doyle stackpack
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Generic Version
I had the UK version. Ultimately, I decided to give it up for reasons perhaps peculiar to me. I didn't like the sail cover hanging in the way, and snugging it up was almost as much work as a sailcover. The boom is high and I had a heck of a time zipping it up. I'm also short. Having said that, some version of it is on the majority of med boats, and lots of people swear by them (vs. at them). I went to a retractable lazy jack system (scavanged and modified from the UK system) and a modified standard sail cover. You may like it a lot. Rick D.
I had the UK version. Ultimately, I decided to give it up for reasons perhaps peculiar to me. I didn't like the sail cover hanging in the way, and snugging it up was almost as much work as a sailcover. The boom is high and I had a heck of a time zipping it up. I'm also short. Having said that, some version of it is on the majority of med boats, and lots of people swear by them (vs. at them). I went to a retractable lazy jack system (scavanged and modified from the UK system) and a modified standard sail cover. You may like it a lot. Rick D.
Check with our Doyle Loft on City Island, I'm sure they can give you some customers to call for any questions you may have. (800)237-4453
I have one!!
Your going to find a mixed bag of responses on this subject. Some love em and some hate em! The doyle stack pack came on my 1988 Catalina 30 that the previous owner installed for single handed sailing. The first time as the new owner we left the dock and headed into the wind to raise the sails (headboard shackle connected, pack unzipped and halyard and lazyjacks snug), it was a real bear to get the sails up without getting the battens stuck in the lazyjacks!! We had to lower the sail, move the batten(s) to clear the lazy jack to finally get the sail up. The lazy jacks come off the mast to support the framework of the stack pack itself, so the key to success is to loosen the lazyjacks to lower and open the pack more to allow more ease in the raising of the sail. But, to neaten up the vessel, after you raise the main, you need to re-adjust the lazyjacks to keep the framework from flappin around!! Lowering the main is pretty much the same hassle...... Not to brag but, I have owned eight sailboats over the last 40 years from 22 to 35 feet and this is the first time I have ever NOT released bungies holding down my mainsail nested under a nice sail cover. In my opinion, the stack pack would be nice if you were to set sail and head into the sunset on the same tack for the day! I sail on a lake, where we may raise and lower several times so I find the stack pack a pain in the butt!! Maybe its not the idea of storing the main in a neat zippered casing, but mastering those darn lazy jacks. My 2 cents sir. Bob Breezin II
Your going to find a mixed bag of responses on this subject. Some love em and some hate em! The doyle stack pack came on my 1988 Catalina 30 that the previous owner installed for single handed sailing. The first time as the new owner we left the dock and headed into the wind to raise the sails (headboard shackle connected, pack unzipped and halyard and lazyjacks snug), it was a real bear to get the sails up without getting the battens stuck in the lazyjacks!! We had to lower the sail, move the batten(s) to clear the lazy jack to finally get the sail up. The lazy jacks come off the mast to support the framework of the stack pack itself, so the key to success is to loosen the lazyjacks to lower and open the pack more to allow more ease in the raising of the sail. But, to neaten up the vessel, after you raise the main, you need to re-adjust the lazyjacks to keep the framework from flappin around!! Lowering the main is pretty much the same hassle...... Not to brag but, I have owned eight sailboats over the last 40 years from 22 to 35 feet and this is the first time I have ever NOT released bungies holding down my mainsail nested under a nice sail cover. In my opinion, the stack pack would be nice if you were to set sail and head into the sunset on the same tack for the day! I sail on a lake, where we may raise and lower several times so I find the stack pack a pain in the butt!! Maybe its not the idea of storing the main in a neat zippered casing, but mastering those darn lazy jacks. My 2 cents sir. Bob Breezin II
thanks, tim, but i wanted independent opinions. i know and trust the local doyle folk, but they don't make a living not selling stackpacks.
Stackpack
last year was my first season with a new Beneteau 323 with a Doyle Stack Pack. I previously had always had conventional mainsails with conventional sailcovers. I like the combination of the lazyjacks and stack pack,, find it relatively easy to single hand and it keeps the sail well in control. It is true that you have to pay attention when raising the main to avoid the battens fouling in the lazyjacks, but I usually turn itno the wind anyway, and then there is no real problem. I also note that realistically the sail doesn't just drop into the Stackpack. Friction on the main keeps it from just dropping, so you end up having to pull it down anyway. Overall I like the setup.
last year was my first season with a new Beneteau 323 with a Doyle Stack Pack. I previously had always had conventional mainsails with conventional sailcovers. I like the combination of the lazyjacks and stack pack,, find it relatively easy to single hand and it keeps the sail well in control. It is true that you have to pay attention when raising the main to avoid the battens fouling in the lazyjacks, but I usually turn itno the wind anyway, and then there is no real problem. I also note that realistically the sail doesn't just drop into the Stackpack. Friction on the main keeps it from just dropping, so you end up having to pull it down anyway. Overall I like the setup.
