Docking - part 2

[Don Guillette]

Mates: I forgot to mention the next part of the scene, which really is a pet peeve of mine. When the sailor finally secured the boat he then proceeded to completely wrap the ENTIRE length of clothes line around the cleats - you could not see the cleats when he finished!! Here's the proper way to wrap a cleat. It would be easier to demonstrate than put in writing but here goes. The procedure presupposes you have properly sized dock lines. The first wrap goes around the back of the cleat and under the horn then around the front of the cleat and again under the horn. The next wrap goes over the back horn and then you loop the front horn. Actually, that will secure the boat but you can finish with another loop over the back horn, which is a good idea. If you really want to look nautical, you can finish off with a Flemish Coil. That is where you tightly coil the excess line in a tight circle on the dock next to the cleat. So, the next time you dock and there are a bunch of folks standing around watching, blow them away by having your dock lines ready prior to landing and then properly secure the lines to your cleat. Then just walk by them like you have been doing it that way for 100 years. Dock watchers will hold you in high esteem as a sailor that know what he is doing - I know I would.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Dock Lines

Nice idea Don.We leave our dock lines on the dock. They therefore fit whenever we return. We have a 45 foot springline and four other 25 foot docklines that we always carry with us for use at other docks.Leaving your lines on your down dock makes docking easier.Stu

 

[Osprey17220]

Cleat Hitch

>he then proceeded to completely wrap the ENTIRE length of clothes line around the cleats....)The boat captian for the Boy Scout Sea Base program, tells the boys "if you can't tie a knot, tie a lot!" <G>Here's a link to the cleat hitch...Jimmie

 

[SoupyT]

Still no consensus (apparently)

I'm on the same page as Don. I've been doing my cleat hitches the way shown on that (rather good) link for longer than I'm prepared to reveal. However, the other week, my view of a proper cleat hitch was severely challenged. I was watching the great Jack Klang teaching cleat hitches at the Strictly Sail show. He did about 20 demonstrations of the cleat hitch he teaches "all the harbour employees". What struck me, was that in every demo, he had the standing part (going to the boat) going to the nearest horn (oblique angle to the furthest horn). He then did a complete turn to jam the line. Now, I know the "jamming" is a matter of personal preference (at my dock, after a week, that line would be seriously jammed!) but I thought the angle to the horn was fundamental. Perhaps they don't get surge in Jack's marina, but that would be risky at best in mine. In fact, the British magazine Practical Boat Owner has just published a hugely appologetic retraction, after they inadvertently transposed pictures showing the "right" and "wrong" way to do it. Anyone here actively using the Jack Klang version?

 

[Rick Webb]

I Had Always Used the Cleat Hitch

Now when I work with the Coast Guard Auxiliary I am told not to. They tell me if it's needed to untie quickly a couple of hitches on the cleat are better. It is much more difficult to unlearn a habit than to learn one. Guess as long as your boat does not float away it matters not a great deal.

 

[r.w.landau]

Ric, I don't understand...

I thought a cleat hitch ( tied correctly) was an easy knot to remove. It is a wrap and one hitch , and it doesn't jamb. I often have to tie and untie these one handed and have never had a problem. I have seen boats tied with the more wraps is better get loose.Ric, can you explain what you mean by a couple of hitches?r.w.landau

 

[Don Guillette]

Mates: Belay my message on how to wrap the cleat. I missed a wrap!! Don't laugh because one day you will be a senior too. Instead, go to Jimmie's (Osprey) message and check out the link. Check out how nicely the line lays on the cleat when everything is finished. That's exactly what it is supposed to look like.

 

[Malcolm Young]

Rick - I agree with you and not with your CGA

Rick,If you immediately put a half hitch on a cleat followed by another half hitch and the line is put under load you will not be able to get it off. I had a crew member do this (and I didn't inspect) - however I needed to shift the vessel after a very strong wind came up. I needed help to pull the boat in before I could release the last hitch. You must go on to the cleat and I do a full turn around the base and then a few 8's as Don suggested and finish by tucking the line under the last. I mildly disagree with the demonstration in the animation. (it is a pretty animation) - I will give you a link to a less pretty, but in my view, correct animation. See http://ws1.coopfish.siu.edu/knots/h_cleat.htmYou can undo this with one hand even if you have a full gale hitting the side of your boat - just be sure you leave the wrap on the cleat until you are ready to jump aboard...I do not agree in anyway that throwing a couple of half hitches immediately on the cleat is a good idea and it certainly will be a lot slower to get off if the line is under load.

 

[r.w.landau]

Don,

Old age or was it the "Tinny"?r.w.landau

 

[Rick Webb]

I Described it Poorly

What they instruct is a wrap around the base of the cleat then half hitches on the cleat horns sort of like the cleat hitch but nut tucked under. I'll see if I can come up with a picture or diagram.I have never had a difficult time undoing a cleat hitch. With a wrap around the cleat there is not much tension on the knot. The way they teach works as well just a different way of doing it I guess. It does seem that the cleat hitch is less likely to come undone to me.

 

[r.w.landau]

Rick, Another question...

I hope you don't think I am grilling you, that is not it.Rick, I can see that type of knot as a towing knot. Again if it is tied correctly. If you turn the loop over the horn the wrong way, it jambs.( Rick, this is more for those of less experience to add thought to actions, again hoping not to insult newbies) I would agree that it might be a good towing knot but I still like the cleat hitch for walking away from the boat for a week.r.w.landauRick, sorry if in previous responses I have said Ric. I don't know why but I thought it was Ric Webb

 

[Malcolm Young]

Rick - I misunderstood

Sorry, I thought when you said a couple of hitches I thought you ment half hitches (each tucked under). I now understand that you ment what I call figure 8's (shape not the stopper knot). Your second post described what I do without the final tuck. In fact when I teach knots I indicate that the only purpose for the final tuck is to keep the 8's from falling off the cleat. I have a student come up and pull on the cleated line as hard as they can to prove that the knot holds without the final tuck.I too have heard that people do what you describe when towing and it certainly will hold and be fast to undo as long as their are several 8's. On the other hand, I like rw, feel a lot more secure with that final tuck.Finally, in sailing with others, I keep finding people that throw half hitches (tucks) immediately and I certainly make sure I tell them the little story I told in my previous post.