H23.5 centerboard/compression post leak

[Rick Macdonald]

My question is: on a H23.5, can I remove the compression post plate that sits on the centerboard trunk while the boat is on the trailer? Pat Adam says in his post for the H260:

Step 2. Remove the retaining screws as well as the large bolt. (The large bolt holds the CB bracket, but you can remove it without concern as the bracket is wedged into place and will not move without lots of help).

This is from: http://hunter.sailboatowners.com/in...mid=267&cat_id=15&aid=6381&page=article&mn=26

If I remove that bolt and plate while on the trailer and can't get it back together again, I'm in big trouble, I think.

My plan is to just clean up the area and use gobs and gobs (a whole tube) of 4200 to get me through this season, but then maybe take the plate off next spring and seal properly under the plate with 5200.

Comments on this?

Here is some background:

I've had my 1995 H23.5 since 2002. I think I developed this leak last summer but I'm not sure. It could had been there for a year or two before, but if so it was unnoticeable but really obvious this year.

Anyway, it doesn't leak at the slip but I see the water spurting out around the compression post bottom plate when underway. The water goes to the bilge/trough on both sides and then fore and aft from there. All the classic symptoms as described several times in this forum and the H26/H260 mod section.

Rick

 

[Rick Macdonald]

Worse than I thought

Duplicate post removed.

 

[Rick Macdonald]

Worse than I thought

Duplicate post removed.

 

[Rick Macdonald]

Worse than I thought

The H23.5 is quite different from the H26. The wooden compression post goes through a hole in the plate. The CB uphaul line goes through a plastic tube beside the post and then through a fitting in the plate. The plate looks like aluminum but I'm not sure. It scores easily with a screwdriver. It is badly corroded into a bluish powder on the side where the large bolt is. The bolt is loose. I started turning it clockwise and it exposed holes under the hex bolt head corroded right through. I stuck the end of a cable zip tie into the hole. It went down an inch and came out wet.

This boat spent its first 7 years in salt water. I've had it in fresh water for the last 8 years for our 4-month sailing season. Looking at that corrosion, I'm thinking it started from the salt water. ???

In my attachments (two posts down) you can see the blob of original sealer on the right side. I inserted the little screwdriver to show that it is deteriorated under the plate.

When underway, the water was coming up between the plate and this rubbery sealant where the screwdriver point is placed, but quite likely around the bolt head and wooden post as well.

The plate looks larger than the hole in the interior liner. I'm not sure that it could even be removed. I don't see how the compression post could be removed either.

I'm at a loss for what to do! Any ideas?

 

[Dennis Kitchen]

Re: Worse than I thought

Hi Rick,
I just went out and looked at mine to understand what you're describing. If you look on my profile page you can find photos of the centerboard hanger and views looking up from inside the trunk. Its clear that at the least the sealant around the bolt hole and up-haul hole and under the plate has been torn loose. At worst the trunk has been cracked.
It shouldn't be a problem to take the bolt out if the C/B is supported so it won't move. I can't tell if the c/post goes through the plate or rests on it... probably the latter in order to spread the load across the top of the trunk. It looks like you need to release the half-bulkhead from the c/post and try to flex the ceiling up enough to release the post. remove the uphaul shroud and pull the up haul down through the ceiling. First attach a small messenger line attached to it which you can take off once the end is inside the cabin. Now you should be able to make attempt at removing the plate and inspecting the trunk underneath. If all is well you can reasseble all ; bedded in 4200. Sounds like you may need to install a new plate since the old one is corroded. Assemble the uphaul pulling it back through the ceiling with the messenger.
I pulled up on my c/post and could see a little flexing at the plate/trunk joint so I think this is do-able. Of course my post is attached to the bulkhead still. And of course the mast needs to be down to attempt. this.
Hopefully resealing is all you need! Good Luck! Let us all know your result.

 

[Rick Macdonald]

Thanks, Dennis. Any relatives in Calgary? The Kitchen family lived next door to my mother for 30 years or so.

Here is another attempt to upload pictures. It didn't seem to work directly from my smart phone.

The "before" picture is actually half cleaned already. There was a blob of rubbery sealant that oozed up from around the compression post and was covering the hex bolt head, but was now actually loose and just flapping over top. I had tightened the bolt about 15 degrees, exposing the corrosion and hole under the head. The powery stuff, where wet, was gooey/pasty and grainy. It looked like salt to me but I was afraid to taste it. :naughty: On the right side, you can see where the screwdriver is pushing the sealer that oozed from under the plate. I later pulled that out.

