Galley Fire

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Apr 8, 2010
1,606
Frers 33 41426 Westport, CT
Quick Update:
I had the surveyor come out last night and take a look at the boat / take pictures for the official insurance records, and the carpenter I used last year for a few little projects came out this morning to give me an estimate. $1950 for repair of all the cabinetry damaged by the fire. Talked to the surveyor this afternoon after getting the estimate and he said he was going to recommend the insurance company approve it, and as soon as the paperwork goes through in a few days time he should be able to get to work on the repairs. I won't know exactly how much the insurance company is going to pay until the paperwork goes through though...


btw, I think I may look into a CO2 extinguisher for the 3rd one I'm going to add, if I ever have another fire, and I know that I'm going to have to deal with that cleanup again after getting back to the dock, I might be tempted to let it burn! (kidding of course...)
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
make quite certain that you insurance man allows for a secondary claim for premature failure of any electrical or electronic equipment. Dry chemical powder is very corrosive.
 
Jan 27, 2008
3,045
ODay 35 Beaufort, NC
Halon gas is no longer manufactured anywhere in the world by mutual agreement of all civilized countries. It depletes the ozone very severely and 1 pound is about 1300 pounds of CO2 for greenhouse gas effects. Halon is still used by recycling it, the aviation industry uses it extensively for fire protection in cargo bays and for engine fires.
There are many alternatives available but sodium bicarbonate is one of the best (dry chemical). Other gaseous agents include FM200, FE36, CO2, water mist, Novec, and some others. Nitrogen is now being used to inert fuel tanks and being looked at as a fire suppressor for aerospace applications. The idea being to generate the nitrogen right on board the aircraft by splitting air into oxygen and nitrogen. You feed the nitrogen into the fuel tank as the fuel is used up to inert the tank. So a nitrogen filled extinguisher would be good on a boat if you could find one.
 
Apr 8, 2010
1,606
Frers 33 41426 Westport, CT
make quite certain that you insurance man allows for a secondary claim for premature failure of any electrical or electronic equipment. Dry chemical powder is very corrosive.
good idea... I noticed the corrosive nature the next morning when I grabbed my car keys, and noticed they were rather bad looking. They were on a shelf near the galley and were coated in dust when it happened. I went back the next day, took nearly every single thing out of the boat (dock mates weren't too thrilled) and very thoroughly rinsed everything down with water, but I do want to cover myself anyway just in case.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
Halon gas is no longer manufactured anywhere in the world by mutual agreement of all civilized countries. It depletes the ozone very severely and 1 pound is about 1300 pounds of CO2 for greenhouse gas effects. Halon is still used by recycling it, the aviation industry uses it extensively for fire protection in cargo bays and for engine fires.
There are many alternatives available but sodium bicarbonate is one of the best (dry chemical). Other gaseous agents include FM200, FE36, CO2, water mist, Novec, and some others. Nitrogen is now being used to inert fuel tanks and being looked at as a fire suppressor for aerospace applications. The idea being to generate the nitrogen right on board the aircraft by splitting air into oxygen and nitrogen. You feed the nitrogen into the fuel tank as the fuel is used up to inert the tank. So a nitrogen filled extinguisher would be good on a boat if you could find one.
There are some companies now that are making filters that can separate oxygen and nitrogen from the air. They use what is called a molecular sieve that will pass one molecule but retain the other.
The medical use for this is in the oxygen concentrators for people with respiratory problems.
There are probably many other uses.
 
Oct 26, 2005
2,057
- - Satellite Beach, FL.
Looks good!
Only fire I ever had on a boat in almost 30 years of boating was an alcohol stove. We were lucky no one was hurt and no real damage other than a little blistered gelcoat.
 
Apr 5, 2010
565
Catalina 27- 1984 Grapevine
Ross, that location of an extinguisher under the aft lazarette is a great idea. My wife has an annoying habit of relocating my two extinguishers to unknown, unfindable locations, and I know she'd never look under there. I've always been leery of marine alcohol as it is so difficult to see when it is burning, and my stove currently sits in my workshop.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
Even a propane flame is practically invisible in sunlight. A little salt on the burns fives a sodium orange or yellow color to the flame.
Edit to add: I was too busy working this year to use the boat even one day. But I will get that pix of the lazerette hatch extinguisher mount.
 
Apr 8, 2010
1,606
Frers 33 41426 Westport, CT
Just a reminder to those reading, this fire was in no way a fault of the stove or the fuel, it was human error 100%. She tried to fuel one burner when the other was still lit (she didn't check to see if it was still lit either). A very simple safety check would have prevented anything from happening, something I can assure you she won't skip again.

I do not fear the stove or alcohol fuel any more than I did before this happened. In terms of safety, I actually think it is overall less risky than propane because it doesn't emit CO, is not explosive, and is stored in unpressurized containers (often used unpressurized as well).
 
Nov 8, 2011
10
N/A N/A N/A
New stove type, w/ optional survey

Just a reminder to those reading, this fire was in no way a fault of the stove or the fuel, it was human error 100%. She tried to fuel one burner when the other was still lit (she didn't check to see if it was still lit either). A very simple safety check would have prevented anything from happening, something I can assure you she won't skip again.

