Ethanol

[bawlmer]

Fellow Sailors. I know this issue pops up in these forums many times but I saw something encouraging on my way home yesterday. This is the first time I ever saw this on a pump that was not in a marina. Maybe all of our screaming and lobbying is yielding some positive results. This was from a mainline gas station outside of Denton, MD. I will now keep my eyes open for more non ethanol pumps. I personally had to spend 1200.00 to have ethanol damage repaired to a speedboat I used to own in FL. This is good news.

 

[dlochner]

Ethanol free gasoline is appearing at an increasing number of gas stations. Around here (Upstate NY) it is sometimes called "Recreational Fuel." The boating industry has certainly been pushing for its inclusion and more quietly the antique car collectors, snowmobile industry, and the small motors (lawn mowers, snow blowers, etc) industry has been pushing for it.

Sometimes public pressure does affect the market.

 

[bawlmer]

This was also a new gas station (built within the last year) and I am sure the additional tank was designed into the plan. Much easier and far less expensive than adding it later.

 

[dlochner]

Around here, stations have swapped 91 or 93 Octane 10% ethanol to 91 Octane Ethanol free. No need for an extra tank.

 

[kloudie1]

Boat US is one of the lobbies that has helped us to get more widespread availability. Another good reason to join

 

[thinwater]

I'm not sayin' ethanol is a good idea. It is a bad idea from both an economic and and environmental standpoint. Everyone agrees on this except the farm lobby. Even Al Gore, who led the original push.http://sail-delmarva.blogspot.com/2010/11/al-gore-and-ethanol-so-now-its-not-good.html

But there is no reason to wring our hands, either. It works in cars and there are reasons. Cars have sealed tanks (no free air vent) and we run them more often.

• Use a good anti-corrosion additive. Although there is no ASTM standard, PS has done a number of rounds of testing, as have others. Biobor EB and Merc additives earned top scores. There was an ASTM standard under development, but an additive company, which shall remain nameless, torpedoed the effort. There was also a distinct lack of funding (I had the lead for a while).
• Keep water out of the tank. No water, no corrosion, and much better fuel oxidation/gum stability. Why would water affect gum? Indirectly. The aluminum, zinc and copper corrosion products (carb bowls are aluminum/zinc alloy and the jets are brass) are powerful gum formation catalysts. Thus, anticorrosion additives are also your first line of defense against gum. Keeping water out includes keeping filler o-rings fresh and lubed, the vent closed (portable tanks only), and using a silica gel vent filter (H2OUT) on tanks that have a vent.

Do these things and your carb with be shiny and perfect inside forever. I just opened a pair of 7-year old Yamahas I gave this treatment from the start, and they were beautiful. The prior pair of Yamahas pitted inside due to water and ethanol.

So start practicing good gasoline management. No problems.

(I spent 35 years as a chemical engineer in oil refining. I don't like ethanol, but there are ways to live well with it.)

 

[seadaddler]

Use sea foam in every tank and always had problems with my 8hp Yamaha until I started using Ethanol free gas and adding Sea Foam in every tank.
Nick

 

[Ron20324]

This was also a new gas station (built within the last year) and I am sure the additional tank was designed into the plan. Much easier and far less expensive than adding it later.

Good heavens,,man, don't keep us in suspense. Which station/where? I've not been to Bethany since Labor Day, so this must be a new station since then? I'll probably be there in December.

 

[Rich Stidger]

Find ethanol free gasoline in your area: https://www.pure-gas.org/
Don't forget that small general aviation airports might also sell to you. I have heard that so will and others won't. YMMV.

 

[capta]

Find ethanol free gasoline in your area: https://www.pure-gas.org/
Don't forget that small general aviation airports might also sell to you. I have heard that so will and others won't. YMMV.

I thought avgas was 100+ octane. I'm not so sure I'd want to run an automobile on that.

 

[thinwater]

I thought avgas was 100+ octane. I'm not so sure I'd want to run an automobile on that.

AVGas contains lead. It will foul the catalyst and oxygen sensor quickly and cost you a pile of money. It is also quite illegal to burn AVGas in a road car.

In a boat fouled plugs has been an issue. It's not the high otane, it is how they get there. On the other hand, there are plans to phase out the lead, so we'll see in a5-10 years.

http://www.shell.com/business-custo...entre/technical-talk/techart-18-30071600.html

 

[All U Get]

Keep the pressure up and we might get rid of it.

All U Get

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

Although I use to own a farm, it was another thing the feds did and it helped certain individuals and not the nation.

 

[Gunni]

There are approved unleaded AV gas mixes available but I wouldn’t want to run them in my outboard. The high ignition point can’t be good for lower compression engines. The problem is the extremely small idle jet sizes and the open circuit carburetors allowing oxidation and contamination of the fuel. Like Thinwater says you have to operate scrupulous fuel management these days. No slacking.

 

[bawlmer]

Good heavens,,man, don't keep us in suspense. Which station/where? I've not been to Bethany since Labor Day, so this must be a new station since then? I'll probably be there in December.

Ron. This is the new Royal Farms on the eastern end of Denton on the South/East bound side of 404. It is huge and tough to miss.

 

[thinwater]

Keep the pressure up and we might get rid of it.

All U Get

Not unless mid-west votes become unimportant and big AG lobbying slows down. Even if 80% of the people want it gone, certain regions will cut any deal to keep it, and that is the way illogical bills get passed. Once in place, they are a pestilence.

 

[Gunni]

Maybe a chemical engineer can provide an alternative fuel oxygenator to ethanol because that MTBE stuff that Exxon pimped for years was pure crap to clean out of the water supply.

 

[Johann]

Maybe a chemical engineer can provide an alternative fuel oxygenator to ethanol because that MTBE stuff that Exxon pimped for years was pure crap to clean out of the water supply.

Unless it comes from corn it won’t matter...

 

[Johann]

Just read in the BoatUS mag that the EPA reduced the quantity of ethanol US refiners need to blend into the gasoline supply for 2018. Maybe someone is listening.

 

[thinwater]

In fact, they never envisioned the ethanol mandate pushing the requirement over 10%. The projections showed gasoline consumption climbing. But that was pretty dumb, considering conservation was bound to arrive at some point.

One of our greater long term environmental travesties (never say greatest--their are so many to choose from) is that the concept of increasing CAFE mileage averages was abandoned when the price of gas fell and the right people lobbied. You can also thank Bush I. if the averages had continued to creep slowly upwards, as they should have, we would be in a much better place, in terms of pollution, economy, reduced dependence, and international leverage. Wars in the middle east would be a little less urgent and alliances a little more flexible. But big cars make more money for everyone that lobbies.

A quiet little change that went largely unnoticed. We're back on track now, making gains. I'm sure someone is bending Trump's ear about changing it back again.