H37C Topping Lift - yours?

[Jim Legere]

Yesterday I was out for a short sail in about 15 knots of wind. My topping lift was on too tight - not allowing the leech of the mainsail to stretch out when the mainsheet was cranked in. It got me to thinking: what do other owners do with their topping lifts?

Mine is (I think) original. It is a length of plastic covered wire - like that used on lifelines - that is maybe a foot shorter than the leech of the mainsail. a short length of braid is spliced to an eye at the bottom end of the wire. The height of the boom is adjusted by looping the rope through the fitting on the end of the boom and tying it back on itself. When its is tied off to keep the boom where I like it when the sail is furled, it is too short when the sail is hoisted in winds above ten knots. When it is adjusted to suit the sail in heavier winds it is either too long such that the boom rest on the dodger with the sail down or it flails around in light air, whacks the backstay and makes weird "UFO" noises. I have thought about replacing the length of braided rope with a small block & tackle with a snap shackle to permit quick adjustment or removal. But if I remove it, I am sure to forget to put it back on when lowering the mainsail :cussing:and I don't really want to buy one of those fancy strut boom vangs...What to do?

How have you other H37 cutter owners solved the topping lift dilemma?

 

[Ed Schenck]

I still have the original wire topping lift. I took off the adjustment at the boom end, connected the wire directly to the boom. Then I attached a spare halyard, aft and port in the mast, to the topping lift. I have yet to run that line back to the cockpit but that has always been the plan. In the picture you can see the main halyard and barely the spare. That empty pin is where the topping lift was originally connected.

 

[rardiH36]

My topping lift arrangement (1980 H36, but I believe the same Kenyon mast/boom arrangement as the 37's) is a bit convoluted. But works for me. Sorry I don't have a picture already on my computer to attach.

Essentially, I've got an SS wire affixed to the mast top. About two-three feet above the boom end, the wire converts to a rope block and tackle (3:1). Pulling down on the line, the boom goes up. On one side of the boom end, I've installed a cam cleat. The line can be seized off on this -- but only very temporarily. On the other side is a normal cleat for the more secure tie-off. The bottom end of the block and tackle is fitted with a snatch shackle. Originally, the PO had a loose SS ring at the end the boom for the topping lift attach point. I have modified to something more solid. After I raise the sail, I untie the line from the cleat, then release it from the cam cleat. The boom drops a few inches to the natural sail support level. Then I pull the release line on the snap shackle and remove the topping lift assembly from the boom completely. On my starboard split back stay, I've installed a cleat. The topping lift is attached to that and tightened enough so it doesn't flop around during the sail.

When sailing, I no longer have to bother with adjusting the thing all the time depending on sheeting angle and tension.

At the end of my sail and with the boat pointed into the wind for sail dowsing, the boom is centered and sheeted tight. The snap shackle is removed from the back stay cleat and re-attached to its boom fitting. The rope line is pulled tight and led through the cam cleat. Then brought over to the the normal cleat for safe secure. The sail can then be lowered without the boom falling down.

Sounds complicated, but all this takes but a few moments and from the safety of being in the cockpit. It is just part of the routine -- several hundred times now. And as already mentioned -- no fussing with the topping lift during the sail. I recognize that in very light winds, one might raise the boom for better sail shape. But unless racing, or concerned about just a few minutes better performance during a normal day sail, my lack of this feature isn't much of a downside.

A rigid boom vang is another option.

I should be at my boat again within the next 48 hours. Will take some pictures.

 

[rardiH36]

Hello Jim:

Here are pictures of my topping lift solution. Port and starboard shots. Also the a picture of clip-on ring and cleat mounted on the port split backstay onto which the topping lift is attached when I am actually sailing. Refer to my previous post for the written description.

