Yanmar 3GMF I am going to instal a primer bulb (hand held, one way manual fuel pump) in my fuel line. Wondering if it matters to have the fuel pushed into the water fuel seperator & the rest of the system or should I install it where it sucks the fuel threw the seperator & down the system. I hear pros & cons to both. Does it really matter?? Which would you do & why??
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Ideas
1. Closer to the engine the better. 2. Have you been shown the proper way to pump the lever already installed? Most people don't push it far enough, try an extra 1/4 inch. 3. Archives show that the bulb can and will deteriorate, throwing bits and pieces off into the fuel line and causing an embolism. Look it up. 4. Best alternative is to refill the racor cups 80% and screw on with minimum spill. Then use a West System syringe to top it off. No pumping necessary whatsoever.
1. Closer to the engine the better. 2. Have you been shown the proper way to pump the lever already installed? Most people don't push it far enough, try an extra 1/4 inch. 3. Archives show that the bulb can and will deteriorate, throwing bits and pieces off into the fuel line and causing an embolism. Look it up. 4. Best alternative is to refill the racor cups 80% and screw on with minimum spill. Then use a West System syringe to top it off. No pumping necessary whatsoever.
never heard of that
I've spoken w/ MANY boat owners and have NEVER once heard of the buld breaking down. I'll look into it though.
I've spoken w/ MANY boat owners and have NEVER once heard of the buld breaking down. I'll look into it though.
Had one for years - one little problem
I have been using a fuel primer bulb for several years and have not had a failure of the bulb material itself. I had, what I consider to be, a "fluke" problem with the valving mechanism inside the bulb which came loose and floated around inside the squeeze bulb. I had intermittent engine problems because the loose stuff would partially block the fuel flow and then be OK for a while. Took me a while to trouble shoot that one. I replaced the bulb and it has worked fine ever since. My bulb is installed between the tank and the Racor filter. It makes it easier to fill the filter after changing the element and also in building pressure in the system during bleeding.
I have been using a fuel primer bulb for several years and have not had a failure of the bulb material itself. I had, what I consider to be, a "fluke" problem with the valving mechanism inside the bulb which came loose and floated around inside the squeeze bulb. I had intermittent engine problems because the loose stuff would partially block the fuel flow and then be OK for a while. Took me a while to trouble shoot that one. I replaced the bulb and it has worked fine ever since. My bulb is installed between the tank and the Racor filter. It makes it easier to fill the filter after changing the element and also in building pressure in the system during bleeding.
Yep, me too John
One of them lasted for five years in the dingy, exposed to tropical sun during the off season. It was hard and collapsed. Fueled up the tanks (gas) and worked the bulb and it came back to life. Replaced it at the end of the season anyway.
But the bulb on the boat has less time on duty but is mounted between the tank and Racor. I don't know that it matters, practically speaking. But I've used electric fuel pumps to a fuel valve had it plumbed to even prime the engine. Way too complicated. I'll stick with the bulb.
One of them lasted for five years in the dingy, exposed to tropical sun during the off season. It was hard and collapsed. Fueled up the tanks (gas) and worked the bulb and it came back to life. Replaced it at the end of the season anyway.
But the bulb on the boat has less time on duty but is mounted between the tank and Racor. I don't know that it matters, practically speaking. But I've used electric fuel pumps to a fuel valve had it plumbed to even prime the engine. Way too complicated. I'll stick with the bulb.Fuel Bulb
If using the manual lift pump to fill, and bleed, the fuel system, it sometimes helps to turn the engine over by hand (be sure the fuel cut-off is pulled out!) in order to move the cam the fuel pump rides on. This will allow a "Full" stroke of the manual lever on the pump and it will move fuel more easily.
If using the manual lift pump to fill, and bleed, the fuel system, it sometimes helps to turn the engine over by hand (be sure the fuel cut-off is pulled out!) in order to move the cam the fuel pump rides on. This will allow a "Full" stroke of the manual lever on the pump and it will move fuel more easily.
Decided not to
I was going to put a bulb in. But when I found out how to prime the fuel line using the existing pump lever (Bill's suggestion #2), I realized that the bulb was an unnecessary (IMHO) workaround.
