I am having trouble with my halyard wrapping on my foil when I am trying to raise my sail. I have a Harken furler on a Catalina 27 and just replaced my forestay. I have reassembled the rig and everything seems in good shape, however, when I try to raise my sail the top swivel starts to spin around (with the halyard attached) when I am hoisting the sail. !? I took the sail off and it appears everything is spinning and freely moving. I tied a line onto the bottom of the swivel assembly instead of the sail and pulled it up, but the halyard still wraps. I have also tried to adjust the tension of the rigging so see if that if the trouble, but it didn't help. I have delt with traditional halyard wrap (when furling) and understand that situation. I am out of options and frustrated!!! Any advice or ideas would be greatly appreciated. Steve
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Halyard wrap
You need two things:
(1) Your line is twisted. Untwist it so that it will hang free without attanching to the top bearing. Becareful of it loosing it to the mast head. You'll have to be hoisted up.
(2) Did you have a halyard restrainer on the mast. For Harken furler you must have at least 7 degrees for the halyard. I use a Shafer restrainer because it has no moving parts and much simplier and cheaper than Harken. See below link.
http://us.binnacle.com/product_info.php?cPath=28_122&products_id=3289
You need two things:
(1) Your line is twisted. Untwist it so that it will hang free without attanching to the top bearing. Becareful of it loosing it to the mast head. You'll have to be hoisted up.
(2) Did you have a halyard restrainer on the mast. For Harken furler you must have at least 7 degrees for the halyard. I use a Shafer restrainer because it has no moving parts and much simplier and cheaper than Harken. See below link.
http://us.binnacle.com/product_info.php?cPath=28_122&products_id=3289
It sounds like you are missing a piece at the top of the foil. I Have a ProFurl head foil and it has a round piece at the top of it with a half moon cutout that acts as an anti-rotation device. The halyard rides in that halfmoon cutout which faces the mast and cannot wrap ( at least it hasn't in the five years I've had it.)
If that's not the problem, I wouldn't hesitate to contact Harken. Those people make great hardware and should be able to sovle the problem quickly.
If that's not the problem, I wouldn't hesitate to contact Harken. Those people make great hardware and should be able to sovle the problem quickly.
wrap
Stu...the begins about 1/4 of the way up and continues until it is so tight that I can't move it up anymore - maybe 3/4 of the way up. At any rate...it starts early on.
As far as a restrainer..I understand it, but the unit I have doesn't have one and it never did before. Last season it worked fine with no restrainer so I can't imagine that is the source of the problem. ??
Stu...the begins about 1/4 of the way up and continues until it is so tight that I can't move it up anymore - maybe 3/4 of the way up. At any rate...it starts early on.
As far as a restrainer..I understand it, but the unit I have doesn't have one and it never did before. Last season it worked fine with no restrainer so I can't imagine that is the source of the problem. ??
It may be that exit angle of your halyard at the top of the mast to upper swivel on your furler is incorrect. For most furlers, this angle is critical and may contribute to, or cause, halyard wrap if incorrect. The manual for your furler (or look it up online) should tell you what this angle must be. In many cases, a halyard restrainer mounted on the mast just below the halyard exit box, is needed to ensure the correct angle.
While unlikely, it could be you have a burr or other obstruction on one of the upper extrusions of your furler's foil. May be worth checking. Try connecting the upper swivel to the halyard, and then tie a long line to the lower shackle of the upper swivel instead of the sail and see it hoists properly without a sail attached.
Did any of this halyard wrap occur before you replaced the headstay? If not, it may be that extrusion itself is no longer true after it was replaced on the forestay. Does the entire length of the extrusion turn when halyard wrap occurs, or just the upper swivel?
Good luck with this.
While unlikely, it could be you have a burr or other obstruction on one of the upper extrusions of your furler's foil. May be worth checking. Try connecting the upper swivel to the halyard, and then tie a long line to the lower shackle of the upper swivel instead of the sail and see it hoists properly without a sail attached.
Did any of this halyard wrap occur before you replaced the headstay? If not, it may be that extrusion itself is no longer true after it was replaced on the forestay. Does the entire length of the extrusion turn when halyard wrap occurs, or just the upper swivel?
Good luck with this.