The second picture is after cleaning. You can see that the compression post goes through a hole in the plate and rests on the CB trunk. Strange, eh? You can see the corrosion holes under the bolt head. I can insert a plastic strip (zip cable tie) under the right side edge of the plate such that I can see the end though the hole. Lots of space under there. You can see the original sealer still at the top of the picture. It seemed firm so I didn't try to remove it. Also, it's hard to get a tool or finger into there. This picture was taken from an angle. If you look straight down, you can't see the edges of the plate. In other words, the plate is bigger than the hole.

The third picture shows the whole plate. To remove the plate, the plastic fitting around the uphaul would have to be removed, and I see from Dennis's pictures that this fitting has a piece underneath, inside the c/ bracket. I think this would mean lifting the boat off the trailer and removing the c/b. I don't know how I could possibly do all that.

I don't really want to pull the boat out of the water to take it all apart. I'm not even sure I can get the plate out. To remove the compression post, I'd have to remove the half bulkhead which is screwed and caulked into place, and I assume the mast base.

I have one new tube each of 5200 and 24-hour quick-cure 4200 (they only had quick-cure). I'm thinking of backing the bolt off to expose the corrosion holes more, and trying to force 4200 into the hole. Ideally, I could do this well enough so it would ooze out from under the plate on the right-hand side of the picture. I would also put it around the compression post, and around the edges of the plate as best I can.

One thing that occurs to me is now or after the season, remove the bolt and insert a big washer to spread the force over a larger area. If I used 4200 now, would I get the bolt out easily later? Of course I wouldn't remove the bolt while on the water. On the trailer, hopefully there is not force on the c/b and bracket such that it would shift when the bolt was removed. This would possibly break the plastic fitting around the uphaul line.

Comments? What would people here do?

 

[Dennis Kitchen]

Rick,
I think 4200 will easily allow for removing to bolt again later. Thats what I used to reseal with after my C/B overhaul. Yes also to putting a big washer under the head! Plenty of bolt length available. And as you mentioned, don't take it apart in the water! The board and hanger will fall out and you'll lose the pins and roller.
So seal it up and see what happens. You said in your origonal post that the bolt was pretty loose so not surprised it was leaking. Dont overtighten when you're done. Just good and snug. You can crush the fiberglass with screw pressure.
Again, good luck!

 

[Rick Macdonald]

The more I think about it, I'm leaning towards pulling the boat out now and removing the bolt. That way, I have a much better shot at forcing 4200 into the void under the plate and around the bolt, which is hopefully the only place that is leaking. Plus, I can put the big washer in.

Oh, from the various pictures I've seen, the nut for the bolt is _welded_ to the c/b bracket, right?

 

[Rick Macdonald]

Quite a surprise when I pulled the bolt out. Half the threads are corroded away, as is the inside of the bolt at the end!

Now to find a new bolt and big washer. The head marking S30400 indicates 304 stainless steel. I won't find that anywhere around here today.

 

[Rick Macdonald]

Well, $15 for the 4200, $9 for a bolt and washer, and $11 for a 1-1/8" socket and the job is done. Tomorrow I'll find out if it still leaks.

 

[Rick Macdonald]

Success!

I motored hard for 20 minutes today and no leak! :dance:

 

[Dennis Kitchen]

Re: Success!

Rick,
Glad you got the problem fixed! Sounds like you caught it just short of loosing your entire centerboard. You were correct as you now know, the nut is welded to the C/B bracket. I hope it still had it's threads. Did the new bolt tighten up OK? That whole area is above the waterline at rest so it's good that you tested it while underway.

 

[Rick Macdonald]

Although there is some corrosion of the nut as well, it seemed to tighten up OK. I think the c/b is a also a bit quieter now when rocking side-to-side at anchor, slip or ball from waves and boat wakes.

I think I still have another leak. I've always had the "Hunter Crack" at the transom. I Dremeled it out and filled with Marine Tex a few years ago but it came back in places. I think it's leaking, but it's too early to tell. The way the water moves around the bilge it takes some investigation to find where it's actually coming from. The water I find some days is under the center of the aft berth. My depth and speed transducers are located there but I'm pretty sure they don't leak.The only place I've never had water is where the bilge pump is located!

 

[soling42]

I had water in the bilge and checked all the known culprits but I think that the bilge outlet line(which has no loop or backflow preventer in these Hunters) is allowing water in when on a port tack in heavy seas/wind. Just a thought.

Good fix. Thanks for posting with details and pics.
Mike

 

[Rick Macdonald]

Thanks, Mike, I'll check for that too.

 

[Rick Macdonald]

I had water in the bilge and checked all the known culprits but I think that the bilge outlet line(which has no loop or backflow preventer in these Hunters) is allowing water in when on a port tack in heavy seas/wind. Just a thought.
Mike

Mike, you were exactly right! I started a new thread for this problem (I don't know how to fix it yet :cry.

Rick