Engineless....

[Claude L.-Auger]

In the late 70s early 80s Yves Gélinas removed the engine from his Alberg 30 and sailed around the world without it or a desalinator. He collected rainwater from his sails after they were rinsed out and refilled his tank. If your sailing plans are mostly going to be coastal cruising, and you have time to install only one then I would go with the diesel engine as it will provide safety going in and out of inlets and help you against currents. You will be able to get water when you reach any harbor. Good luck with the decision...and the plans

 

[The_Sailing_Pelican]

In the late 70s early 80s Yves Gélinas removed the engine from his Alberg 30 and sailed around the world without it or a desalinator. He collected rainwater from his sails after they were rinsed out and refilled his tank. If your sailing plans are mostly going to be coastal cruising, and you have time to install only one then I would go with the diesel engine as it will provide safety going in and out of inlets and help you against currents. You will be able to get water when you reach any harbor. Good luck with the decision...and the plans

Wise reply my friend

 

[dlochner]

Judgmental much? Some of you have tried to offer genuine insights but this is starting to get a bit self righteous.

Come on guys.... he acknowledges that



... and he never said he felt he needed either... what he said is that he only has time to install one or the other and wanted opinions on which one you would choose (with an implied why)...

A common adage is there are no dumb questions. That may be true or not, however, it is true there are well asked and poorly asked questions and many in between. For those of us who are trying to be helpful poorly asked questions are frustrating to answer.

How can one intelligently and thoughtfully answer a question like this one recently posted on SBO, "what kind of battery should I buy?" The poster received a bunch of conflicting answers. 10 days later the poster has still not returned to clarify the question or read the responses. It is actually kind of insulting to the many who responded.

For this thread, the only meaningful answer to the question as posted, are responses asking for more information and clarification. Unless the OP is trolling.

Right or wrong, poorly asked questions are going to receive some snarky answers and lots of confusing and irrelevant answers.

So, please on behalf of the many experienced sailors on here and on behalf of the sailors who are trying be helpful ask questions we can answer. And if we ask for more information, be forthcoming with that information. It is the least you can do.

 

[Roland5048]

When I first read the initial post I thought we might be being spoofed. At any rate I'll chime in with my $.02. I sail just up the coast from you in the Tarpon Springs area. Having sailed the west coast of Fl pretty extensively, I would not want to be going in or out of our many passes without an engine. The wind is going to have to be spot on and the current at slack tide and even with that, it would be risky at best. Sure, you could probably ride with the current but that is going to cause a loss of steerage if the wind dies down. Getting water is easy enough anywhere along the coast.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

What's the big deal? I think it is fairly obvious that @The_Sailing_Pelican wants to circumnavigate or go someplace very remote on his small boat. It's a valid question which choice is most necessary! I'm not understanding why there is a time limitation for deciding. Also, you're not getting thru the Panama Canal without an engine. But if the desire is to spend long periods of time off the grid in the Bahamas (or even Dry Tortuga) then I can understand how a water maker ranks high in priority! I'd still lean on getting the engine. The water-maker can be added along the way, somewhere, either an electical-driven water-maker or a manual hand-pump model.

 

[Richard19068]

A common adage is there are no dumb questions. That may be true or not, however, it is true there are well asked and poorly asked questions and many in between. For those of us who are trying to be helpful poorly asked questions are frustrating to answer.

How can one intelligently and thoughtfully answer a question like this one recently posted on SBO, "what kind of battery should I buy?" The poster received a bunch of conflicting answers. 10 days later the poster has still not returned to clarify the question or read the responses. It is actually kind of insulting to the many who responded.

For this thread, the only meaningful answer to the question as posted, are responses asking for more information and clarification. Unless the OP is trolling.

Right or wrong, poorly asked questions are going to receive some snarky answers and lots of confusing and irrelevant answers.

So, please on behalf of the many experienced sailors on here and on behalf of the sailors who are trying be helpful ask questions we can answer. And if we ask for more information, be forthcoming with that information. It is the least you can do.

The OP certainly should provide more data about his intended use but this is from one of his recent previous posts:

Upgrades to cross to the Caribbean

• Thread starterThe_Sailing_Pelican
• Start dateSep 23, 2022

"Things I could do to my 1985 Pearson 303 to make it safer for Bahamas/Caribbean journey..."

 

[dlochner]

The OP certainly should provide more data about his intended use but this is from one of his recent previous posts:
..
"Things I could do to my 1985 Pearson 303 to make it safer for Bahamas/Caribbean journey..."

He may have said that, however, is it reasonable that we should remember details of his plans? Of course not. There are dozens of people who ask questions on a variety topics, it is a bit outlandish that any of us should be expected to remember any one else's plans, their boat, or their projects.

