Good Article on Sail v. Powerboater....

[Don s/v Tellico]

in today's Washington Post relevant to the demand for sailboats. Sounds like it might be time to sell....not sail. Here's a good quote....link below is to entire article."Sailors know the wind is free, and they think everything else should be, too," one powerboater griped a few years ago to The Post, just before the sailboat show dropped anchor."

 

[rsn48]

Well, power is great, but not the cost

If I had my druthers, I'd be a power boater. But if money isn't endless, there are constraints to consider.I bought a car for $12,000 a number of years ago and by the time I sold it, I estimated I had paid out well over $24,000 in fuel for it.A buddy of mine wishes I had just bought a power boat instead of sail; here is what I told him. "Scott, if I buy the boat, pay for the insurance, and also pay for the moorage; and you only pay for the fuel, I will feel I have put one over on you. The fuel costs will well outstrip the price of the boat and all the other expenses."With the price of sails included in the equation, the cost of sailing is still less than power boating as you don't go out and purchase new sails constantly (unless your a racer).The arguement of where you sit in the boat is silly, however, to play with that line of thinking lets take it to its logical conclusion. The power boater feels like he is a "bus driver" to quote the article which I could see happening. While you are up on your command bridge for the thousandth hour, the party below might seem more inviting. On a sail boat, it all happens in the cockpit.In terms of seamanship, you don't need to know that much with power boating, which unfortunately is demonstrated all to often on the water. Get in the boat, turn on the key, let go the lines and head out. If you sail a boat, you have to know what you are doing, what this winch is for, what that cleat attaches to what. You need to know about winds and currents, and have a better understanding of time management, if you are going to make your way through some passes where tide and current is and issue.In fact, my buddy and I once sailed to a location the Gulf Islands, here in BC, and anchored off a point so that we could laugh at power boaters. You see there is a channel that is only navigational during the high tides, and low tides it is a creek about 8 feet wide and about two feet deep. He said: "watch this Rick, you'll be amazed at how many power boaters will try to go up this channel because the road map they are using shows it at full tide." And sure enough, we watched as power boater after power boater tried to navigate up the creek, which was too shallow for their boat. He and I walked up the creek and drifted down in inner tubes while drinking a bottle of champagne.At one point we had to push a power boater out of the mouth of the creek because he just wouldn't stop and accept what his eyes were telling him.With people working harder and becoming a voluntary slave to the corporation, time is more limited. These guys want something that is turnkey, not skilled.And a sailboat has better range than a power boat. The power boaters that circumnavigate the planet on their boat are by and large very wealthy, as you would need to be to pay for the fuel for a 25,000 mile journey. Most boaters that circumnavigate earth are sailboaters, its just cheaper that way.Our range is the same as a power boaters, we just need three times the amount of time to do it.Also when I sail on the Straits of Georgia, whose boats are more stable in a nasty job? A sailboat under sail is more stable than a power boater bouncing around in the Straits. In fact I have seen this alluded to in local rags on boating - a warning to power boaters that they will bounce around more than sail boater. Its nice to have a keel and sail add stability to the boat performance.I think a lot of baby boomers are coming into money now, the same scanario holds true for Harley Davidson purchases - its the guy in their fifties driving the HD motorcycle company. The guy inherits money and gets the boat he always wanted without the intimidation of having to take lots of lessons to learn how to use it; this and less time to play as you slave away at the office and throw your life away for the corporation are the reasons power boating is popular. Lets be realistic, if Donald Trump bought a boat it would be power, he doesn't have the time to learn how to sail.I know for a fact that the level of seamanship I need to know is far greater as a competent sailboater than as a power boater; this statement from an ex-navy officer in the Canadian Navy.

 

[Tsehum Pete]

Check Out About Time's New Bow

About Time's owner obviously had a sticky throttle or too much to drink!!

 

[Big Windy]

Wash Times

At least the Times seemed to get the facts correct...that's more than they can usually manage.

 

[Scott]

Condescension is unbecoming!

