For those interested, there's a thread starting on a Vega owner contemplating conversion to electric power at
Yahoo! Groups
Peter
#1331 'Sin Tacha'
Yahoo! Groups
Peter
#1331 'Sin Tacha'
Electric boats thread.
- Thread starter Peter
- Start date
Yes there is, it's me. Glenn, Vega 1184 in Kingston, Ontario, Canada, I sail on Lake Ontario. Still trying to decide between diesel or electric to replace the 022. I like the idea of a less polluting boat but am unsure of range. The costs are pretty close, I believe I can do electric for not very much more than diesel but that depends on the range I want. Does anyone know if a Vega has been converted to electric before or would I be the first? While were on the conversion topic, what is the largest prop you've seen on a Vega?
Glenn
Glenn
Glenn,
I've been doing allot of research on electric also. The problem is the weight of the batteries unless you go with Lithium Ion, then you have to deal with the price. I found a company in Utah that has the best price I've seen for L/I batteries and they will configure the batteries to the voltage you need.
The other idea I've been toying with is using the Torgeedo Cruise 4.0R. It's an electric outboard that develops 9.9 hp of torque. Using an outboard could make close quarters handling much better if you rig the outboard to the rudder controls so that the prop steers with the rudder. The downside to this motor is it doesn't provide regeneration when sailing like the inboards do.
My biggest challenge is how to do long distance cruising with such a setup. I found a small Apollo diesel generator that would allow me to recharge the batteries. I can make everything fit and keep the weight down, but the price ends up being about 40% more than a new Beta Marine diesel. As much as I would like to take advantage of an electric drive train, I don't think the batteries are quite there yet to meet my particular needs.
It sounds as though your needs aren't as demanding as mine, so you might be able to make it work for you. I'll be interested in hearing how you progress in this direction.
Ric
s/v Blue Max
#2692
I've been doing allot of research on electric also. The problem is the weight of the batteries unless you go with Lithium Ion, then you have to deal with the price. I found a company in Utah that has the best price I've seen for L/I batteries and they will configure the batteries to the voltage you need.
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The other idea I've been toying with is using the Torgeedo Cruise 4.0R. It's an electric outboard that develops 9.9 hp of torque. Using an outboard could make close quarters handling much better if you rig the outboard to the rudder controls so that the prop steers with the rudder. The downside to this motor is it doesn't provide regeneration when sailing like the inboards do.
My biggest challenge is how to do long distance cruising with such a setup. I found a small Apollo diesel generator that would allow me to recharge the batteries. I can make everything fit and keep the weight down, but the price ends up being about 40% more than a new Beta Marine diesel. As much as I would like to take advantage of an electric drive train, I don't think the batteries are quite there yet to meet my particular needs.
It sounds as though your needs aren't as demanding as mine, so you might be able to make it work for you. I'll be interested in hearing how you progress in this direction.
Ric
s/v Blue Max
#2692
Ric
Batteries are a problem, you need to carry a lot of wieght or have very deep pockets for Lithium ones. Thats why I'm stuck; with electric you have little range and one day I would like to longer crusies, so you need a gen and all that extra stuff or a diesel inboard. I suppose if you have lots of solar and a wind gen you could get along without a I/C gen.
A point on the electric outboard, I ran a gas outboard last summer and the big problem I had was the prop comming out of the water when ever the wind picked up. If there was more than 2 or 3 ft of swell it was hard to make headway because the prop would be out of the water 50% of the time. So this for me rules out the outboard.Glenn
Batteries are a problem, you need to carry a lot of wieght or have very deep pockets for Lithium ones. Thats why I'm stuck; with electric you have little range and one day I would like to longer crusies, so you need a gen and all that extra stuff or a diesel inboard. I suppose if you have lots of solar and a wind gen you could get along without a I/C gen.
A point on the electric outboard, I ran a gas outboard last summer and the big problem I had was the prop comming out of the water when ever the wind picked up. If there was more than 2 or 3 ft of swell it was hard to make headway because the prop would be out of the water 50% of the time. So this for me rules out the outboard.Glenn
Ric
I currently run a 9.9 Hp gas outboard now. The problem with it is, as soon as the wind picks up and you get more than a 2 ft of swell the boat starts to pitch the prop comes out of the water and you have to reduce RPM. In more than 20 knots it's hard to make headway. This would keep me away form an outboard in future.
