the type with the rotatable fittings (pn#45490-0000). Is this unusual for this design to leak and could the leak have been caused by the overfill/over-pressure situation? Of course the leak prevented a good vacuum and alas no pumpout.....I would like to replace the value with the same type if possible to avoid having to re-run all the hoses. Any thoughts??...
S
Stephen Dawes
Pressure has to go somewhere.
Stephen: The pressure had to go somewhere. It is going to start leaking ANY place that is the weakest. Be sure that you always flush out the vent line EVERY time you pump out. This prevents the spiders, mud daubers and other critters from nesting in there and also makes sure that you don't have anything else pluggin' up the line.
Stephen: The pressure had to go somewhere. It is going to start leaking ANY place that is the weakest. Be sure that you always flush out the vent line EVERY time you pump out. This prevents the spiders, mud daubers and other critters from nesting in there and also makes sure that you don't have anything else pluggin' up the line.
P
Peggie Hall/Head Mistress
It's NOT unusual for Jabsco y-valves to leak
Double clamping the hose connections should cure it, however. Do NOT use any sealant!!! It was not the leak that prevented pump-out, it was your clogged vent. A tank cannot be pumped out unless there's a source of air to replace the contents being drawn out. Without an open vent, the pump pulls a vacuum that prevents pumpout. If the pumpout is strong enough, it can crack your tank.
Double clamping the hose connections should cure it, however. Do NOT use any sealant!!! It was not the leak that prevented pump-out, it was your clogged vent. A tank cannot be pumped out unless there's a source of air to replace the contents being drawn out. Without an open vent, the pump pulls a vacuum that prevents pumpout. If the pumpout is strong enough, it can crack your tank.
S
Stephen Dawes
Jabsco Y-Valve Cont'd
I'm sorry, I should have explained more clearly. After replacing the vent line we experienced problems with pump-out. So, with a clear vent, and while hooked up to the pumpout station, sewage was seeping from the valve where the elbow fittings swivel and enter the valve body (i.e. a mechanical part of the valve, not the hose connection). The pump was only able to remove sewage very slowly. The design of the jabsco valve seems complicated with lots of seals etc.. But if it was likely that the overfill/overpressure blew one of the seals then I will just replace the valve with the same type. However, if it is common for these valves to leak then I would replace with one of the KISS designs and re-do the hoses..
I'm sorry, I should have explained more clearly. After replacing the vent line we experienced problems with pump-out. So, with a clear vent, and while hooked up to the pumpout station, sewage was seeping from the valve where the elbow fittings swivel and enter the valve body (i.e. a mechanical part of the valve, not the hose connection). The pump was only able to remove sewage very slowly. The design of the jabsco valve seems complicated with lots of seals etc.. But if it was likely that the overfill/overpressure blew one of the seals then I will just replace the valve with the same type. However, if it is common for these valves to leak then I would replace with one of the KISS designs and re-do the hoses..
P
Peggie Hall/Headmistress
Replace with Whale
I've never met a Jabsco y-valve more than a year old that didn't leak. Whale y-valve cost a lot more, but they'll last as long as the boat will.
I've never met a Jabsco y-valve more than a year old that didn't leak. Whale y-valve cost a lot more, but they'll last as long as the boat will.
- Status
- Not open for further replies.