I had the same problem with my Schaefer CF700 Snapfurler, they included a halyard restrainer in the kit but I never put it on because it worked fine without it the first few times. Then after a few times out it started in with the halyard wrapping and frustrated the heck out of me. I had to take the mast down and put in the halyard restrainer and then the problem was solved, no more halyard wrap. I have the swivel too and raise the jib up the foil with the jib halyard and without the restrainer that swivel turns and wraps the halyard. Get one and put it on.
Mine does this sometimes when raising despite proper lead geometry. Be sure to get all the twist out of the halyard. That usually solves the problem for me or at least reduces it enough that the twist will pull out when the sail is mostly raised.
Even braid picks up a surprising amount of twist. Unshackle the halyard from the swivel and let it dangle turning it with your fingers untill it feels fully relaxed. You might have to send the swivel up the mast under the light tension of a messenger line and then work on twist from the hauling part but I haven't had to resort to that yet.
Once I get all the twist out, I have no wrap problems.
Even braid picks up a surprising amount of twist. Unshackle the halyard from the swivel and let it dangle turning it with your fingers untill it feels fully relaxed. You might have to send the swivel up the mast under the light tension of a messenger line and then work on twist from the hauling part but I haven't had to resort to that yet.
Once I get all the twist out, I have no wrap problems.
Common problem if the SAIL and its attachments arent correctly measured and the sail's luff dimension is 'too short' to properly fit the foil !!!!
With the sail raised, If the top swivel isnt AT (or very near) the TOP of the foil the halyard will 'toggle' around the top of the foil and 'lock' the foil from turning (via the bottom drum). The 'technical' term is that the **LEAD ANGLE** that the halyard makes with the top swivel must be according to the manufacturers specifications. If the lead angle is LESS than the spec. then the halyard will 'toggle' and wrap .... 'nutherwords a shallow lead angle will not keep the halyard from wrapping. Halyard wrap is a good possibility whenever the sails luff is much **shorter in length** than the overall foil (with top swivel) dimension. Look up at the top of your furler and look at the top swivel; if that top swivel isnt almost ALL THE WAY to near the very top of the foil ... you are subject to Halyard wrap.
Simple solution:
disconnect the sail at the tack shackle on the furler drum, then raise the sail ALL THE WAY UP the foil. Measure the distance between the tack shackle and the sails tack grommet (the distance that you raised the sail). Make up a 'pendant' of non-stretchable line (or wire rope) to the above dimensions (but subtract 1-2 inches), lower the sail and install the 'pendant' between the top swivel and the 'head connection' of the sail. Viola, the top swivel will now be very close to the TOP of the foil, the lead angle that the halyard makes with the top swivel will now be increased, etc.
A good method to make up a non-stretchable 'pendant' is to use small diameter ultra low stretch hi-tech line, and make a 'lashing' of the small dia. line (many turns of small diameter line over the distance and 'through' the sails top connection grommet and the top swivel shackle, use many 'small knots to secure the lashing from slipping if your 'knot-ability' is low. 'nutherwords' you make up the needed distance (less 1 or 2 inches') to insure that the top-swivel is AT the top of the foil .... with 'rope'.
This will solve 99% of 'halyard wraps'. In the 1% of situations that this 'pendant' does not correct halyard wrap, then you must install a DIVERTER BLOCK near the top of the mast ... the halyard will then exit the mast top sheeve, run to the diverter block on the face of the mast and then to the top swivel .... changing the LEAD ANGLE of the Halyard TO the Top Swivel.
Consult your furler manual for the minimum LEAD ANGLE ... any furler, even those that use a 'restraint arm' on the top swivel to prevent 'halyard wrap' will not jam nor tend to jam (resistance to turn) if the LEAD ANGLE is correct ... or greater. Halyards that are 'twisting' are doing so because the halyard is 'toggling' on the top swivel because the LEAD ANGLE is incorrect.
If you use multiple headsails, each sail should have its own pendant.
Hope this is clear and hope this helps.
