Drifter vs Code 0 vs ?

[AlastairLC]

I'm looking for a new headsail for sailing upwind in under light wind conditions when my 150 Genoa is pretty useless. Lin and Larry Pardey recommend a drifter, but drifters seem to be out of fashion. I can’t find any sailmaker who sells them.
The sailmakers are pushing Code 0s, but their tack is set foreword of the Genoa with their own portable furling drum, which sounds labor intensive and awkward to tack. I’d prefer a lightweight nylon three point sail which I can attach to a padeye aft of the Genoa and haul up on my second jib halyard and then tack inside the Genoa. It sounds to me like I want a drifter but I can’t find any for sale.
Any suggestions?

 

[Jackdaw]

A drifter is a replacement for your headsail. Rarier now in the world of furled headsails. Note - designed to be on a stay. Code 0s are stayless, which is what you are looking for.

If you give them the dimensions, most sailmakers will make you a code 0 for use without a furler you can use.

 

[Gene Neill]

@Jackdaw ... so you would prefer a Code 0 over a drifter, if you could only have one?

EDIT: assuming no furler of course

 

[Jackdaw]

@Jackdaw ... so you would prefer a Code 0 over a drifter, if you could only have one?

EDIT: assuming no furler of course

If you don’t mind swapping sails, and are not worried about the racing PHRF ratings hit you take from having a max size genoa, use the drifter. Cheaper and easier to use.

 

[AlastairLC]

Thanks Jackdaw. So a Code 0 doesn’t have to be set up with its own furling drum forward of the forestay as shown in the Sail video? It can be set up as a three pointer?
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...=j35wNrIgSS8&usg=AOvVaw0Y5_jrBfXVD19LmO34mPtt

 

[AlastairLC]

Researching this further, it looks like a top down furler would make for easy Code 0 setup and tacking. (I might even get one to replace the sock on my gennaker.) But, boy, are they expensive!

 

[jssailem]

Alastair. Are you a racing sailor? If yes.. a Code 0 is for you, to improve your upwind light air sailing speed. If not, then it is an expensive toy that you will need to pull out of the sail locker a few times to feel that you got your moneys worth out of the experience.

Nothing wrong with that. Your money, your boat, your life... Live well my friend.

 

[AlastairLC]

Good advice, John. I’m not a racer, just a day sailor who likes to get the most out of his boat. The air tends to be light in the late morning out here when I’m heading out upwind. (It strengthens as the day progresses.) if I set up a Code 0 on its top down furler at the slip, it looks like it would be easy to deploy it and furl it before breaking out the Genoa.
But you’re right, it could turn out to be an expensive toy. But when has that stopped us?

 

[jssailem]

Never stopped us.. It is in the nature of being a boat owner. Sometimes more money than sense. Could be worse. We could be talking about monster trucks....

 

[Jackdaw]

Thanks Jackdaw. So a Code 0 doesn’t have to be set up with its own furling drum forward of the forestay as shown in the Sail video? It can be set up as a three pointer?

Does not have to be on a furler. Can be hoisted and doused like a normal spin.

While VOR65 tack their Code0s, mortals do not.

 

[CarlN]

Don't let the sailmaker marketing names confuse you. Code 0's were invented as a way around the rating penalty for genoas bigger than 150. If you don't care about rating penalty and just want to go upwind in light air, the sail you want is a 160 to 170 light air genoa (the exact number depends on where you can sheet it). The clew should be close to the deck (you won't be able to see under this sail and you will have to sit to leeward to not hit anything). Typically cut just a little fuller than a regular genoa for getting all the power you can out of light air. Sail 3-5 degrees below your normal tacking angle. A 2nd more versatile option is the reacher (screacher on a cat is similar). Similar size to the drifter but higher clew with bigger shoulders. Quite flat. Can't go as close to the wind but good enough for most cruisers in light air. Good from about 50 degrees apparent to a broad reach. Goes fine on a furler. Great sail for shorthanded crew. A "can't tell much difference" replacement for an asymmetric spinnaker, reacher, and drifter on a cruising boat. Carry in anything up to about 17 knots apparent (so downwind in 25 true)