I do intend to do longer cruises in future this is why I am debating the electric drive.
Glenn
I currently run a 9.9 Hp gas outboard now. The problem with it is, as soon as the wind picks up and you get more than a 2 ft of swell the boat starts to pitch the prop comes out of the water and you have to reduce RPM. In more than 20 knots it's hard to make headway. This would keep me away form an outboard in future.
I do intend to do longer cruises in future this is why I am debating the electric drive.
Glenn
Glenn,
That's good to know about the outboard. The only problem I have with the inboard electric is that it takes up the room where I would put a small diesel generator to deal with the range issues. I could probably make everything fit if I tried. Fortunately, I have another 8 months to a year before I get to a point to replace the engine. Once I have the old MD6A out and can really see what I have to work with, I can work on the design and see how it fits. Maybe you will beat me to the punch here and provide me with some more good insight.
Ric
s/v Blue Max
#2692
That's good to know about the outboard. The only problem I have with the inboard electric is that it takes up the room where I would put a small diesel generator to deal with the range issues. I could probably make everything fit if I tried. Fortunately, I have another 8 months to a year before I get to a point to replace the engine. Once I have the old MD6A out and can really see what I have to work with, I can work on the design and see how it fits. Maybe you will beat me to the punch here and provide me with some more good insight.
Ric
s/v Blue Max
#2692
When I decided to replace the Volvo (rather do a complete rebuild as it had
a lot of hours and a broken injector pump) I looked into electric power. My
son-in-law managed a wholesale battery company at the time and is also a
certified boat electrician. so I had some expert advice. What I came up with
was a nice power plant for very short runs. I figured that I'd only get
about 30, maybe 40 miles on a charge. I was figuring on using AGM batteries
so I was giving up a little over using 6 volt Trojan flooded or even a 2
volt cell like a Rolls.
Now, if I was back in the tropics with the boat that wouldn't be a huge
problem as the trades are fairly constant. But in the Pacific Northwest the
winds are very fluky, and I like to be out for a few weeks without spending
a lot of time at a marina (especially if I have to spend hours plugged in to
shore power). So I opted for a Beta and am now putting in a 13 gallon tank
much like Chuck and Laura put on LeaLea. I figure I will have an excellent
range if I need it (and trust me, I much prefer being under sail, no need to
comment "but it is a sailboat!"
Chris
a lot of hours and a broken injector pump) I looked into electric power. My
son-in-law managed a wholesale battery company at the time and is also a
certified boat electrician. so I had some expert advice. What I came up with
was a nice power plant for very short runs. I figured that I'd only get
about 30, maybe 40 miles on a charge. I was figuring on using AGM batteries
so I was giving up a little over using 6 volt Trojan flooded or even a 2
volt cell like a Rolls.
Now, if I was back in the tropics with the boat that wouldn't be a huge
problem as the trades are fairly constant. But in the Pacific Northwest the
winds are very fluky, and I like to be out for a few weeks without spending
a lot of time at a marina (especially if I have to spend hours plugged in to
shore power). So I opted for a Beta and am now putting in a 13 gallon tank
much like Chuck and Laura put on LeaLea. I figure I will have an excellent
range if I need it (and trust me, I much prefer being under sail, no need to
comment "but it is a sailboat!"
Chris
This may be a little "off-thread" but, short of converting the main power source to electric, has anyone tried to install a little electric trolling motor on the stern of a Vega? I have a 12 V one lying around that seems to work o.k., and I'm thinking it might be a great way to improve maneuvering in tight quarters, especially while going backwards - by swiveling the motor in the direction you want to go, you nearly have a "stern thruster". Since I would use this only to pull into my slip (backwards to make it easier to get on and off - my marina doesn't have floating docks), battery capacity is not a concern, and the brace to hold the motor wouldn't have to be super-strong (the thrust would be quite feeble anyway). Who knows, it might even help to push the boat out of harm's way (a container ship barreling down on me during a dead calm while having engine troubles - that has happened to me!). But maybe it's more hassle than it would be worth it - any advice or thoughts would be appreciated.
