Donalex, re. your "Combiner".

[Ed Schenck]

Don, do you have a wiring diagram for your combiner? I have always wondered if mine is wired correctly. I did find this PDF manual and printed it but the one schematic is pretty useless(http://www.yandina.com/acrobats/C70Manual.pdf). You can see mine in the picture.

The small red wire from the control box was attached to a house battery ground because it was the closest ground. The starboard most(top) post of the combiner(by the anchor) was connected to a positive terminal of a house battery. And, naturally, the other post was connected to the positive terminal of the start battery. This seems correct but I am unsure.

What is confusing me is that the house is dead and the start battery is fine. The Heart Inverter/Charger was connected to the same house post as the combiner.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Ed, that sounds right. Look at the link I posted on your ACR topic, it includes wiring diagrams. You mentioned that your original setup had the AO going to the C post of the switch. If you were running the alternator with the switch in the Both position, the combiner could, maybe, possibly, have been chattering because the AO was going to both banks through the switch as well as the combiner trying to "do its thing."

That's why we keep repeating the mantra: take the AO DIRECTLY to the house bank. Use an echo charger, ACR, combiner, or even the B on the switch (as backup!) to parallel the banks only when charging.

You can check if the combiner is working by turning on your shorepower and seeing if it engages and sends charge to the other "leg."

 

[Stu Jackson]

Ed, that's the same combiner I have, we have the 130A model. In the manual, near the end, is a hidden little gem: you can put a toggle switch in the negative wire to turn it off.

 

[Ed Schenck]

There are no batteries on the boat Stu. Everything will be tested at home and ready for spring. Once I have studied all your links that is. Just finished making a six ounce template of my new 100 pound batteries.

 

[Don12364]

Donalex, re. your "Combiner"

Hi Ed,
Just for you.
I would have preferred to PM these drawings to avoid starting another thread on the pros and cons of my circuit.
My wiring is essentially as the boat was delivered in 1996 and I have deliberately kept it that way for the benefit of possible future owners; but I have added various items as the need arose.
I fear it has now reached the point where only an electrical/electronics engineer (like me) could own this boat.
Please find attached two diagrams. One is my full system DC wiring which will take some understanding! And the other has all the non relevant wiring removed to aid clarity. This is the 'Extract'.
In esence red is positive and black is neg. Thick lines mean heavy cable etc - except that my (free) .pdf converter sometimes gets it wrong.
Use at your own risk please!
Any queries please say.

Rgds,
Don Alexander.
PS:- Also I note that items such as VHF Radio and Autopilot and GPS and 12v sockets at nav table, steering console and for deck wash in anchor well are not shown, nor is the Calor gas solenoid - nor any of the lighting refer - etc, etc, etc! All of these are fed from the main electrical switch panel. Oh well!

 

[Ed Schenck]

Wow, thanks Don. Those are great schematics. Won't have time to study now but I am impressed with the quality. Wish I had a program like that instead of my tablet full of pencil sketches.

 

[mitiempo]

What jumps out at me in a quick look is that the fuse for the house bank should be in the positive cable and not the negative.

Excellent schematic.

 

[woodster]

What jumps out at me in a quick look is that the fuse for the house bank should be in the positive cable and not the negative.

Excellent schematic.

this is what blueseas has to say about where to put the fuse....

• Automatic Charging Relays
• Battery Switches
• BusBars, Connectors & Insulators
• Circuit Breakers
• Distribution Panels
• Fuse Blocks & Fuses
• Metering & Meter Accessories
• Accessories & Labels
• Switches

• DC Main Battery Management
• Automatic Charging Relays
• DC Main Circuit Protection
• DC Branch Power Distribution
• DC Branch Circuit Protection
• AC Main Power Distribution & Circuit Protection
• AC Main Source Selection
• AC Branch Power Distribution & Circuit Protection
• AC/DC Combination Panels & Circuit Protection
• Panel Accessories & Labels
• Metering & Meter Accessories
• Busbars, Connectors & Insulators

​

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Blue Sea Systems - Resources

• Product Notices
• >
• Add In-line Fuse to ACR Battery Negative Connection

Add In-line Fuse to ACR Battery Negative Connection

Automatic Charging Relays (ACRs) are connected to engine and house battery banks through large conductors. In the unlikely event that there is a fault in the ACR internal circuitry that allows fault current to flow from the high powered positive leads to the negative reference wire, the negative reference wire may have to carry more current than it is capable of and can overheat. The wire is typically rated for 20A; the normal current in this wire is less than 1 ampere.
A 10-15A fuse in the negative wire can prevent excessive current from flowing in the wire leading to overheating or possible fire. In-line AGC or Blade fuses are suitable. Place the fuse in a location not subject to flammable gas and use a sealed fuseholder.
All ACRs are vulnerable to ground faults flowing through the negative connection. This includes ACRs from other manufacturers. Refer to the wiring diagram for the location of the negative wire and install an in-line fuse in it.
Follow these specific instructions for each Blue Sea Systems’ ACR:
7600
Connect Terminal 3 of the ACR through a 10-15A in-line fuse to the main negative bus or the negative terminal of the nearest battery.

9112
Connect the negative (black wire) from the ACR through a 10-15A in-line fuse to the main negative bus or negative terminal of the nearest battery.
7610/7650
Connect the quick connect terminal marked GND (ground) through a 10-15A in-line fuse to the main negative bus or negative terminal of the nearest battery.


regards

woody

 

[mitiempo]

That calls for a fuse in the negative reference wire of 10 to 15 amps. ABYC calls for positive main cables to be fused within 7" of the battery post. Fuses in negative main cables are not required. You do have a breaker but I am guessing it is not within the required 7".

The charger positive output should be fused as well.

This is from Blue Seas (and ABYC) as well.

 

[Maine Sail]

this is what blueseas has to say about where to put the fuse....

Woody,

That negative ACR fuse is "in addition to" the fuses that are required for an ACR within 7" of each bank to meet US standards. In the US and Canada, they too follow NMMA & ABYC guidelines, all fusing is in the positive DC lead not the negative unless you also have the pos lead fused also. Donalex is in the UK where they may use a different standard.


This is straight from Blue Seas instruction sheet for the ACR:

* It is recommended that the ACR be connected directly to your battery positive terminals through appropriately sized fuses. Connecting in a different location such as a battery switch may affect accuracy because of voltage drop along current carrying conductors.

 

[woodster]

thanks Maine i am always looking for good info when it comes to sails boat systems...this site is very helful in many ways....kudos to PHIL AND HIS BAND OF PIRATES

regards

woody

 

[Don12364]

To Mitiempo - et al

What jumps out at me in a quick look is that the fuse for the house bank should be in the positive cable and not the negative.

Excellent schematic.

....................................................
It really is much simpler than all this.
In common with all boats of that era, my H376 came with no fusing on the DC power cables whatsoever.
When I installed the Heart Interface combo inverter/charger, I thought it wise to include a 150 amp fuse.
It is a great brute with no insulation at all and was obviously intended to mount inside a mains power distribution cabinet. Again, in those days covers were not available.
There was no space for the fuse in the battery locker so it had to go in an adjacent locker, though still within a few inches of the battery bank.

It was anathema to have exposed +12V terminals in a locker filled with all manner of other junk so I installed it in the negative power return line next to the 500 amp shunt.
I made a rudimentary cover for the fuse and now my risk assessment relies on there not being TWO simultaneous faults. i.e. a main power blow out AND something breaching my cover AND shorting across the fuse terminals.

It was not until some years later that Hunter - to their enormous credit - mailed me some proper insulated fuses in a mod kit.