More Questions
For those of you that have used the Stack Pack, while under sail what keeps it from flapping in the wind? Is there any noise factor? A conventional sail cover usually protects the boom, has this been a problem for anyone?
For those of you that have used the Stack Pack, while under sail what keeps it from flapping in the wind? Is there any noise factor? A conventional sail cover usually protects the boom, has this been a problem for anyone?
Its a Mess..................
Navis... The two metal rods that form the longitudinal braces are held up by the lazyjacks. When the sail is released and raised the zippered case remains open and the rods with the fabric sides will flare out. This flaring is controlled by how tight you keep the lazy jacks. BUT!! If the lazy jacks are tightened you will see that sail as in my case will fall against the jack lines. If the jacks are not left tight during sailing then the rods will be limp and in my opinion look sloppy. I do not pickup any unusual sound or resonnance from the rods on windy days. The structure is strong as a re-inforced zippered sail storage bag, which essentially, all it really is. I like the idea of encasing the sail, which is no different then a mainsail cover, but its the lazy jacks I find troubling. As intended to guide and control the main within a defined area, the jacks have to be adjusted and the sail does not flake itself and fall neatly into its re-inforced storage bag! The sail still has be man-handled and literally stuffed in the bag. With this observation, I feel that its more trouble then its worth and does not make it any easier for my crew to handle the main. So, maybe my situation is unique with the stack pack as others who have chimed in have enjoyed the system. Another observation is that the front of the sail is exposed unlike that with a standard sail cover. On my stack pack, their is not canvas aound the front. I have found that rain will get in, settle between the sail folds and must be drained by angling the end of the boom downward. All in all, I am planning on taking it off this spring and going back to the system I have enjoyed for decades now and thats simply a lot of bungie cords and a nice sail cover! The crew prefers it that way. Regards Bob 30 Catalina
Navis... The two metal rods that form the longitudinal braces are held up by the lazyjacks. When the sail is released and raised the zippered case remains open and the rods with the fabric sides will flare out. This flaring is controlled by how tight you keep the lazy jacks. BUT!! If the lazy jacks are tightened you will see that sail as in my case will fall against the jack lines. If the jacks are not left tight during sailing then the rods will be limp and in my opinion look sloppy. I do not pickup any unusual sound or resonnance from the rods on windy days. The structure is strong as a re-inforced zippered sail storage bag, which essentially, all it really is. I like the idea of encasing the sail, which is no different then a mainsail cover, but its the lazy jacks I find troubling. As intended to guide and control the main within a defined area, the jacks have to be adjusted and the sail does not flake itself and fall neatly into its re-inforced storage bag! The sail still has be man-handled and literally stuffed in the bag. With this observation, I feel that its more trouble then its worth and does not make it any easier for my crew to handle the main. So, maybe my situation is unique with the stack pack as others who have chimed in have enjoyed the system. Another observation is that the front of the sail is exposed unlike that with a standard sail cover. On my stack pack, their is not canvas aound the front. I have found that rain will get in, settle between the sail folds and must be drained by angling the end of the boom downward. All in all, I am planning on taking it off this spring and going back to the system I have enjoyed for decades now and thats simply a lot of bungie cords and a nice sail cover! The crew prefers it that way. Regards Bob 30 Catalina
To Bob
Doyle Makes two versions of the StackPack. Not trying to advertise, Just trying to help clear things up. It sounds as though, without seeing it, that your boat may have the economy version we call the Cradle Cover. The True StackPack is physically attached to the sail, and includes what we call the Integral Membrane. When the sail is raised, this membrane pulls the cover up tight against the sail to maintain the sails aerodynamics, and inturn keeps the cover from Flapping, and allows the lazyjacks to go slack while sailing. The Economy version, Cradle Cover, is independent of the sail and does not have the Integral Membrane. However, both systems utilize an additional cover piece that goes around the mast to close up the front of the cover system. Since its inception in the mid 80's, we have supplied over 15,000 StackPacks and/or Cradle Covers to customers. To be perfectly honest, as with any system, not everyone finds it to be the perfect solution to their mainsail handling needs, but at the same time we have many repeat StackPack customers, and have supplied virtually all Moorings charter boats with one of these systems.