I was going to put a bulb in. But when I found out how to prime the fuel line using the existing pump lever (Bill's suggestion #2), I realized that the bulb was an unnecessary (IMHO) workaround.
Thumbs up on bulb
I put a bulb between my tank and racor and it has saved tons of time and annoyance. When changing the filter element I close the fuel shutoff valve on the engine side of the filter, loosen the filter bleed valve and pump the bulb until the air is out. Then I re-open the shutoff valve and start the engine with no need to bleed (pun intended). I've also found it to be convenient when draining water or the occasional drop of goo that ends up in the filter bowl. To do this I loosen the drain at the bottom of the bowl and pump the bulb to squeeze the bad stuff into a ziploc. I have been warned that the bulb will eventually deteriorate and possibly collapse so I keep an eye on it. An alternative that has been recommended to me is to replace the bulb with a pump. Good luck.
I put a bulb between my tank and racor and it has saved tons of time and annoyance. When changing the filter element I close the fuel shutoff valve on the engine side of the filter, loosen the filter bleed valve and pump the bulb until the air is out. Then I re-open the shutoff valve and start the engine with no need to bleed (pun intended). I've also found it to be convenient when draining water or the occasional drop of goo that ends up in the filter bowl. To do this I loosen the drain at the bottom of the bowl and pump the bulb to squeeze the bad stuff into a ziploc. I have been warned that the bulb will eventually deteriorate and possibly collapse so I keep an eye on it. An alternative that has been recommended to me is to replace the bulb with a pump. Good luck.
Look Hard at the Bulb
Your fuel hose passes many safety tests for heat, pressure, flexibility, perishing, resistance to diesel etc. Now look at the bulb. No canvas reinforcing, thin walls, unsatisfactory end connections. What if there is a fire? Would you really like this thing in your engine bay - or, more to the point, would your insurance company? Also, if the tank pickup tube becomes partially obstructed the engine high pressure pump will suck a bulb flat. Then there will be no fuel flow. I beg you - don't do it.
Your fuel hose passes many safety tests for heat, pressure, flexibility, perishing, resistance to diesel etc. Now look at the bulb. No canvas reinforcing, thin walls, unsatisfactory end connections. What if there is a fire? Would you really like this thing in your engine bay - or, more to the point, would your insurance company? Also, if the tank pickup tube becomes partially obstructed the engine high pressure pump will suck a bulb flat. Then there will be no fuel flow. I beg you - don't do it.
Don, I must respectfully disagree
with both of your points. The first, about deterioration, is not a serious factor on a diesel engine. When the bulb shows wear, just replace it. And if a skipper let it go too long and it leaks fuel,,,big deal, it's diesel. Not dangerous. The second point about a obstruction collapsing the bulb, I submit, is a good thing. You will know instantly why the engine wont run. I have had such an obstruction at sea and it took a day and a half to figure it out because we didn't have a bulb. Bulbs are good.
with both of your points. The first, about deterioration, is not a serious factor on a diesel engine. When the bulb shows wear, just replace it. And if a skipper let it go too long and it leaks fuel,,,big deal, it's diesel. Not dangerous. The second point about a obstruction collapsing the bulb, I submit, is a good thing. You will know instantly why the engine wont run. I have had such an obstruction at sea and it took a day and a half to figure it out because we didn't have a bulb. Bulbs are good.
Nothing is forever,
If you install a bulb or an auxillary pump, that is a good thing, they may allow you to return to port under power, or get you out of a difficult situation, or just help in the bleeding process. BUT everything wears, and a prudent skipper will keep watch over these items, just as he would everything else, and replace when needed. Just good common sense!
If you install a bulb or an auxillary pump, that is a good thing, they may allow you to return to port under power, or get you out of a difficult situation, or just help in the bleeding process. BUT everything wears, and a prudent skipper will keep watch over these items, just as he would everything else, and replace when needed. Just good common sense!
Sure, Fred
I did try the engine pump, though it was not planned. Due to a brain fart (can I say that?) I found myself with a completely dry line from tank to pump, and successfully used the hand lever to prime the system. After that I was convinced.