With the sail raised, If the top swivel isnt AT (or very near) the TOP of the foil the halyard will 'toggle' around the top of the foil and 'lock' the foil from turning (via the bottom drum). The 'technical' term is that the **LEAD ANGLE** that the halyard makes with the top swivel must be according to the manufacturers specifications. If the lead angle is LESS than the spec. then the halyard will 'toggle' and wrap .... 'nutherwords a shallow lead angle will not keep the halyard from wrapping. Halyard wrap is a good possibility whenever the sails luff is much **shorter in length** than the overall foil (with top swivel) dimension. Look up at the top of your furler and look at the top swivel; if that top swivel isnt almost ALL THE WAY to near the very top of the foil ... you are subject to Halyard wrap.
Simple solution:
disconnect the sail at the tack shackle on the furler drum, then raise the sail ALL THE WAY UP the foil. Measure the distance between the tack shackle and the sails tack grommet (the distance that you raised the sail). Make up a 'pendant' of non-stretchable line (or wire rope) to the above dimensions (but subtract 1-2 inches), lower the sail and install the 'pendant' between the top swivel and the 'head connection' of the sail. Viola, the top swivel will now be very close to the TOP of the foil, the lead angle that the halyard makes with the top swivel will now be increased, etc.
A good method to make up a non-stretchable 'pendant' is to use small diameter ultra low stretch hi-tech line, and make a 'lashing' of the small dia. line (many turns of small diameter line over the distance and 'through' the sails top connection grommet and the top swivel shackle, use many 'small knots to secure the lashing from slipping if your 'knot-ability' is low. 'nutherwords' you make up the needed distance (less 1 or 2 inches') to insure that the top-swivel is AT the top of the foil .... with 'rope'.
This will solve 99% of 'halyard wraps'. In the 1% of situations that this 'pendant' does not correct halyard wrap, then you must install a DIVERTER BLOCK near the top of the mast ... the halyard will then exit the mast top sheeve, run to the diverter block on the face of the mast and then to the top swivel .... changing the LEAD ANGLE of the Halyard TO the Top Swivel.
Consult your furler manual for the minimum LEAD ANGLE ... any furler, even those that use a 'restraint arm' on the top swivel to prevent 'halyard wrap' will not jam nor tend to jam (resistance to turn) if the LEAD ANGLE is correct ... or greater. Halyards that are 'twisting' are doing so because the halyard is 'toggling' on the top swivel because the LEAD ANGLE is incorrect.
If you use multiple headsails, each sail should have its own pendant.
Hope this is clear and hope this helps.
His halyard is probably twisted because of the (prior) 'toggling' of the halyard on the top swivel/foil ... due to incorrect lead angle.
Id consider to replace the halyard OR put it into a washing machine (daisy-chained to prevent god-awful tangles) to restore the fiber alignment and remove the 'twist'.
In the interim, suggest that he rub candle wax on the 'continuous support tape' (luff rope that fits into the foil's groove) to lubricate the sail so there isnt so much friction as t he sail is being raised ... that the twisted halyard is reacting to (and trying to 'straighten out)- large stress. If the luff support tape is 'slippery' the sail will go up with little stress and the halyard wont cause such a 'reaction force'. Sail Track 'lube' in the foil groove will also help.
The groove in the foil may have become fouled when the furler was off the boat (on the ground, etc.) Still, if the halyard is twisted, 99% of the time the cause is LEAD ANGLE, etc.
Id consider to replace the halyard OR put it into a washing machine (daisy-chained to prevent god-awful tangles) to restore the fiber alignment and remove the 'twist'.
In the interim, suggest that he rub candle wax on the 'continuous support tape' (luff rope that fits into the foil's groove) to lubricate the sail so there isnt so much friction as t he sail is being raised ... that the twisted halyard is reacting to (and trying to 'straighten out)- large stress. If the luff support tape is 'slippery' the sail will go up with little stress and the halyard wont cause such a 'reaction force'. Sail Track 'lube' in the foil groove will also help.
The groove in the foil may have become fouled when the furler was off the boat (on the ground, etc.) Still, if the halyard is twisted, 99% of the time the cause is LEAD ANGLE, etc.
Fixed it
I fixed it - I got on New England Ropes website and followed instructions on washing the lines as was recommended by Roger and Rich. Brought it down to the boat and up she went with no wrap around the foil. Thanks! Here's to the forum! Steve
I fixed it - I got on New England Ropes website and followed instructions on washing the lines as was recommended by Roger and Rich. Brought it down to the boat and up she went with no wrap around the foil. Thanks! Here's to the forum! Steve
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