Doyle Makes two versions of the StackPack. Not trying to advertise, Just trying to help clear things up. It sounds as though, without seeing it, that your boat may have the economy version we call the Cradle Cover. The True StackPack is physically attached to the sail, and includes what we call the Integral Membrane. When the sail is raised, this membrane pulls the cover up tight against the sail to maintain the sails aerodynamics, and inturn keeps the cover from Flapping, and allows the lazyjacks to go slack while sailing. The Economy version, Cradle Cover, is independent of the sail and does not have the Integral Membrane. However, both systems utilize an additional cover piece that goes around the mast to close up the front of the cover system. Since its inception in the mid 80's, we have supplied over 15,000 StackPacks and/or Cradle Covers to customers. To be perfectly honest, as with any system, not everyone finds it to be the perfect solution to their mainsail handling needs, but at the same time we have many repeat StackPack customers, and have supplied virtually all Moorings charter boats with one of these systems.
Cradle Cover
Thanks for the response and I am sure that the Stack Pack has worked well for many as you indicate, but obviously I must have the economy unit and the previous owner may have removed or misplaced the front cover your speaking of. No doubt, if given a choice the "integral membrane" system without having to attend to the lazy jacks would be the optimal way to go. The idea of a framed supported sail bag is a great innovation; however, my issue has been more with the lazy jacks on my system then the sail bag. They do however seem to go hand in hand on my particular unit. Having been a sailboat owner for many decades now and accustomed to sail flaking, bungie securing and sail covering operations on departure and return I will go with what feel's the most familiar to me. Bob
Thanks for the response and I am sure that the Stack Pack has worked well for many as you indicate, but obviously I must have the economy unit and the previous owner may have removed or misplaced the front cover your speaking of. No doubt, if given a choice the "integral membrane" system without having to attend to the lazy jacks would be the optimal way to go. The idea of a framed supported sail bag is a great innovation; however, my issue has been more with the lazy jacks on my system then the sail bag. They do however seem to go hand in hand on my particular unit. Having been a sailboat owner for many decades now and accustomed to sail flaking, bungie securing and sail covering operations on departure and return I will go with what feel's the most familiar to me. Bob
I wouldn't give mine up
First, I think they are a little expensive.....but that said, I would not trade mine....we live in Wichita and it is not fun putting a sail cover on a boat in 108 degree weather.....It was killing me. I called the Marblehead Doyle office for a quote and they took care of me.....my friends at the club helped me install it and it just is great...included of course was a new fully-battened main, and I had it cut with a little more roach than the original 272 sail had.....it is a dream sail. Much faster. I don't rely on the lazy jacks to do it all and still walk forward and properly furl the sail but we can have the sail down and the cover on in maybe 2 minutes total...no joke.....Lazy jacks require you to be headed dead to wind. May be not everyone is patient enough to do that....When I'm alone, I just lock off the wheel and up she goes.....It's the best investment I have made in the boat since we bought it 21 years ago. patrick
First, I think they are a little expensive.....but that said, I would not trade mine....we live in Wichita and it is not fun putting a sail cover on a boat in 108 degree weather.....It was killing me. I called the Marblehead Doyle office for a quote and they took care of me.....my friends at the club helped me install it and it just is great...included of course was a new fully-battened main, and I had it cut with a little more roach than the original 272 sail had.....it is a dream sail. Much faster. I don't rely on the lazy jacks to do it all and still walk forward and properly furl the sail but we can have the sail down and the cover on in maybe 2 minutes total...no joke.....Lazy jacks require you to be headed dead to wind. May be not everyone is patient enough to do that....When I'm alone, I just lock off the wheel and up she goes.....It's the best investment I have made in the boat since we bought it 21 years ago. patrick
To Tim
Ok, Tim. I had checked out the Doyle web site and I have no idea what this membraine is all about. Is there a clear illustration or graphic somewhere? And the way I read it, this membraine holds the cover to the sail and that allows the Lazy Jacks to be loose? What we are looking for is a way to lower the sails on a windy day and not have to worry about lose of lives (namely our own). We thought that straight lazy jacks would be the way to go, but now this Stack Pack has surfaced. Please explain the operation and if there is any picture that illustrates your points. (you're the expert). And all of the replies have been helpful as we attempt to make an informed decision. Thanks....
Ok, Tim. I had checked out the Doyle web site and I have no idea what this membraine is all about. Is there a clear illustration or graphic somewhere? And the way I read it, this membraine holds the cover to the sail and that allows the Lazy Jacks to be loose? What we are looking for is a way to lower the sails on a windy day and not have to worry about lose of lives (namely our own). We thought that straight lazy jacks would be the way to go, but now this Stack Pack has surfaced. Please explain the operation and if there is any picture that illustrates your points. (you're the expert). And all of the replies have been helpful as we attempt to make an informed decision. Thanks....
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