Wow rsn48, you seem to have a chip on your shoulder. Are you not counting on any inheritance? You make some good points about the differences between sail boats and power boats, but based on your first sentence, it seems that you would own a power boat instead of a sailboat but you don't want to fork out the scratch for gas, and that makes you bitter! That was a confusing revelation considering your superior attitude about sailing.Your postings are normally pretty good, but you touched my nerve, and maybe several others', with your patronizing comments about corporate slavery. I've worked for small companies and even attempted to make it on my own. Now I work for a Fortune 500 corporation and life has never been better. I get to ride a wave of prosperity and have a better balance between work, family and play. Nobody, outside my family, has cared for my well-being more than this corporation does. BTW, I believe Donald Trump does own a mega-luxurious motor yacht and I'll bet it suits him just fine. I'll bet he never navigates and probably spends minimal time on the bridge deck!Back to sailing. I love sailing just like everybody who posts here, but I don't understand the ridicule that often accompanies power boat horror stories. There is more than one reason for boating and sail boats certainly don't fit all purposes. If my passion were fishing, I wouldn't own a sailboat. I love water skiing and I can't do that with my sailboat! In fact, I was reading a posting about a family visiting Montauk Harbor for a weekend on their sailboat. It sounded nice, but I've been out there with my ski boat and I'll bet I can do a lot more exploring, spend time water skiing, fishing, and generally having a more versatile vacation than I could with my sailboat.It does cost a lot more now to fill up the tank ... it's a good thing I work for a corporation and my inheritence was healthy.

 

[rsn48]

Scott - First Donald Trump......

I was in Campbell River earlier today - also went to the tall ships festival in Port Alberni, BC. The boat sizes and price tag on the boats were incredible in Campbell River. Most of the large power and sail boats were up from Washington.Now about that inheritance, I just got mine in the last 6 months- only child you know so no one to fight over it with - thank god. The boat I bought was a Catalina 27 and I' give you the year, but so far I've been given three versions... lol!... 1971, 1972 and 1975. I've decided to believe 1975..!!!!I don't know why but I find satisfaction in purchasing older things and fixing them up and adding the amenities I want. I plan on putting approximately $25,000 into this boat; so far I'm up to $10,000. I'm sanding and teaking anything on the boat that resembles wood, and I have incredible in shape wrists to prove it.The first boat our family owned (my dad) was an 18 footer power boat (I think they called them "run abouts" back then). We lived in Madison Wis and belonged to the yacht club there. The first sailing I ever did was also there on lake Monona on a smaller sail boat.I didn't do much until I joined the Canadian Navy back in 73. As you can imagine, I motored about in all kinds of boats and ships back then. Chaudiere was the boat I was attached to for the Canadians reading this. Interestingly, the first large sail boat I was on was the Oriole; I lived aboard her for a week back in 1974, just as they were getting ready to build my sailboat in California (the Catalina). I have included a not so good link to her below.I worked as officer of the watch on the mine sweeper that John Wayne bought. Dumb boat to buy, this was a World War Two mine sweeper and the hull was very rounded, with a very shallow draft, she bobbed around like a cork on top of the water. It was shallow and wooden so as to avoid the early mines that floated about in those days; a good draft for avoiding mines, not so hot to live aboard - trust me.In the late 70's and early 80's I had a good deal with two friends after another, I paid for moorage and their insurance, and I could use the boat as much as I liked. These were sail boats in the 26 - 27 foot range.When I went back to boating of course power would be nice for these waters, perhaps the best in North America for boating. You can take in more than a sail boat in a limited amount of time.But even today as I was in Campbell River looking at the large power boats - and I mean large - I was walking the jetty wondering what it would cost to fill them. Here in Canada, gas is over $1.00 a litre.In one of the magazines I read - I think Cruising - I read about a couple who were going to take five years to circumnavigate the world. The boat they bought - sounds more like a ship - holds 37,000 litres, so figure out how much it would cost to fill in Canada. The range of the boat is 3,200 miles but guess what at the end of those 3,200 miles. And the earth is 25,000 miles around, but heck that's in a straight line.Now for Donald Trump. I was discussing Donald with a boat store owner in Campbell River today and he said Donald had sold his boat when Donald was in a money crunch a while back. Apparently Donald felt it was too much money tied up in something that he wasn't using that much.And for corporate slaves; unfortunately they do exist - needless to say I'm not one of them - and I do actually feel sorry for them. I don't understand why they do it, but then I don't understand and feel sorry for the Japanese who are expected to go only on one out of five summer vacations, they turn down the other four - crazy - life's too short.There's a writer in one of the boat mags; Fatty is his name - again it might be in Cruising mag but don't hold me to this. Apparently he returned to the States and felt "out of place" with the pace and materialism and so left again. As you can imagine, the hate mail he received which was printed in the letters to the editors weren't very sympathetic. I guess Fatty and I should get together.If you come up here for an Alaskan cruise, email and we can carry on this discussion on my boat, sailing not powering, on Howe Sound. Maybe have lunch and a beer on Bowen Island.Cheers!