I do not fear the stove or alcohol fuel any more than I did before this happened. In terms of safety, I actually think it is overall less risky than propane because it doesn't emit CO, is not explosive, and is stored in unpressurized containers (often used unpressurized as well).
This is all very interesting and while I understand that you don't fear alcohol any more than you used to, wouldn't it still be nice to not have to worry about this happening at all?
I am a student at Lehigh University currently working on developing a new boat stove fueled by parrafin wax. Using a new patented technology the stove would be able to burn wax in such a way that it gives off even more heat than alcohol and it is much safer. The accident that happened here would be impossible as the wax can only burn while in the stove, if it spills it will not continue to burn. It is also very safe to store and it can get wet without being ruined.

If you have time please take this survey http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/NFTTVJ8

If you don't have time for the whole survey please respond to a few short questions...
Do you own a stove?
Is safety a concern for you?
What size is your boat?
Does this wax stove interest you?

Thanks for your time and I really appreciate any responses.
 

Ross

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Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
Re: New stove type, w/ optional survey

The british use a term parafin to discribe the heavier fuel oils. No oil or wax will burn until it is vaporized. To over simplify, cooking with wax is using an enhanced candle for a heat source. Sterno is a jelled alcohol fuel that can't spill. Propane is a liquid fuel in storage and is vaporized in a carefully controlled time tested manner to be metered into a burner.
 
Oct 6, 2008
857
Hunter, Island Packet, Catalina, San Juan 26,38,22,23 Kettle Falls, Washington
Four Points, Thank you for this posting. It has been a very helpful and educational post.
I mounted 1 of our extinguishers just inside the companionway, oposite the stove, so a person entering the cabin to fight a fire doesn't have to go near any fire to reach the first extinguisher. It can be reached without entering if needed.
Again, thanks.
Ray
 
Jan 5, 2012
3
catalina 30 Tampa
All this discussion about high tech extinguishers is off the mark: alcohol is best extinguished with WATER! (unless the fire was beginning to migrate to surrounding structure) Water dilutes alcohol to a non-flamable concentration.
 
Apr 8, 2010
1,606
Frers 33 41426 Westport, CT
unless the fire was beginning to migrate to surrounding structure
this is exactly the key, aside from the common problem that most of us try to keep water on the outside of the boat, and therefore don't have a readily accessable source of sufficent volume to put a fire out with inside the boat.

In my case, the 2nd person in the galley when the fire started just happened to be holding a pot of water, but sadly she sort of froze with fear and didn't think to throw the water on the fire, which would have surely put it out instantly. By the time I got onto the boat from the dinghy, and into the cabin, it was to the point where I'm not sure the pot of water could have put it out, even if I had known she was holding it (my attention was towards the flames and the extinguisher, she had retreated towards the v-berth with the pot of water)
 
Jun 6, 2006
6,990
currently boatless wishing Harrington Harbor North, MD
It can also spread it. so bring lots of water.
 

JohnS

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Sep 25, 2008
177
Islander (Wayfarer/McGlasson) 32 St Georges Harbor
FourPoints said:
..., she had retreated towards the v-berth with the pot of water)
Yikes! Makes me think I should go over fire safety with anyone who enters the cabin, including preferred escape routes. Imagine if you weren't able to put it out. Would she, in her paniced state, have been able to get the fore hatch open and climbed out?
 

JohnS

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Sep 25, 2008
177
Islander (Wayfarer/McGlasson) 32 St Georges Harbor
Another thing to watch for when in the galley is vapors from flammable substances on your clothing. They can take longer to dissipate then you think.

I remember once while lighting the wood stove at home looking down to see a small flame slowly crawling up the leg of my jeans. Several hours earlier I had splashed a little gas on myself while filling up my car. Not enough that I still smelled it. I was able to brush out the flame with my hand, and the fabric wasn't even scorched.

Another time, I was in my kitchen when a roommate came in and turned on the stove (natural gas). When she turned around I noticed a flame slowly climbing up her back towards her hair. She had no idea, and I swatted it out (then had to explain what the hell I was doing). Most likely she'd recently applied some perfume or hairspray. (Typically not an issue on most boats, but I imagine it might apply to some Admirals out there.)
 
Mar 24, 2011
25
Macgregor 26X Lake Murray
Very glad no one seriously injured, and fast/calm thinking prevented a terrible outcome.
Fire safety is often thought about, but not often practiced IMO. Its hard to keep your wits when YOUR on fire, as well as your boat.

We had a house fire, and a small fire can double/quadruple/ect every 15-30 seconds IIRC. Our extinguisher was handy, and used.....to no avail. Smoke alarms worked....but the best thing that happened was our escape plan (which we practiced twice a year with our small boys).
IT WORKS.....They all met at the mailbox at the street, and no one went back inside. Fire department response in 4 min, I arrived in 11 min, house gone in 20 min...total structure/contents loss.
I know this is slightly off topic, and this is an older topic....but my hope is somebody will read this and........PRACTICE THIS.

Peace and goodwill for the new year......

Rich
 
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