- Sebastian (VegaLyra 1060)
- Sebastian (VegaLyra 1060)
I did that because I had a Minn Kota lying around. I used a scissor bracket
that slides into a little metal plate, so only the thin plate shows both
made by Fulton. I found that turning it sideways makes for a great stern
thruster But it will move the boat around in the marina and it is very
maneuverable with it. I also use the electric trolling motor to power the
dinghy if I want (so just have to deal with a battery and not store gasoline
also).
that slides into a little metal plate, so only the thin plate shows both
made by Fulton. I found that turning it sideways makes for a great stern
thruster
But it will move the boat around in the marina and it is verymaneuverable with it. I also use the electric trolling motor to power the
dinghy if I want (so just have to deal with a battery and not store gasoline
also).
Do you have a picture of your installation? Or maybe a link to investigate "Fulton"? (Bet you could have seen this request coming... ;-)
Thanks -Sebastian
Thanks -Sebastian
Here are two pictures of the bracket and engine bracket on the back of the
Vega. I didn't bother to worry about the reverse angle of the stern since
the Minn Kota has plenty of adjustment and it doesn't matter anyway since I
only have it on the stern temporarily. Next time I have the boat in the yard
I might fix that, but then I like having the bracket tucked tight again the
hull. I am thinking of having the bracket powder coated white. But this was
more of an amusement that I had to try -- but it works well. Garelick also
makes outboard motor brackets and adapter plates, but I used what I had
lying around. I think I will trim off the bottom of the bracket mounting
board as it is too long.
The third picture is a shot of a boat I took a few years ago when walking
through a yard in Port Townsend. I never talked with the guy, but this is
definitely a stern thruster that is bi-directional. The Minn Kota on my boat
has to be turned manually. One other thing, these electric trolling motors
have a lot of torque, so don't leave it wide open and then connect to the
battery without being sure it is really secure to the bracket -- they really
kick (I tried this once with the motor hard to one side -- it could work
though).
Vega. I didn't bother to worry about the reverse angle of the stern since
the Minn Kota has plenty of adjustment and it doesn't matter anyway since I
only have it on the stern temporarily. Next time I have the boat in the yard
I might fix that, but then I like having the bracket tucked tight again the
hull. I am thinking of having the bracket powder coated white. But this was
more of an amusement that I had to try -- but it works well. Garelick also
makes outboard motor brackets and adapter plates, but I used what I had
lying around. I think I will trim off the bottom of the bracket mounting
board as it is too long.
The third picture is a shot of a boat I took a few years ago when walking
through a yard in Port Townsend. I never talked with the guy, but this is
definitely a stern thruster that is bi-directional. The Minn Kota on my boat
has to be turned manually. One other thing, these electric trolling motors
have a lot of torque, so don't leave it wide open and then connect to the
battery without being sure it is really secure to the bracket -- they really
kick (I tried this once with the motor hard to one side -- it could work
though).
Sorry, but in my last email I attached two pictures of the same thing. This
is the boat I saw in the P.T. yard a few years ago with two trolling motors
on a swim ladder for a stern thruster. Not a Vega.
is the boat I saw in the P.T. yard a few years ago with two trolling motors
on a swim ladder for a stern thruster. Not a Vega.
Chris,
I don't see where the photos are attached. Are they attached to your post or some place else?
Thanks,
Ric
s/v Blue Max
32692
I don't see where the photos are attached. Are they attached to your post or some place else?
Thanks,
Ric
s/v Blue Max
32692
I was told the pictures weren't attached to the email. Then were attached
when I sent them, but "who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of
computers!!!"
I'll try again, and I'll attach the third picture of the other boat with two
trolling motors to the swim step (not a Vega, but interesting). I've bcc one
of my other accounts to see if they arrive there.
Chris
when I sent them, but "who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of
computers!!!"
I'll try again, and I'll attach the third picture of the other boat with two
trolling motors to the swim step (not a Vega, but interesting). I've bcc one
of my other accounts to see if they arrive there.
Chris
Sorry Chris,
The email list doesn't allow attachments. You can upload them to the gallery
on the group pages and point people there (or put them on Picasa or Flickr
or similar and send a link).
Cheers,
Tom
(junior under moderator of group)
The email list doesn't allow attachments. You can upload them to the gallery
on the group pages and point people there (or put them on Picasa or Flickr
or similar and send a link).
Cheers,
Tom
(junior under moderator of group)
Chris,
Do you plan to upload your pictures to the Vega site. I was looking
forward to seeing them.
Garry
V. 2427
Do you plan to upload your pictures to the Vega site. I was looking
forward to seeing them.
Garry
V. 2427