 

[weinie]

Agree with CarlN
Not race legal as it's not a headsail (doesn't fly off the forestay) and not spinnaker (girth is too small)...
A reacher, screacher, code 00, etc is a great all around light wind sail.
No headaches like a spinnaker (wraps, takedowns, etc).
Needs to be on a top-down furler to tack/jibe.
Doyle calls theirs the Utility Power Sail. Can go upwind to about 35 degrees apparent to DDW. (May need a twing for downwind).
Upwind, it gets overpowered easily in gusts over 12 knots.
http://www.doylesails.com/cruising/downwind/ups/index.html
A great sail when I don't want to wrestle with a spinnaker and as Jackdaw said, critical for a boat that has a (mostly) non-overlapping headsail.

ETA: the in port VOR in Alicante a few days ago saw all boats using a true code 0 upwind and downwind in winds up to 12 knots and furling/unfurling to tack/jibe.

 

[Jackdaw]

Be careful when looking at that gaudy 35 degree apparent wind angle number. The TRUE wind angle for civilian Code 0s ever gets better than about 80 degrees. If you try and tack one upwind, you’ll just go back and forth.

The VOR sails are cranked up on 2:1 halyards with masttop locks. The sails are cut totally differently.

 

[weinie]

Be careful when looking at that gaudy 35 degree apparent wind angle number. The TRUE wind angle for civilian Code 0s ever gets better than about 80 degrees. If you try and tack one upwind, you’ll just go back and forth.

The VOR sails are cranked up on 2:1 halyards with masttop locks. The sails are cut totally differently.

35 degrees apparent (ok... it's pinching just a bit... but still). This was in about 5 knots of wind.
ETA.... not a true code 0 but...

 

[Jackdaw]

35 degrees apparent (ok... it's pinching just a bit... but still). This was in about 5 knots of wind.
ETA.... not a true code 0 but...

I'm not disagreeing with the 35 AWA, just saying that in real life (true wind) you really can't go to windward with a civilian Code 0. The boat speed pushes the apparent wind so far forward that it seems like you are going upwind, but you really are not.

Doing 7 in 8 knots true. Looks like we are going 'upwind', but the true wind angle is just ahead of the beam. We try and go higher the luff collapses.

You can however go upwind with a drifter.

 

[Gene Neill]

You can however go upwind with a drifter.

Sure enough. We can point as high or higher with our hank-on 180 drifter than with any other sail. Not based on apparent wind, but on GPS tracks.

 

[gettinthere]

my code 0 has a lightweight sacrificial cover, similar in style but not in material to the cover of a furling genoa. It means I can leave it up all the time. Furls on a Bamar continuous line furler. Since it is always up and in place I actually use it!

I shot a video of a Hylas 46 that had 3 wire headstays. The original stay for the mast that held the genoa, a typical inner forestay with a furled sail and they added an outer wire headstay with furler with a Code 0 that has the same sacrificial cover as mine.

So you dont have to always leave the code 0 in the locker when not in use, you can leave it furled and in place, ready to go.

 

[AlastairLC]

What’s a “sacrificial cover”? Something the Aztecs used on their altars?

 

[Ron20324]

What’s a “sacrificial cover”? Something the Aztecs used on their altars?

Sun panel.

 

[Bosman]

Are you a racing sailor? If yes.. a Code 0 is for you, to improve your upwind light air sailing speed. If not, then it is an expensive toy that you will need to pull out of the sail locker a few times to feel that you got your moneys worth out of the experience.

I strongly disagree. Code 0 and/or reacher on furler are absolutely lovely all-around sail for any modern/new-ish fractional rig. They are a bliss in light winds, when they pick up the lightest of puffs, while allowing to maintain impressive apparent wind angle of up to 40-45deg, as well as very good performance downwind. Plus, unlike some other flying sails, one person can operate this sail.