I recently purchased a 1982 C38 shoal. The boat runs and steers excellent in forward gear. In reverse, the "proprwalk" is so overwhelming that it is impossible to back to starboard. I literally have to do a 180 in the quay in order to get out of the marina. It was suggested that I give her a short burst and then steer to starboard while in neutral, but the initial deflection to port is so great it cannot be overcome. I purchased the boat on the hard with a 3-blade prop. Later, I found an older 2-blade prop in a locker. Is the three blade prop the problem? Can anyone suggest a solution?
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Propwalk can be a good thing...
but you've got to learn to work with it. You can get a quicker bite with your rudder in reverse if you use power in short bursts and then coast for a bit to let the rudder get water flowing over it. You can even lock your rudder in the right position and start out by pushing your boat backwards before jumping on. Also you want to be careful not to oversteer in reverse when you are trying to get it to turn because that will "stall" your rudder at low speeds. Backing out at slow speed will make the propwalk seem most intense.
I struggled with "intense propwalk" for a long time because I was not working with it. I was pulling in to my slip bow first and starboard side to the dock and then when I understood what was happening I found it easier to back in and pull out forward. Now that I understand how to use propwalk instead of struggling against it, I can do a 180 degree turn in a 45 foot wide fairway with our 42 footer.
I recommend you practice where there is plenty of room and nothing to run into.
but you've got to learn to work with it. You can get a quicker bite with your rudder in reverse if you use power in short bursts and then coast for a bit to let the rudder get water flowing over it. You can even lock your rudder in the right position and start out by pushing your boat backwards before jumping on. Also you want to be careful not to oversteer in reverse when you are trying to get it to turn because that will "stall" your rudder at low speeds. Backing out at slow speed will make the propwalk seem most intense.
I struggled with "intense propwalk" for a long time because I was not working with it. I was pulling in to my slip bow first and starboard side to the dock and then when I understood what was happening I found it easier to back in and pull out forward. Now that I understand how to use propwalk instead of struggling against it, I can do a 180 degree turn in a 45 foot wide fairway with our 42 footer.
I recommend you practice where there is plenty of room and nothing to run into.
another suggestion....
You might try doubling a line around a starboard side dock cleat or piling to counter-act the propwalk until you get clear. Cleat on end to the boat, loop it around the piling and back to the helm station. I did this on my old downwind slip to help keep the stern in so the bow would swing out. When far enough out you drop the free end and retrieve the line.
You might try doubling a line around a starboard side dock cleat or piling to counter-act the propwalk until you get clear. Cleat on end to the boat, loop it around the piling and back to the helm station. I did this on my old downwind slip to help keep the stern in so the bow would swing out. When far enough out you drop the free end and retrieve the line.
Prop Walk
All boats will have some prop walk. A Right Hand prop will walk to starboard in forward, and to port in reverse. A Left Hand prop will be just the opposite. A two blade will have less walk, but you will be unhappy with the forward performance. Some other designs will have less walk than the fixed props that usually come standard on production boats. The Campbell Sailor is a fixed prop that has less total area than the standard fixed, but has more thrust, and less walk. The folding, and feathering designs also have less walk than the "Michigan Wheel" fixed props.
You could also learn to use the effects of the prop to your advantage.
All boats will have some prop walk. A Right Hand prop will walk to starboard in forward, and to port in reverse. A Left Hand prop will be just the opposite. A two blade will have less walk, but you will be unhappy with the forward performance. Some other designs will have less walk than the fixed props that usually come standard on production boats. The Campbell Sailor is a fixed prop that has less total area than the standard fixed, but has more thrust, and less walk. The folding, and feathering designs also have less walk than the "Michigan Wheel" fixed props.
You could also learn to use the effects of the prop to your advantage.
Fouled
A prop fouled with barnacles/growth will also increase prop walk. You didn't say when the boat was splashed, for some reason it has been a bad season for growth. In the mid Chesapeake we are seeing double or triple the growth compared to last year. Find some clean water and take a look at your prop or have a diver look at it.
A prop fouled with barnacles/growth will also increase prop walk. You didn't say when the boat was splashed, for some reason it has been a bad season for growth. In the mid Chesapeake we are seeing double or triple the growth compared to last year. Find some clean water and take a look at your prop or have a diver look at it.
Try a spring line
If you want your boat to go to starboard and your prop walk is to port, try a stbd Stearn spring line to the outer post at your slip. Allow it to pull your you boat to starboard. It may take a couple of times using it till you get comfortable with it but it can help overcome the prop walk.
If you want your boat to go to starboard and your prop walk is to port, try a stbd Stearn spring line to the outer post at your slip. Allow it to pull your you boat to starboard. It may take a couple of times using it till you get comfortable with it but it can help overcome the prop walk.
Docking
Here is a site that has several free how to videos that may be of some help.
Anchoring/Docking (link)
Here is a site that has several free how to videos that may be of some help.
Anchoring/Docking (link)
Re: Excessive "Propwalk"
I have an AutoProp on my C400. The propwalk is so little that it is barely noticeable. It is a 3 blade feathering and self-pitching prop that completely reverses the blades when running in reverse. As a result it presents the same leading edge and surface to the water whether it is in forward or reverse, so it is the "same" prop in either direction. The amount of reverse thrust compared to propwalk is therefore proportionately greater and makes the propwalk much less noticeable. Cost is the big consideration. The AutopProp for a C400 is $2500.00 + or -.
