H260: Water Under Cabin Floor

[rs1sensen]

Hi All,
When I walk on my cabin floor in the main salon and in the bathroom, I can hear water sloshing underneath it. I'm referring to under the fiberglass floor basin itself, not the teak plywood (I replaced that already).

I have a small crack (less than dime-size) in the floor under my sink and I was able to suck the water out of it with a shop vac and got several gallons. The water was fresh so boat is definitely leaking from top somewhere. I'm pretty solid on a leak identification process from past posts on this forum, so I'm going to really go through all of that this weekend and re-caulk/seal everything. I also have the canvas companionway cover and have that installed with a cushion underneath.

My question is not about the leak identification process, but instead about dealing with this water that I have.

Ideally, I'd like to install a small inspection port somewhere in the cabin where I can access this area. However, I know that the floor essentially forms the lid of the ballast. Is there anywhere safe to add a port? (floor under the sink?)

Thanks!

 

[rs1sensen]

FYI - not my boat but I found this photo on Facebook. This is the same area where I hear water. I could do a port like this but I hate to have it so visible and not sure with the ballast it is a good idea there anyways...

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

You need to talk with me on this one. Send a private message to included boat, location and phone number. I do not share any information with anyone.
Dave

 

[rs1sensen]

You need to talk with me on this one. Send a private message to included boat, location and phone number. I do not share any information with anyone.
Dave

Thanks, Dave. Just left you a voicemail.

 

[rs1sensen]

I spoke with @Crazy Dave Condon today and we devised a plan of action on this.

He feels that there is a path for water from under the aft bunk/bilge area to under the salon/galley/head floor. I didn’t think this was possible, but it does make sense.

He also indicated that from the forward most access in the aft compartment, it is possible with some gymnastics to reach and feel the top of the ballast tank lid, which wet/or dry may give some clues.

As my storage compartments in the front of the boat are dry, and I use a canvas cover for the companionway, with this amount of water (5+ gallons) our working theory is that the cockpit floor plate for the wheel is leaking - that water is going under the aft berth and making its way under the salon floor.

In addition, a key way to check for leaks on the boat is to close everything up except for one area to cover in plastic, and then stick a leaf blower into it to pressurize the cabin. Then, using soapy water, check area for bubbles, which indicates leaks. This is covered in more detail in other threads, but I think is a great recommendation.

Hopefully this is helpful to you guys in the future.

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

@rs1sensen sails in salt water but the water is fresh found inside; thus the direction of a topside leak. No water coming in through the companionway either. I appreciate greatly that he posted what was said.

 

[rs1sensen]

A few updates today. We’re getting hammered with rain due to the storm ETA so it was a good chance to really snoop around.

90% of water is definitely coming in as a result of the cockpit floor under the wheel.

With the heavy rain, I did have some water today in the forward storage compartments that I didn’t have previously, so definitely some leaks in the front too.

Here’s the kicker... my dome light above the cabin table was filled with water. With this location being so high and central on the boat, I’m guessing that means that it is leaking at the mast foot? Is that as simple as unscrewing the 4 screws that hold it down and resealing under it, or is there more to it?

Thanks, all!

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

Time to talk again regarding water up front and mast leak

 

[rs1sensen]

Hey guys - update here. After noticing water inside the cabin light over the table, I decided it was time to tackle the compression post.

This was a two day project of first removing stripped screws holding the mast plate down (thank you screw extraction bits), and then carefully prying with trim removal tools from harbor freight. I was able to raise it about 1.5cm off the deck, and then used a plastic woodcutting wedge with a rubber mallet that eventually broke the seal and let me pull the post. Debond spray was also helpful.

It quickly became evident to me that the previous owner had attempted this same task in the past, and much of my time was spent removing copious amounts of 5200. I also repaired a small area where he had damaged the gelcoat under the mast step - likely from prying with screwdrivers or similar.

I chose to reseal with 4200. The fact that the centerboard deck line sheave cannot be serviced without removing the compression post told me that I wanted something that would provide a solid seal but not require magical powers to remove. New screws completed the job.

The next project was sealing up the cockpit plate under the wheel. To do this, I removed the screws in the cockpit, 2 screws under the helm seat, and a series of screws in the back. I then removed the wheel from the pedestal to get it out of the way and than ran a line from the pedestal to the rail behind the helm seat. My marina has a manual gantry hoist which I connected to the line and lifted the entire cabin plate, pedestal and all, about 2” off the deck. Note that it is not necessary to remove any other parts - the Edson steering wire lifts with the rest of the wheel. For complete removal you’d have to take out part of the rudder assembly, but that is not necessary for this job.

With the cockpit floor safely held above the deck, I thoroughly cleaned everything. Underneath each screw hole was a large glob of sealant which I removed. Later, using an inspection port I had previously installed underneath the pedestal, I added my own globs of new sealant to each screw.

Because many of my screw holes had been worn too large, I mixed up some fiberglass putty and filled each hole in both the deck and cockpit plate. Once cured, I redilled the holes and installed new screws, reattaching the deck plate to the deck. The final step was to tape everything off and fill the gap with UV resistant caulk.

A note on the reality of the cockpit plate being a source of leaks: When you study the design here, it is pretty unlikely for this area to be a HUGE culprit, with one exception...

The design is such that when water is in the cockpit it goes to a small (2” tall) area directly under the wheel. The water then flows backwards and cascades down into the helm seat/fuel compartment and eventually out the back of the boat.

In the case of my boat, 1.5” diameter holes had been added for battery cables and electronics in the pedestal. These holes were drilled on the exact wall where the most water would flow down. If you have to add holes to to your boat in this area, you are advised to add them to the sides of this compartment - NOT the front, as I suspect the sides will experience at least a but less water coming down. Either way, seal these hose around your wiring and you’ll cut off a potential meaningful source of leaks.

Hope all this is helpful to other owners tracking down leaks!

 

[CaptainRan]

Excellent report, I hope I never need this info but it will be valuable if I do.

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

you reached out and you were able to do this. great job. Anytime, call me. I never give out personal info and likewise to all who have my number.