Re your concern about dousing the sail before re-attaching the topping lift to the boom end. I have done this only once in a couple of hundred outings. And the outcome was not dire. This is because my halyard rope clutch is the sort that can't be released under much tension. So what I do is wrap the mainsheet halyard around the cabin top winch and relieve the tension. Then back off the halyard maybe six inches. Then re-engage the clutch before I go up on the cabin top for the final preparations before releasing the clutch fully and letting the sail collapse down along the lazy jacks. The six inch pre-release is enough that I can easily see/sense if the boom has dropped a bit if I had forgotten to reattach the topping lift to the boom.

 

[Jim Legere]

Thanks for the great pictures. That is more or less what I am contemplating. I might get a bottom block with a cam cleat incorporated, rather than cleating on the boom. I like the idea of stowing it when not in use on a ring on the backstay. I will have to see if that would work with my bimini folded and stowed against the backstay. I release my main halyard from the winch on the mast, so I might have a senior moment and not notice the lack of topping lift until the boom rested on the dodger...!

Ed's elegant solution has merit too, but my mast won't be horizontal any time soon, so I am thinking deck level solutions for now...and I don't have the boat bucks for a rigid vang either.

 

[Paul F]

This solution is a little more involved. If you install a ridged boom vang there is no need for a topping lift. You can then tie it off to the side to be used for some other purpose or use it as added security when you are away from your boat. In addition to the ridged boom vang I use the main halyard as a topping lift when it is not used for the main sail. This has the added advantage of not having the halyard slap against the mast when at the dock. You will also enjoy the added sailing control that a boom vang provides.

 

[Jim Legere]

This solution is a little more involved. If you install a ridged boom vang there is no need for a topping lift. You can then tie it off to the side to be used for some other purpose or use it as added security when you are away from your boat. In addition to the ridged boom vang I use the main halyard as a topping lift when it is not used for the main sail. This has the added advantage of not having the halyard slap against the mast when at the dock. You will also enjoy the added sailing control that a boom vang provides.

I do have a conventional vang but I think a rigid vang is not in the budget - from what I can see it would be in the neghborhood of $1K. As to halyard slap, mine are always secured off to the side when not in use, on cleats mounted to the cap shrouds. Absolutely no slap! I used to use the main halyard as an extra topping lift when the kids were younger and used the boom as a diving platform. Funny how the adults never wanted to dive in off the boom swung out over the water...now my swimming is limited to twice a season to clean the prop & shaft!

 

[sandpiper10471]

I believe my 81 has the original topping lift. A wire, dead-ended at the truck, goes through a sheave at the end of the boom and exits under the gooseneck with a small block and a cam cleat. I would rather use this cleat for a second or third reef. I think a rigid vang should be in my future budget.
This season I must replace my hot water tank cause it split during the winter. My fault. I forgot to open the drain. Also, some rascal stole all the haliards off my mast while it sat on sawhorses awaiting my painting this spring. Anyone know how long and the diameter the staysail haliard should be? The store doesn't list it even though it gives specs for a cutter rig.

 

[Jim Legere]

I believe my 81 has the original topping lift. A wire, dead-ended at the truck, goes through a sheave at the end of the boom and exits under the gooseneck with a small block and a cam cleat. I would rather use this cleat for a second or third reef. I think a rigid vang should be in my future budget.
This season I must replace my hot water tank cause it split during the winter. My fault. I forgot to open the drain. Also, some rascal stole all the haliards off my mast while it sat on sawhorses awaiting my painting this spring. Anyone know how long and the diameter the staysail haliard should be? The store doesn't list it even though it gives specs for a cutter rig.

I like the idea of the topping lift being adjustable through the boom, but all 3 sheaves at the end of my boom are spoke for: Outhaul, 1st Reef & 2nd Reef.

I can measure the staysail halyard on mine tomorrow AM and get back to you with the numbers.

 

[Blaise]

Midnight Sun must have one of those fancy vangs. I have a solid Garhauer vang that is spring loaded and holds the boom up. I don't remember how much I paid for it but it was nowhere near 1K. The 16:1 purchase is fantastic.