I did try the engine pump, though it was not planned. Due to a brain fart (can I say that?) I found myself with a completely dry line from tank to pump, and successfully used the hand lever to prime the system. After that I was convinced.
My approach.
I carry a small Tempo outboard can with a couple of gallons of diesel. I clamp the end of the hose directly to the Racor. A couple of squeezes and the old Yanmar starts right up, no bleeding required. It can be used to bleed or to bypass tank and fuel line problems. Downside is you need room to store the Tempo. I would be uneasy with permanent rubber components in my fuel system. There are already too many variables: the filters, the fuel pump, the cam that drives the pump, the tank pickup, the fuel lines, and all those connections that come loose.
I carry a small Tempo outboard can with a couple of gallons of diesel. I clamp the end of the hose directly to the Racor. A couple of squeezes and the old Yanmar starts right up, no bleeding required. It can be used to bleed or to bypass tank and fuel line problems. Downside is you need room to store the Tempo. I would be uneasy with permanent rubber components in my fuel system. There are already too many variables: the filters, the fuel pump, the cam that drives the pump, the tank pickup, the fuel lines, and all those connections that come loose.
Ed, your right, now I won't sleep tonight!
That extra can of fuel is something that is going aboard my boat this season for sure. A extra gallon of diesel, poured into the fuel fill when you're low on fuel and 30 minutes from the fuel dock will only bring out smiles.
That extra can of fuel is something that is going aboard my boat this season for sure. A extra gallon of diesel, poured into the fuel fill when you're low on fuel and 30 minutes from the fuel dock will only bring out smiles.
agree with Ed
Why risk the integrity of your fuel line just to make it easier to bleed the engine after you've changed filters? First thing you do before a filter change is to fill up a small "primer can" of diesel. You'll never need a primer bulb if you've got good primer technique. As a backup, some Racor filters have their own handpumps built in. Mine works this way, making a primer bulb superfluous, although it's still easier to prime with an external fuel source. ......... I feel the same way, btw, about installing an electric fuel pump to reprime the system, as is recommended on this site from time to time. Without one, you can suffer total failure of the 12v. sytem but your diesel will keep running. With one, however....
Why risk the integrity of your fuel line just to make it easier to bleed the engine after you've changed filters? First thing you do before a filter change is to fill up a small "primer can" of diesel. You'll never need a primer bulb if you've got good primer technique. As a backup, some Racor filters have their own handpumps built in. Mine works this way, making a primer bulb superfluous, although it's still easier to prime with an external fuel source. ......... I feel the same way, btw, about installing an electric fuel pump to reprime the system, as is recommended on this site from time to time. Without one, you can suffer total failure of the 12v. sytem but your diesel will keep running. With one, however....
John, I just heard of those filters with the pump
built in, right here at this very location. Just the ticket. How much does it cost compared to a bulb? I'm with you too on 12v pumps for your fuel. Good for transfers, not good for life and death matters.
built in, right here at this very location. Just the ticket. How much does it cost compared to a bulb? I'm with you too on 12v pumps for your fuel. Good for transfers, not good for life and death matters.
Primer pumps
Regardless of hand primer or electric they should be installed down stream of a Racor 500 series filter. The Racor has a check valve in it that doesn't like to be presurized. The smaller Racors don't care. Personaly I'd go for electric because I'm lazy. Wired directly to the battery with a fuse and switch. Pat
Regardless of hand primer or electric they should be installed down stream of a Racor 500 series filter. The Racor has a check valve in it that doesn't like to be presurized. The smaller Racors don't care. Personaly I'd go for electric because I'm lazy. Wired directly to the battery with a fuse and switch. Pat
Installed it
I put the primer bulb in before the water/fuel seperator. Makes it so easy to rid the seperator of air prior to closing it up & then to bleed the remaining lines to the low pressure banjo is fast and clean.
I put the primer bulb in before the water/fuel seperator. Makes it so easy to rid the seperator of air prior to closing it up & then to bleed the remaining lines to the low pressure banjo is fast and clean.
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