 

[Steve W]

Power boating is boring

I grew up on poweboats. I loved working on them, but other than little runabouts you can water ski behind, there isn't much fun for me in turning a key and pushing the throttle. I see it all the time....Mr powerboater idling through the channel, with trophy wife bored out of her mind reading a romance novel on the front of the boat.Or big powerboat guy hammering through the waves ponding up and down while all his passengers are miserable. Last weekend I went for a ride on my dad's powerboat around the north end of Seneca Lake. It was fun to look at the nice homes and to anchor and go swimming, but after 20 minutes of motoring, I'd had enough. Most of his marina mates idea of a long trip is over to the pumpout.I contrast this to when I'm sailing, and everyone in the family is entertained with a task, exhilirated and bonding. I do agree that the sailing industry does a horrible job promoting itself. the big mags only talk about big boats, and don't understand that the intimidation factor of a sailboat can be cured with a Laser, sunfish, etc. Sailing clubs are pushed away for the real estate. But yet when I take my skate boarding nieces and nephews sailing, I notice two things; they think we're going really fast, and they can't wait to go again.take CareSteve.

 

[Scott]

Sailing, not powering, on Howe Sound ...

Sounds great to me! Thanks for the invitation! I have to admit to being way more than a little envious over your sailing grounds in comparison to ours. Also, I enjoyed breezing through the profile of all the boats in the Cadillac Van Isle website. Thanks for the link! Just what I needed to help me focus on my job this afternoon. :{You must be the same vintage as I am. Speaking of vintage ships ... back in 1976 when the Tall Ships Parade was happening in New York City, the Norwegian vessel continued on to Chicago with a distant relative of mine on board. The sailer was my age and had just joined their Merchant Marine and was in training I guess. Later, after leaving Chicago, one of the most perilous passages they made during his year on the ship was approaching Mackinaw Island on the northern reaches of Lake Michigan during a gale. He said it was the only time he was afraid during his time on that ship.Hey - if we're having lunch (brats?) and beer (Old Style?) on Bowen Island, I can bend your ear with Wisconsin memories for hours! ;D

 

[rsn48]

If you can find Bratwurst on Bowen....

I'm not sure you can find Bratwurst at Bowen Island; if you know the west coast, more likely Asian food, or the proverbial "fish and chips." I supplied a link to Sewell's Marina. I love it there, you can't get more "West Coast" than just sitting on your boat barbecuing watching the "show" in front of your eyes, from eagles, to harbour seals, to ferries, to "water taxi's" to .... you name it. Motor about 10 minutes and you end up at a well known fishing hole.I have provided a link below to Sewell's, lots of great pictures, but not of the accident...lol! A buddy of mine is one of the Captains on the ferry to Bowen Island, which is a very short sail, and even shorter power cruise there. Rumours are that Harrison Ford has just bought a place for 10 million (Canadian) on Bowen Island. Enjoy the link....