I have an AutoProp on my C400. The propwalk is so little that it is barely noticeable. It is a 3 blade feathering and self-pitching prop that completely reverses the blades when running in reverse. As a result it presents the same leading edge and surface to the water whether it is in forward or reverse, so it is the "same" prop in either direction. The amount of reverse thrust compared to propwalk is therefore proportionately greater and makes the propwalk much less noticeable. Cost is the big consideration. The AutopProp for a C400 is $2500.00 + or -.
My 38 (1986) deep draft also has "amazing" prop walk to port". Over the years I've learned to live with it. Like Bob V's suggestion short bursts of reverse works pretty well, starting out with the helm all the way over to starboard, taking it out of gear to coast. A line to a starboard pilling its great if you have one, and a good shove from the port side stern works. The S&S designed 38 just walks to port, not much you can do to cure it. I have a feathering max-prop and if anything it increased the "walk". The walk can be helpful: you can piviot on your keel with reverse and forward (kinda of fun and helps in narrow runs), backing into slips, ect. Experiment with it, just one more thing that makes the 38 unique.
"Short" bursts just don't make it happen
Every time we read about prop walk, we continue to receive advice with "short bursts" included. I'm becoming of the opinion that most people feebly back out of their slips and wonder why the boat doesn't go where they want it to go.
I would caution that overcoming prop walk requires ASSERTIVE and sometime EXTENDED bursts of reverse engine to overcome the prop walk.
After all, the boat's gotta be moving for the rudder to work.
We have a fixed 3 blade prop, probably on the same engine as the thread above (1980s C38). We hold the aft starboard dockline (we leave them on the dock) as the last line to let go, pull the boat to the starboard side of the slip, because even with good engien work the first few feet are going to be to port, and back out aggressively (after checking the traffic, of course). The engine's doing about 1500 rpm and is engaged in reverse for at least half the boat length coming out of the slip.
We turn to port (lucky!) but with these actions we could just as easily turn to starboard.
Oh, and practice...
Every time we read about prop walk, we continue to receive advice with "short bursts" included. I'm becoming of the opinion that most people feebly back out of their slips and wonder why the boat doesn't go where they want it to go.
I would caution that overcoming prop walk requires ASSERTIVE and sometime EXTENDED bursts of reverse engine to overcome the prop walk.
After all, the boat's gotta be moving for the rudder to work.
We have a fixed 3 blade prop, probably on the same engine as the thread above (1980s C38). We hold the aft starboard dockline (we leave them on the dock) as the last line to let go, pull the boat to the starboard side of the slip, because even with good engien work the first few feet are going to be to port, and back out aggressively (after checking the traffic, of course). The engine's doing about 1500 rpm and is engaged in reverse for at least half the boat length coming out of the slip.
We turn to port (lucky!) but with these actions we could just as easily turn to starboard.
Oh, and practice...
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Re: Excessive "Propwalk"
I owned a C-38 for five years & just loved that boat. It did have considerable prop walk - the boat was equiped with a Martec 2 blade folding prop. Stu's statement regarding aggressive and extended bursts of throttle were key to making my C-38 back up. Once some stern way was on, I could back her any where I wanted. The key is to get stern way on as quickly as possible.
I owned a C-38 for five years & just loved that boat. It did have considerable prop walk - the boat was equiped with a Martec 2 blade folding prop. Stu's statement regarding aggressive and extended bursts of throttle were key to making my C-38 back up. Once some stern way was on, I could back her any where I wanted. The key is to get stern way on as quickly as possible.
Stu, you got one thing wrong...
"After all, the boat's gotta be moving for the rudder to work". You might think that but you'd be wrong.
Here's how to prove it to yourself. Bring the boat to a complete stop with the rudder hard over. Give a short hard burst of forward power. The boat will begin to turn even before it moves forward any significant distance because the rudder is directing the flow caused by the prop to be a turning force.
It is not only short bursts that work of course. Any time the rudder is turning there is propwalk. It is just that it is usually an insignificant amount compared to rudder control at speed.
"After all, the boat's gotta be moving for the rudder to work". You might think that but you'd be wrong.
Here's how to prove it to yourself. Bring the boat to a complete stop with the rudder hard over. Give a short hard burst of forward power. The boat will begin to turn even before it moves forward any significant distance because the rudder is directing the flow caused by the prop to be a turning force.
It is not only short bursts that work of course. Any time the rudder is turning there is propwalk. It is just that it is usually an insignificant amount compared to rudder control at speed.
I agree, in part
If you're going forward, the water'll hit the rudder quickly, because that's the way it's pushing the water: TO the rudder. If you're going astern, then the water is being pushed forward by the prop. I wasn't into the theoretical, just the reality of backing a boat up - short bursts, especially as the first burst, do not work to get a boat moving. Definitions of short may vary...
I did forget to add the obvious: when practicing, start somewhewre other than your dock, like a big side tie where you have the room to learn to make your boat go where YOU want it to go.
If you're going forward, the water'll hit the rudder quickly, because that's the way it's pushing the water: TO the rudder. If you're going astern, then the water is being pushed forward by the prop. I wasn't into the theoretical, just the reality of backing a boat up - short bursts, especially as the first burst, do not work to get a boat moving. Definitions of short may vary...
I did forget to add the obvious: when practicing, start somewhewre other than your dock, like a big side tie where you have the room to learn to make your boat go where YOU want it to go.
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