 

[DianaOfBurlington]

H25 topping lift

Rardi, that's a good setup you have. It's similar to mine except that mine leads forward via a cheek block and is belayed on the side of the boom rather than at a cam cleat as yours is. Right now I don't have internal reef and topping-lift lines; but when I can afford it I will get new boom ends with those two and the outhaul all led forward to cam stoppers at the forward end. Till then I am sort of hot-rodding the boom-- right now it's taken apart awaiting paint and I will be getting the end cut off so as to make it shorter (all early H25s' booms are too long) and to provide access to the internal outhaul tackle. I can't wait to see it in paint. It'll be cool.

 

[Dalliance]

Midnight Sun must have one of those fancy vangs. I have a solid Garhauer vang that is spring loaded and holds the boom up. I don't remember how much I paid for it but it was nowhere near 1K. The 16:1 purchase is fantastic.

I put a Garhauer rigid vang on Dalliance two years ago and love it. List price was around $500, but I paid $350 at Strictly Sail and they made custom brackets to fit my boom and mast.

 

[rardiH36]

Rardi, that's a good setup you have. It's similar to mine except that mine leads forward via a cheek block and is belayed on the side of the boom rather than at a cam cleat as yours is. Right now I don't have internal reef and topping-lift lines; but when I can afford it I will get new boom ends with those two and the outhaul all led forward to cam stoppers at the forward end. Till then I am sort of hot-rodding the boom-- right now it's taken apart awaiting paint and I will be getting the end cut off so as to make it shorter (all early H25s' booms are too long) and to provide access to the internal outhaul tackle. I can't wait to see it in paint. It'll be cool.

John:

The arrangement you describe sounds similar to the setup on my boat when I bought it. A cheek block was located on the starboard side of the boom end (about where my cam cleat is now). Then the line led forward to a cleat also on the starboard side maybe about three feet from the boom end. I found it somewhat difficult to use at the time of sail dousing. To raise the boom up a bit so that sail tension was removed from the luff slide in the mast track, I had to pull down on the line, and then keep up the tension while shifting the angle of the line 90 degrees to horizontal and forward to tie off on the cleat. All about 1.5 feet above my head and sometimes on a rocking boat in say 15-25 knot winds! Hence I was motivated to make the change to what I have now ... it took several iterations.

As to the internal reefing lines through the boom, my H36 has them. But what I did change-out were the boom mounted Kenyon original cam cleats at the gooseneck which secured the reef lines. I reef a lot for the central SF Bay slot winds. The new setup works much better than the original Kenyon system. I posted more description 1.5 years ago, but attached are before/after pictures. Now, the reef lines from the gooseneck lead down to blocks at the mast base, then back up to tie-off cleats on the mast. I can pull up firmly on the lines to get the reef point clews pretty tight against the boom. To shake out a reef, the lines are laid on the deck. Then they feed back nicely into the boom without much fuss as the sail is raised. Just to mention as an alternative to the cam cleat arrangement.

rardi

p.s. thanks for the good description of your epoxy repair method for wet/delaminated/rotted cores. Wish I had known about it when I first got my boat and completely peeled off the cockpit sole around the pedestal which was rocking back and forth due to what I thought was core rot in the sole. But when I got the top skin off, I found that the plywood wood was in great shape and still firmly adhered to the top and bottom FRP skins. Instead only the glue between the plies had failed due to years of moisture ingress. It would have been so much easier and just as successful to instead drill holes and force thinned epoxy into the core to re-glue the plywood layers.

I didn't notice what you currently use to thin the West Systems epoxy. Only that you used to do it with acetone.

Thanks

 

[SailH37]

light weight solution

I have a cable hanging from the top, with a piece of line tied to it using a thimble and a d-ring type clip that attaches to the end of the boom. When it comes time to sail, I hoist sail, then unclip and clip onto a cleat bolted to the shroud. Its the kind of small cleat that is designed to be bolted to a cable and has the loop on one end, and it's position so I can clip the topping lift onto it and it doesn't bounce around under sail. Otherwise, leaving the topping lift on, wraps itself around the backstay in light conditions and doesn't seem to safe. Under heavier sailing conditions, it becomes tight when strapping in the mainsail. I also support and want, a boom vang, that's a great solution.
Kb