 

[Head Sail]

Go for the diesel engine. You can get water at any marina.

 

[Richard19068]

He may have said that, however, is it reasonable that we should remember details of his plans? Of course not.

I completely agree with you. It wasn't my intention to imply that anybody would or should have remembered that. I just added it here after checking his previous posts to see if there were any clues as to where he was coming from. The question as he he posed it in this thread is completely unanswerable without information he didn't supply. .

 

[Scott T-Bird]

Go for the diesel engine. You can get water at any marina.

Many locations in the Bahamas won't have water readily available, and it is very expensive when it is available. I think many cruisers to the Bahamas and other Caribbean locations depend on their water-makers.

 

[dlochner]

Many locations in the Bahamas won't have water readily available, and it is very expensive when it is available. I think many cruisers to the Bahamas and other Caribbean locations depend on their water-makers.

Speaking from experience, we had no difficulties finding water in the Bahamas when we were there last spring. We did have to pay for it and it was important to take photos of the meters, but it was there. The highest price we paid was 50 cents a gallon.

The cost of a water maker is well north of $3K plus the cost of energy to run the water maker. You can buy a lot of water for $3K.

Your comment really begs the question, what is the OP's plan? If he going to be world cruising and off the grid for long periods of time, then a water maker may make sense. He still has to deal with the cost energy to make water and we don't know how he is going to make energy. Rainman makes a 12v water maker that draws 32 amps to make 7-9 gallons of water an hour.

With more information we could better advise him of his options.

 

[ggrizzard]

FYI to the Group:
Kevin Boothby has been sailing for years, including one circumnavigation, without ANY engine BUT...
Late last year he adapted a small HP outboard to push his 33 ft cruiser into/out of anchorages on
those occasions that are tricky.

 

[Richard19068]

He still has to deal with the cost energy to make water and we don't know how he is going to make energy.

The OP did include:

"I do have a portable power plant to use on whatever electric need arises."

With more information we could better advise him of his options.

Very true.

 

[Head Sail]

Many locations in the Bahamas won't have water readily available, and it is very expensive when it is available. I think many cruisers to the Bahamas and other Caribbean locations depend on their water-makers.

Maybe, but OP said nothing about the Bahamas or any offshore plans. Given that, I'd recommend an engine.

 

[LloydB]

Go for the engine it's obvious that you wouldn't be silly enough to head out without enough water in the first place.

 

[jssailem]

it's obvious that you wouldn't be silly enough to head out without enough water in the first place.

I hope that would be true... I am not convinced that all are so wise.

 

[dlochner]

The OP did include:

"I do have a portable power plant to use on whatever electric need arises."

What does that mean? There are a bunch of "portable power plants" being sold that are pretty much worthless. They consist of a small solar panel and a battery. I doubt any of them are capable of providing enough energy to run a water maker for any length of time.

For those who may not understand how a water maker works, there is a low pressure pump that supplies water to a high pressure pump which forces water through filters and membranes removing salt and impurities. They draw a great deal of power. A Rainman 12v water maker draws 32 amps to make 7-9 gallons of water an hour. Watermakers should be run every couple of days or the membrane can become fouled unless the WM is pickled. Generally they shouldn't be run in a harbor or crowded anchorage due to junk in the water that clogs filters or pathogens that might pass by the membrane. Great devices if off shore or in very remote anchorages and have the energy capacity to run them.

 

[thinwater]

Forget the desalinator issue.

Do you have the sailing chops and patients to sail in and out of marinas and entrances, waiting for tide and wind to alighn, and then making no mistakes? You will give up safely using most canals and narrow waterways (some one will say it is possible, but is it safe with today's ship traffic--probably not in many cases).

Yes, my first boat had no motor (beach cat). Yes, I have sailing in and out of marinas with no motor because it died. But I would not try this on a cruising boat. It's both dumb and potentially a hazard to others. A good skill to have, but a dumb plan (didn't sugar coat that!).

 

[rgranger]

Water makers use reverse osmosis to remove dissolved solids (salt) from the water. My son has been noodling on an alternative way to get water... from the air.

For example, this 12V 3A dehumidifier pulls water out of the air...

https://www.amazon.com/COYCYQI-Electric-Dehumidifier-adapter%EF%BC%8C1200-Basements/dp/B097Y5B75Y/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?keywords=12+volt+dehumidifier&qid=1668533848&sr=8-1-spons&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9hdGY&psc=1

Seems like this could be optimized as an "air well"....

 

[Simon Sexton]

Another vote for engine here!